I strongly suspect that the developers learned from the PTR and its feedback that there were concerns about how weak the new sets were for monks & crusader and the strength of the ww/rend build. They looked over their data and came to decision about the revised numbers on the items/sets.
The idea that the developers are actively trying to disenfranchise any one class seems incredibly unrealistic to me. Also, I can not imagine a scenario where the developers strictly relied on the feedback of a single forum user or one playerās GR clear. When I objectively looked at the data, I thought a reduction of the rend damage on lamentation to 100% was appropriate. Apparently, the developers with more comprehensive data analytics disagreed with my assessment and removed the rend damage bonus from lamentation entirely.
@Seiya,
Although the new forum does not have an integrated ignore function, you may find this thread helpful for a work-around.
You and your fellow nerf buddies are like pestilence you destroy everything you come in contactā¦
Instead of providing meaningful feedback to help barbs youāre on a crusade to destroy them, cause you suck at playing with them.
Guess what I may be bad at other classes too and donāt like a lot of other classes builds that I donāt play, yet I donāt come to the forum asking for nerfs with tables and graphs, just to prove Iām right and ruin the fun for others, cause Iām obsessed with balanceā¦
No way of knowing until the final patch notes are released. Back when PTRās would last more than a week, they would have several passes of nerfs, buffs, more nerfs, more buffs to try different values and see what worked best. One week PTRās are not long enough to get realistic information, but at least there is a 2nd iteration of this PTR (no idea if it will be a public PTR or if it was just for the BlizzCon floor).
Out of curiosity, where did they say this 2nd pass at the PTR was a final version of the patch?
Your graphs are spot on, but your analysis on necro is inaccurate. The reason the necro has such an odd curve is 2 fold
thorns necro is the only necro build that can go over 130ish (maybe a lon mage can do 130? Highest Iāve seen is 120 in season) - very few players push with thorns because it is hard to gear for and extremely extremely fishy.
many people use the necro for rat run meta to gain paragon but donāt push with it (hence 1k spot on season right now on necro LB is a sub two minute clear of gr 100 - obviously not pushing)
So with thorns nerfed necro may very well be one of the weakest solo push classes. Not that I think thereās anything wrong with that, given their state in the meta.
What they did say at blizzcon is that there will be no second round of ptr testing. Not sure if this will be final patch notes. I am hoping they revert the rend nerf after our comments. Rat runs were about equal to ww runs. But with nerf itās back to rats.
Iām predicting necros lose 8 grs without thorns being the push meta. As a necro main, I say good riddance to that build though, miserable to play and if you wanted to push into the top 50 you basically had to pay it even though it was based off a broken mechanic and ludicrous fishing
Necro mechanics IMO is just wrong. Their clear potential distribution is so weird. They are both low and top performer. Very very strange. Thorn nerf we will see how it will look.
At 1.6k paragon I got a 115 clear with lon mage necro and came within 20-30 seconds of gr 116 some fishing. Granted Iām not the best player my paragon were on the low end compared to most players around that gr (with many substantially higher). Next season will be interesting for necro. Lon mages will be able to take advantage of the season buff decently I think.
And I think the main mechanic/build youāre thinking is weird are the corpse lance build variants? If so, those arenāt really the top pushers right now and predominantly used for speed farming, though you can push with them the meta right now is lon mages which is more consistent damage output than lancer builds.
They really do need to revert this bs nerf. Wtf is the point of buffing a class just to revert it back to where it was. Why the heck cant you start small and work your way up if needed with a nerf. Like perhaps instead of lamentation buffing it 200% drop it to 150 first and try that. But no lets just revert it to the same pos it was before bc people who probably never played barb and didnt know how bad it was say its op get their way. Do you not realize barb has been BOTTOM tier for like the past 15or more seasons. Suddenly theyre brought to wiz levels and the nerf train starts. Why must you crush a class that has needed love for years and years. I am so gd sick of having to play wiz to be competitive and they are still kings even after their nerf. Barb nerf was completely unjustified and i sincerely hope you devs 2nd guess your decision here bc you always go too far. Peeps ask for an inch and you always take a mile. You couldve easily tweaked it to keep the haters happy and the fans of it satisfied but no you just had to gut the whole dam thing. Yet you wonder why fans are beginning to hate your corporation and cancel their subscriptions. Ive been a huge fan since i was 13 yrs old playing d1. I would walk 2 miles everyday to use the computers at a college campus near my house to take advantage of the cable internet bc then we only had dial up. The amount of love i have lost for you all at blizzard over the years is rediculous. I have 0 faith in you all at this point and it breaks my heart bc i have been a longtime dedicated fan playing every single game youve ever released. But these days you take things too far and my faith and trust in you is gone. I am so disapointed in the devs and in this nerf i dont even wanna touch next season now. Hope you think things through more thoroughly in the future.
Wizards are being nerfed. Starpact is gone, though I think only a small subset of players actually used it to push with solo. Vrytodos obviously received a slight nerf, but since the mechanism of the Nerf is hidden it isnāt obvious if it got further nerfed at blizzcon ā something to note is that the d3 2.6.7 demos were all on console, meaning a lot of the steamers that we are getting our info from were testing the changes on an unfamiliar platform with characters that werenāt their own and with time constraints (note: console does have some difference to PC players other than just controls and skill mapping - such as the importance of keeping nephalim glory up at all times). So while some changes are obvious, some changes like vrytodos might have been impossible to really tell with if anybody even bothered to spend their time testing it.
Sorry, but your table cannot be used like that.
You compare i.e. a class with 4000 Paragon avg. with a class with 2500 avg. Paragon and then say the 4000 Paragon class is too strong? Are you serious?
IF you want to compare the classes then you have to consider the same base (Paragon, Gear, Augments, Gem-Level, Clear-time). THEN you can do a FAIR comparison.
But I learned thatās not what Barbs do. Most of the times they reduce it to the ONE Barb who did a 140 with 10.000 Paragon (non-season, buffed, PTR) compared to the 143 of ONE wizard with 5xxx Paragon (season, not nerfed yet; live). You always use a base that makes your class look weaker as it is.
Letās take fresh season on PTR for example. There the Barb was definetly OP. I did a 90 with my DH with ~600 Paragon on the PTR where the Barb did a 110 in the same time with worse gear and same Paragon. Would that be fair? Or not OP? Just with a fresh start where on day 2 you start grinding Paragon - a 20 level GR gap? Even the wizard did āonlyā a 100 in the same time.
But in my point of view and when reading all the discussions the most Barbs will only stop crying when they are 50 GR levels above all others and the meta is 4 x DMG Barb.
To be clear:
I donāt want ANY class to be OP. So the Wiz nerf was definetly also needed and when I read it right the Bazooka Wiz will finally also get nerfed.
Why nerf 1 class instead of buffing all others?
Very simple. I donāt believe Blizzard has the ressources to buff/adjust all classes to one Level (Ā±3 maybe) once and for all at a time. So they buff one class after another and I would feel sorry for the class that is last. They would have to wait 7 seasons until their class will shine.
