Just piss off wil ya.
Take your tables with ya as well.
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Calm down itâs not worth itâŚ
A: wasting my time by answering trolls and no lives who waste their time talking politely and philosophically about balance in an old game, but with no real arguments to back it up.
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A few things to keep in mind:
- Mirco is twisting my post to Fluffy and ignoring context. In it, I was replying to a Necro expert who put forth a reasonable argument about his own class. I was not, and have never, advocated for nerfs to classes I donât play. All I said was that his suggestions, given his level of expertise, seem spot-on.
- Balance is useless on its own. Itâs a pipe dream. Every Season, one or two builds are super strongâsometimes even OP. If thatâs Barb this Season, embrace it and have fun. If itâs not your thing, donât ask for nerfs, because youâre taking away from the fun others might enjoy.
- Regarding point 2, the fact that there are one or two extra strong builds every Season does not in any way make the game less fun for you. It doesnât take anything from you. Fun Police have no argument.
- Details about D4 have leaked and weâre likely to get a lot more post Blizzcon. If Barbs get a super OP season in the sun, we deserve it and itâs long overdue.
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I hope you enjoy being the most hated forum poster by barbs along all the others who love nerfs so much if Blizz actually nerfs WW Rend, cause thatâs what youâll end up withâŚ
Asking for a nerf to a build that hasnât been tested for more than 6 days on live servers is just acting like a 1st class âdbagââŚ
Most builds that were nerfed were at least tested on live servers with some minor exeptions like the crusader build few years agoâŚ
Asking to nerf a class that never had a build capable of clearing a GR140 even by the 1% of the playerbase is completely unfair to barbs or any other classes that were taking dust far behind all the ones that could clear a 140 GR or highier and never even made it to the META as a Damage dealerâŚ
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What I find funny is the sense of self importance these guys have. They talk about it like theyâre doing a great thing, like itâs relevant for society or something. All these beautiful sentences formulated to hide the vacuum of pi$$ and sh!t with the whole purpose of securing the âmost powerful classâ status.
Bug off, will ya?! Youâre not important, youâre not doing a difference. Youâre just a snowflake being an dbag
This is the literal definition of a double standard.
âJust because there are a few super strong OP builds does not make the game and other weaker builds less fun. Oh and now please buff my favorite builds because if they are not strong enough I canât have fun with them.â
EDIT: Although I would like to see much better balance, I donât really care about if Barbs are being super strong this season, but I donât like that you guys try to defame people who wanna have (reasonable) balance.
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No, itâs an admission of the state of the game.
In an ideal world, would all builds across all classes be within relative âbalanceâ? Maybe. That tends to produce unexciting, if fair, gameplay. Remember, in a PvM game, fairness is not really the most important factor here.
But we donât live in that ideal world, mah dude. The CG Teamâs resources and time are limited. Weâll never get all classes in equilibrium. The only reasonable thing to do is work to get what you love buffed to the place you want it. Thatâs precisely what we did with the Barb Buff Proposal, and thatâs precisely what weâre getting.
So, you take what you can get.
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Clueso, are you still trying to say that if a class doesnât have all of their builds strong, than they shouldnât have any build strong?
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Again, you yourself said that the devs have limited resources, so why should they buff at least dozens of builds to the level of the top builds when they just could nerf a few OP builds which then would have the effect that instead of 3 or 4 builds being the best ones, you suddenly had letâs say 20 builds at the top? And that would be done with significantly less effort than to buff everythingâŚ
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I get it now. The idea of communism. Blizz the (governing force) should limit every class and every build to the same level. Remove any and all build diversity, power diversity, creativity, competition, and quite literally incentive to do anything.
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Because those arenât buffs. You donât get to twist the definitions of words to make them mean what you want.
You donât take food off everyoneâs plate, then tell them that they got buffed to all have the same amount.
GR 140 is the current bar. Weâve seen most classes hit it or come very, very close in non-Season play. Barbs and Monks have, until now, been excluded. Now Barbs have finally achieved some level of cross-class balance, even if it is with only 1 spec.
Unlike you, we donât wall want to clear GR 100 with all the builds in the same amount of time.
In an ideal world, all our builds would get elevated to be within +/- 3 GRs of one another based on the top performing build, but even then, you have to remember that 2 of those builds rely on gimmicky wall-charging, and 2 of the builds are HOTA, even if theyâre radically different. Barbs have so many problems with their items that itâs never all going to be solved. Our proposal solved almost all of them, but obviously we were never going to get everything.
The best weâre ever going to get is Band-Aids. Letâs make sure theyâre the biggest, most powerful Band-Aids ever.
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Couldnât agree moreâŚ
Some people donât get that by nerfing the most powerful build you actually lower the highiest possible GR you can clear in the game.
If a build allows to max clear a 140 GR than if you nerf it youâll be lucky to do a 130-135 GR max just to match the underperforming classesâŚ
Instead of aiming highier and actually progress in clearing highier GRs in game you lower the maximum GR we can clear just to match the worse buildsâŚ
Just brilliantâŚ
Games are about progressing after dedicatiing houndreds of hours into them, not being stuck for years without any chance of progression or beating the strongest boss or end game contentâŚ
If you deny players to advance to the highiest GR out there after years of playing than most players will just quit and play a different game insteadâŚ
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No, not really.
I have absolutely not problem with there being builds that are âthe strongestâ and I understand that there is a need for âthe strongestâ builds, since there are players who specifically wanna play those kinds of builds.
The issue is that, although here is no problem with âbest buildsâ, that is only true as long the best builds are not significantly stronger than âaverageâ builds. Why? because if you make the strongest builds too strong, you could say that âit takes away the fun away from peopleâ, since now their âaverageâ builds sucks.
And that ironically would make you âThe Fun Policeâ.
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Of course, that is what nerfing does, but you act as if that would be innately a bad thingâŚ
That is what season are for.
It seems like you do not understand a fundamental game mechanic of ARGPâs and many other games. There is a definitive end. Even in Diablo 2. Once you had all the best gear, your character wouldnât get stronger in any way, since it has reached the top. And that is okay. And once that is done, you start a new season. And that works fine.
What you want to do is just creating the illusion of progress but not actual progress.
Thatâs not actually how communism works. Letâs keep the discussion focused.
Obviously, in an ideal game environment, what youâre describing sounds great. Butâand I keep repeating thisâyou are not accepting the reality of D3.
The Reality
- Per class, 1 or 2 builds are much stronger than others
- GR 140 is the new bar for solo pushes
- GR 150 is the bar for group pushes
That right there? Thatâs the game that exists. The one you keep talking about only exists in your head.
You nerf folks to prevent point one, you nerf the classâs potential, period.
Work for buffs for builds and classes you want. Never work for nerfs.
Powercreep is a false dichotomyâthere is no either/or. In a game where DPS is based on weapon damage and layered multipliers, a game where the only end-game content is based on scaling difficulty per tier and ranked by time, a game where certain types of damage output are better suited to the aforementioned end-game environment, there is only one direction to go. Powercreep isnât a problem or a symptom. Itâs literally built into the bedrock of the game.
You donât have to like it, but for the love of Sting, get over it and stop asking for nerfs of any kind.
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I guess itâs more like âwill I mind my own business, or will Iâll be a pain in the a of the barb community?â
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The thing is barbs never ask for nerfs to other classes. That is why the buff requests. So nerfing strong classes in the name of balance is off limits for barbs.
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Oh really? I thought D2 LoD ends with killing Baal on Hell or doing uber runs⌠
Besides ubers or the event where you sell SoJ to spawn Uber Diablo, the hardest monster to beat was 99 level Baal on hell, yet guess what, you could even SOLO him on ladders and you didnât have to wait years to do it and how many players can SOLO a 150 GR Guradian in D3 RoS?
If you canât clear a GR eventually than the whole GR system is pointlessâŚ
Leaderboards are there so you can compete against each other in clearing the highiest GRs possible⌠If youâre limited to just 130-140 GR for solo clears, than most players will get borred and stop playing the gameâŚ
Everyone always wants to beat his own personal best record and tries to reach the highiest possible GR in game, so GR150 should be also allowed to be completed even if only by the most dedicated players in game with highiest paragon and best itemsâŚ
Whether itâs like how it works or not, that doesnât change the fact that lowering the bar from 140 to 135 GR or lower to match the weakest builds is just beyond ridiculousâŚ
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Read my post again: I didnât say that nerfing the OP top builds is a buff. It obviously is a nerf and I never called it differently.
You still didnât address my argument. How can you say that the devs only have a limited amout of resources and that people who play other classes shall ask for buffs (which would mean that at elast a fe dozen builds had to get buffed), when nerfing a few OP buids could do something similar with significantly less effort?!
And how bad that must feel for the 5+ other Barbarin specs that continue to suckâŚ
I understand that, but what I am talking about has nothing to do with specific changes for Barbarians, but it is regarding the philosophy/the idea of âAlways Buff, Never Nerfâ that a lot of advocate for and that you are trying to defame and badmouth people who desire a more balanced state of the game.
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