That would be a huge dmg boost to an already very viable option? We didn´t have the feeling that this one needs any modification since it is already solid all around. Sorcs doesn´t need to be buffed at all also. Only minus cold res would probably help windy druids. But those are also solid.
Why would you see that in particular? Any niche builds we need to dicuss further?
Making things easy on the Devs isn’t our job. They get PAID to do what they do while we do not. Anyways, I set out to try and balance the Elite Sets on All Resistance. All Elite Sets have 50 to All Resistance when complete. Overall though they currently have the following:
Tal Rasha: 105/105/138/65
Trang-Oul: 88-95/120/100/130
Natalya: 60-70/75-95/75-95/85-95
M’avina: 100/100/100/100
Immortal King: 118/90/121/100
Griswold: 100/100/100/100
Aldur: 90-100/90-100/90-100/50
That’s why on Natalya I proposed adding 25 Fire to the Boots as partial set bonus while making it a flat 25 on CL respectively(turning them into godly Tri-Resist Boots and bringing it in line with Poison on Chest Armor or 85-95 across the board with full Set), I added 50 Poison Resistance to Aldur Armor(to shore up that element) and I added 40 Poison to Tal Armor(3-piece) to bring that element up to par. Overall, my proposals bring All Resistance to 85-105 depending on the Class Set.
As for Griswold, +2 Defensive auras is just fine on the Armor. Overall, the Set currently gets +5 to Paladin skills, which is generally in-line with the other Class Sets. What I had proposed for Griswold was to buff each individual piece, utilizing much of what you have above.
Helm: Add Fire + Light Absorb for 3 items and Complete Set respectively(2 item bonus is +2 Offensive Auras)
Chest: Add +5 to Cold Resistance cap(2 items), +5 to Fire Resistance cap(3 items), +5 to Light Resistance cap(Complete Set). Modify +Defense to 110% Enhanced Defense(makes upgrading to Sacred Armor far more impactful)
Weapon: Change 3-piece and Complete Set bonus to +20% Faster Cast Rate on both(40% overall)
Shield: Add +1 Paladin Skills, Add 20% Faster Hit Recovery(2 Items), 20% Faster Run/Walk(3 Items) and Can Not Be Frozen(Complete Set)
As for Vampire FCR breakpoints, you’d have to modify the breakpoints for the Monster itself(at least that’s how I’d first look to fix the FCR bug). If that happens to work, then adding FCR to Trang-Oul is not as mandatory of an issue since you’ll be closer to Human form or have the breakpoints of being Human while making Vampire Monsters a bit more deadly given their faster cast rates. However, I must point out that people who use Trang-Oul typically do so with Poison in mind given the Sets benefits towards that element. As a result, they likely won’t be using Hoto(or any weapon with FCR like Wizspike(50 FCR)) but Death Web for its Enemy Poison Resistance and that has ZERO FCR on it. Therefore, the most FCR you could hope to get as a Trang-Oul Necromancer is 60.
That’s WHY I advocate for adding FCR, if only to bring it closer to other caster sets like Tal Rasha(which has 50 currently, proposing 60 on it with +10 FCR on Helm as Complete Set bonus), Griswold(proposing 40 on Weapon) and Aldur(which is getting 30 on Weapon in my proposal). Bringing Trang-Oul to 40 - 60 FCR(from 20) would be the target objective as I see it along with addressing the Fire OSkills which I give a nice -25% Enemy Fire Resistance on Helm when Set is complete. Combined with Lower Resist Curse, a Trang-Oul Necromancer could be looking to get -75(or more) to Enemy Fire Resistance(-160 or more with Infinity Merc), thereby allowing those Fire skills to deal some decent damage. I’m open to buffing them but in the age of Sunder Charms, I think -Resistance would be a better way of doing things than massively increasing their level.
As for the Ormus proposal, that would be nerfing Cold Sorceress more than anything while buffing the snot out of Fire/Light as it’d be another source of -Resistance they can tap into(along with another Facet). Cold doesn’t need that thanks to Cold Mastery. What they need is %Cold Skill and outside of Ormus, Death Fathom and Nightwing, the most they could hope to get(with perfect rolls mind you) is 75%(not factoring in Jeweler Monarchs with 4 Facets).
With that in mind, I have some Unique proposals:
Snowclash: Add +10-15% Cold Skill Damage ← Frostmaidens + Cold Sorcs would love this
Boreas’ Touch: Elite Bramble Mitts ← New Unique
126 Defense
50 Strength Requirement
Required Level: 67
+100% Enhanced Defense
Adds 147-262 Cold Damage
Can Not Be Frozen
Slow Target 20%
+10-15% Cold Skill Damage
-20% Enemy Cold Resistance
Thought of some gloves that yield unique Slow while granting solid Cold Skill perks, including rare -Enemy Resistance for Frostmaidens. It does lack IAS for them but I think they’d take that over what the Gloves yield. Similarly Cold Sorcs would consider using this, although it does lack FCR(which is a trade-off).
Oh and one more idea off the top of my head to round out this long post. I’ve been contemplating proposing that Gloves, Belts and Boots should be able to roll with Sockets. Now I know you’re thinking I’m crazy but hear me out. Magic/Rare variants would get Mechanic or 1-2 Sockets while Set/Uniques are limited to just one and can only be added via Larzuk. Similarly Larzuk can add Sockets to Normal/Magic/Rare but can only yield 1 in doing so(hence hoping a Rare/Magic rolls with Mechanic property would be gold). Finally, Gloves would take on properties of Weapons, Belts would yield Armor results and Boots would yield Off-Hand or Shield results. Meaning an Um rune in a Boot would give 22 All Resistance. Similarly, you can plop a Nef rune into Gloves to gain Knockback on 20 IAS Gloves or a Shael rune to get 40% IAS Gloves. You can do a Shael rune into a Belt to get 20% FHR or a Cham rune for CBF. The options are endless and I haven’t even mentioned three more sockets for Rainbow Facets.
According to Arreat Summit, it is a bug that has not been fixed on Trang-Oul’s Avatar.
Note: wearing this set will increase casting delay resulting in slower casting (even with fast cast items). This is a bug and has been reported.
https://classic.battle.net/diablo2exp/items/sets/sets7.shtml#trangouls
I tend to agree with Necromant that Ormus’ Robes is already a very solid option; however, maybe it could benefit from adding 2 OS and buff random skill to include Sorceress Skills not currently available as to improve prohibitively rare item by variance…
Ormus’ Robes
Dusk Shroud
Defense: 371-487
Required Level: 75
Required Strength: 77
+10-20 Defense
+20% Faster Cast Rate
+10-15% To Cold Skill Damage
+10-15% To Fire Skill Damage
+10-15% To Lightning Skill Damage
+3 To Random Sorceress Skill (Sorceress Only)
Regenerate Mana 10-15%
I know it has been considered a bug and is on Arreat Summit, but as far as I know it has been always intentionally and just different BPs for vampiere form. And it defenitely changes with higher FRC-items.
First two hits on google for “Trang-oul bug Breakpoint”
Add https (why cant I include regular links or better how can I?
://diablo2.diablowiki.net/Breakpoints
And different BPs is what I based my thoughts on.
This change is more reasonable imho.
Ormus was always a very good niche item. In that given niche is was then BIS. With sunder charm it becomes even better since you don´t have the need to go dual element sorc. Adding the lvl 30 skills would be not crazy. But then you increase the number of possible rolls again on this item with already vast rolls. So in conjunction with that I would consider removing the lvl 1 skills instead. But I still doubt that a masterie Ormus would be used especially the cold masterie version. You want that +3 skills to your main attack - allways.
Last time I played an Ormus was on a fireball sorc (with FF, Echutas, Phoenix etc.), That is already crazy stong. With another facet that would even be more crazy.
So back to my original hypothesis. We don´t need to buff Sorcs power lvl (since she´s already too strong in every element tree and most builds work very decent and are viable (ecxept maybe inforno and blaze - but a second facet doesn´t change that, you still go Meteor, Blizz or Lightning). So I wouldn´t thouch it. Lvl req ist with 75 also okay. 
That´s not how it works. I guess you know that. They are not generating big NEW money on D2R (an add-on might do that, but not some ordinary balance change patches). And since we´re not talking about bug fixing (balance changes doesn´t help marketing really much if it is not like with Cyberpunkt an complete rework of previously not working features). So I would still focus an changes not to crazy to implement and test for the quality assurance team
So, I try to follow your step (but tbh having problems to follow in your plain text). 
I have two problems with your starting point already. First I think not all sets should have the same Quality of life lvl and should not be the same of the core attributes. At the end the purpose fo this thread is making alternatives viable. To be viable the need to provides benefits (like filling a gab somewhere).
Nat´s boots for example. If you would add fire res to this already very solid +40FRW (!) boots if rolled nicely would make moste of other options irrelevant?
30 FRW, Tris res boots? => not needed anymore
Aldurs? Why would I use those if I get already 25% fire res on Nats along the other high res?
I could support limiting the rolls of both rest from 15-25 to 20-25% or so. They are not super common, that would increase the number of actually better ones with 2x%/2X%. Found 4 so far. Only one wos with more then 20% each.
But making them the super GG BIS for all item. Please not! And it is filling no gaps, doens´t make new builds possible etc.
But why do you want that? Nats doesn´t need res at all. Thats what “Fade” is for (already +50% with lvl 8 fade)? The set is lacking AR and raw dmg output, but not resists. Or am I missing something here?
True, but do you see Trang-Poison-Nova-builds in the wild really? I haven´t. It isn´t competetive. The 3p set? For sure! But you always combine that with other stuff if playing a poison necro.
So I would focus on making the set viable but for another build/purpose/niche. A necro firemancer (since the set can only be used with them). FCR will be at your weapon of choice in this case. So I still would opt for changeing the frames per BP (+3), add 10% more FCR on the 3p set bonus, change fire mastery from +3 to +20 (ish) and add -10% enemy fire res as full set bonus (maybe the -25% you suggested, but not sure yet). After PTR testing that might be modified further.
Totally agree on this one!
Currently we have this.
- Proposed Buffs:
- Add +5-10% Faster Cate Rate
- Add +15% Cold Resist
Adding also +cold skill dmg would be really thematic. But this is a sorc belt. Adding FRC to be less dependend on an Arach would make this belt for several cold sorc BP BIS. But adding another cold dmg would buff the already OP cold sorcs even more. So I don´t likte that to much. Could the frost maiden benefit from other items maybe in this case better? Maybe adding this to our buffed Gloom’s Trap belt instead?
I don´t think we see new uniques, but if so that could be an interesting one. I don´t like CBF on every item class but on this one I could learn to like it
But the -20% cold res is defenitely to much to add. It should not be tempting for sorc at all to use. So the CBF and the +15 cold skill dmg should be the only two attributes tempting sorcs. The rest should only be used by frost maidens and windy druids maybe.
DH Class Set overhaul ← I posted this awhile back but I’ll do it again. Read up on what I have for Natalya and other sets. I’ve been meaning to update it but haven’t gotten around to doing it but I have 25 Fire Resistance as 2-piece bonus for the boots. Meaning you’d have to wear the Helm, Chest or Claw to gain the benefit. How many players do you know who purposefully wear 2-piece Natalya aside from Assassins? The Helm isn’t even remotely useful for Mercenaries, and you’d give up +Skills/FCR for it. Chest is awful, particularly since you’d give up Fortitude/CoH/Enigma/Vipermagi for it and Claw can only be wielded by Assassins(this piece isn’t half bad but with Mosaic… oof). For the Attack Rating, see my thread.
As for Trang-Oul, I’ve made one myself and seen others in the wild. They’re extremely fun and deal decent Poison damage but are not as strong or mobile as 3-piece Poison Necromancers due to the use of Bramble/Enigma in Chest slot. Nowhere have I seen anyone purposefully use Trang-Oul for the Fire skills as they’re roughly on par with what a Fire Maiden can deal. Changing Fire Mastery from 3 to 20 would nearly double the power of the Fire Spells(1.4 multiplier to 2.6). Not sure they really need that but I’m open to it nonetheless.
For Snowclash, it doesn’t need FCR. Yeah its a Sorc Belt but same can be said of TGods and Amazons, yet people use it alot(particularly on Hardcore). Instead of what has been proposed, I wanted to add something that would be a trade-off. Namely in exchange for +1/20 FCR on Spider, I’d get +2 Blizz/+3 Glacial Spike and +10-15% Cold Skill(which I can’t get anywhere else in Belt slot). Cold Sorcs obviously would use it since they can still hit the 105 breakpoint while giving Frostmaidens and HF Paladins another source of +Cold Skill Damage besides Nightwing.
For the Unique gloves, CBF currently does not spawn on any Gloves(even Sets). M’avina presently has 20% Cold Skill as a Complete Set Bonus. These gloves don’t come close to that but also come with -Enemy Resistance, something Frostmaidens in particular would love to have(and is what I have in my M’avina overhaul). As for it being too tempting to use for Cold Sorc’s, its not the -Enemy Cold Resistance but the %Cold Skills that would cause them to use it but they’d have to forego 20 FCR to get it from the Glove slot.
Another general change I’d like to propose is the following below. What do you guys think?..
Poison Damage Application
Poison Damage is only applied in a Frame (1/25th of a second) if no other damage source is applied in that same Frame (only exception is Open Wounds). To improve consistency, other damage sources will no longer overwrite the application of Poison Damage, which includes your own attacks and abilities, allies, minions and mercenaries. As a potential solution, the developers could take the Bit Rate damage of a Poison Source and carry it over to the next available Frame to ensure your Poison Damage is maintained.
Agreed, how about we increase Fire Mastery to +15 to be same lvl as Meteor as follows?..
Trang-Oul’s Avatar
Agreed we should propose something for Natalya’s Odium. It’s clearly designed for Martial Arts Assassin, and we should add 2p bonus of Venom. Also, as this set lacks AR, it should be added for 2p and 3p bonus, along with minus enemy poison resist. For full set, add +2 to MA skills along with bonus to poison skill damage. Lastly, replace ITD with -100% Target Defense makes this set much more useable against champions and bosses…
Natalya’s Odium
At the very least, we could probably safely add 1-2 OS, and this opens more alternative uses for this armor (2 facets, 40/15 for javazon or vengeance, etc.). I agree we don´t need to buff Sorcs, but this change is fairly modest and adds more use cases for other classes and keeps identity intact…
Ormus’ Robes
Dusk Shroud
Defense: 371-487
Required Level: 75
Required Strength: 77
+10-20 Defense
+20% Faster Cast Rate
+10-15% To Cold Skill Damage
+10-15% To Fire Skill Damage
+10-15% To Lightning Skill Damage
+3 To Random Sorceress Skill (Sorceress Only)
Regenerate Mana 10-15%
Instead of adding FCR, I agree with DarkHelmet that adding bonus to Cold Skill Damage is not only thematic, but adds another option for Frostmaidens and HF Paladins. However, this bonus should be more modest with a range of +5-10% as follows…
Snowclash
Battle Belt
Defense: 98-116
Req Level: 42
Req Strength: 88
+130-170% Enhanced Defense
5% To Cast Level 7-19 Blizzard When Struck
+15 Cold Absorb
15% To Maximum Cold Resist
Adds 13-21 Cold Damage (3 sec. Duration)
+2 To Chilling Armor (Sorceress Only)
+2 To Blizzard (Sorceress Only)
+3 To Glacial Spike (Sorceress Only)
Going back to shields, not sure about increasing sockets on normal/exceptional shields, but what about a few elite shields as follows?..
| Maximum Sockets | Current | Improved |
|---|---|---|
| Luna Shield | 2 | 3 |
| Hyperion Shield | 3 | 4 |
Would like to test this. Not sure if it is strong enough with some facets, but could work.
But would you really change the FRC BPs that much? The set has a distinct “slower pace” with the “defense up while running” mechanic. I would not align complete with the necro BPs?
That would be fine for Ormus. Would bring it a little more on par with the BIS options without going beyond! 
That would be ok and could work. I wont be BIS but a lot more fun to play the game with than now.
That would be fine, thematic and will work. So agree to this.
But I really would love to have a second FRC option without skills, less FCR and a little bit more accessible. Increasing the need to use Arach (even if it will be in most case clearly better). Maybe adding 10 FCR on Nightsmoke instead of the proposed +30 Defense vs. Missiles and we could increase mana to +40 without beeing crazy?
- Proposed Buffs:
- Add +30 Defense vs. Missiles
- Change Mana to +30
The increase for Luna doesn´t do anything. Enabling to roll Spirit with even less strength (-29 points) and therefore even earlier is something I would not like to see. Needing a Monarch, nerfing Spirit and it is not super balanced but far more in line.
On the other hand I still would suggesting limiting normal and execeptional pally shields to 3 OS instead of 4?
Any thoughts on this one?
Would you be so kind to add this? And maybe, if you´ve time, divide the list to weapons and armors (since its kind a log already)?
This as well on Dragonscale. Thx
Agreed. How about we add +5-10% FCR to Nightsmoke as shown below?..
Nightsmoke
Belt
Defense: 22-24
Req Level: 20
Req Strength: 25
+30-50% Enhanced Defense
+15 Defense
+20 To Mana
All Resist +10
Damage Reduced By 2
50% Damage Taken Goes to Mana
Agreed. If nobody has any objections, we could reduce the normal and execeptional pally shields to 3 OS instead of 4…
| Maximum Sockets | Current | Amended |
|---|---|---|
| Targe | 4 | 3 |
| Rondache | 4 | 3 |
| Heraldic Shield | 4 | 3 |
| Aerin Shield | 4 | 3 |
| Crown Shield | 4 | 3 |
| Akaran Targe | 4 | 3 |
| Akaran Rondache | 4 | 3 |
| Protector Shield | 4 | 3 |
| Gilded Shield | 4 | 3 |
| Royal Shield | 4 | 3 |
For CoH, the most apt comparison is Enigma since these armors provide similar bonuses. As Enigma already has FRW, I would rather keep DtD as it feels thematic with HS.
Will do, once we agree on these items above, I’ll make the next update. 
This redesign idea for Famine is from Maahes, and thought it was cool idea to buff the various elemental damage along with adding Hunger and Werewolf as oskills, which is fitting for the name and also gives a use case for Barbarians using this RW with Wolfhowl…
Famine
Fal Ohm Ort Jah
Required Level: 65
Axes, Hammers
30% Increased Attack Speed
+320-370% Enhanced Damage (Ohm)
Ignore Target’s Defense (Jah)
Adds 180-200 Magic Damage
Adds 50-200 Fire Damage
Adds 51-250 Lightning Damage (Ort)
Adds 50-200 Cold Damage
12% Life Stolen Per Hit
Prevent Monster Heal
+10 To Strength (Fal)
That might work. Not super great, but it is not that rare so finding a perfect +10 FRC could be worth keeping in your stash. So we have Lenymo with 3-5%, Nightsmoke with 5-10% and Arach with +20%. For Lenymo you would always need a 10 FRC Ring starting at lvl 6 to be usefull. Nightsmoke with a ring makes the second BP for all classes available. Good!
Not everybody will like that, but I think that is super appropriate!
Ok agree! Then I would come back to my proposal from mid August to put it in a little better spot but not changing it in therms of affixes at all an thus the overall power lvl.
Increasing existing rep life from 7 to 35 or even 50? And nothing else. Would also easy to implement and not confuse market with different affixes. We could make it roll with +/- 5 (so like 30-40 or 45-55) and have at least some kind of RNG into it.
Would support this. Looks cool and super thematic. Not sure it that would make non Druid-wolf builds viable. But the added elemental dmg helps for sure. Not cheap as well, so why not!
As I look at Famine… did anyone else notice that it violates the attribute limit or am I dreaming?
30% Increased Attack Speed ← 1
+320-370% Enhanced Damage (Ohm) ← 2(Ohm = 50% Enhanced Damage)
Ignore Target’s Defense (Jah)
Adds 180-200 Magic Damage ← 3
Adds 50-200 Fire Damage ← 4
Adds 51-250 Lightning Damage (Ort) ← 5(Ort only 1-50 Lightning Damage)
Adds 50-200 Cold Damage ← 6
12% Life Stolen Per Hit ← 7
Prevent Monster Heal ← 8
+10 To Strength (Fal)
Anyone else care to explain how that can be and why Blizzard would violate it since 1.10? XD Bramble violates it too if I’m not mistaken(possibly others but I’m too lazy to look).
Edit Also, I have a thought regarding Physical and Magic Sunder Charms. As they are, they flatly suck and given that Sunder Charms are unlikely to ever be removed from the game, I figure that these two in particular are worthy of note given that Physical is typically easy to remove(Lawbringer or an Amplify Wand being the most obvious) while Magic is irrelevant given how infrequent Magic happens to be and that it CANT be lowered. Furthermore, you can’t easily resolve the penalty(especially for Magic…)
So I had this in mind…
Physical
Enemy Physical Resistance set to 50 ← Curses work at 20% effectiveness, hence most you can do is 70% of your normal damage output against Sundered Enemies(massive improvement from 25% as we have now). Damage Taken increased 10-15% ← Shako, CoA, Vamp Gaze, SS or SoE/Verdungo Belt(or 2 Ber’s) covers the penalty.
Magic
Enemy Magic Resistance Set to 50 ← Can’t lower it, hence 50% damage is better than 5% we have now. Magic Damage dealt reduced by 10-20%. ← Instead of increasing the amount of Magic Damage taken(which cannot be mitigated save for Crafted Safety Shields granting 5-10% Magic Resistance), I propose instead that Magic Damage dealt is reduced as a consequence. Meaning in exchange for never having to worry about enemy immunity ever again, you merely deal 10-20% less Magic Damage. Which on a Hammerdin(after my proposed Nerfs) would be ~5k fully geared from 5.5k. Similarly Bone Necro’s would go from 4k Bone Spear to ~3.5k on a good roll. Obviously this one is the more radical suggestion but if you think about it, its actually logical to nerf Offensive output given how OP Magic builds can be.
I updated OP based on previous discussion:
Dragonscale
Zakarum Shield
Defense: 523-582
Req Level: 80
Req Strength: 142
+170-200% Enhanced Defense
Adds 211-371 Fire Damage
+15% To Fire Skill Damage
+10 To Hydra
+5% To Maximum Fire Resist
+15-25 To Strength
Fire Absorb 10-20%
Ormus’ Robes
Dusk Shroud
Defense: 371-487
Required Level: 75
Required Strength: 77
+10-20 Defense
+20% Faster Cast Rate
+10-15% To Cold Skill Damage
+10-15% To Fire Skill Damage
+10-15% To Lightning Skill Damage
+3 To Random Sorceress Skill (Sorceress Only)
Regenerate Mana 10-15%
Snowclash
Battle Belt
Defense: 98-116
Req Level: 42
Req Strength: 88
+130-170% Enhanced Defense
5% To Cast Level 7-19 Blizzard When Struck
+15 Cold Absorb
15% To Maximum Cold Resist
Adds 13-21 Cold Damage (3 sec. Duration)
+2 To Chilling Armor (Sorceress Only)
+2 To Blizzard (Sorceress Only)
+3 To Glacial Spike (Sorceress Only)
Nightsmoke
Belt
Defense: 22-24
Req Level: 20
Req Strength: 25
+30-50% Enhanced Defense
+15 Defense
+20 To Mana
All Resist +10
Damage Reduced By 2
50% Damage Taken Goes to Mana
Immortal King
Trang-Oul’s Avatar
Natalya’s Odium
Famine
Fal Ohm Ort Jah
Required Level: 65
Axes, Hammers
30% Increased Attack Speed
+320-370% Enhanced Damage (Ohm)
Ignore Target’s Defense (Jah)
Adds 180-200 Magic Damage
Adds 50-200 Fire Damage
Adds 51-250 Lightning Damage (Ort)
Adds 50-200 Cold Damage
12% Life Stolen Per Hit
Prevent Monster Heal
+10 To Strength (Fal)
Charged Items
Charged Items automatically slowly recharge by adding 1 charge every 20 seconds.
Poison Bit Rate Damage
Poison Damage is only applied in a Frame if no other damage source is applied in that same Frame (exception Open Wounds). To improve consistency, other damage sources will no longer overwrite application of Poison Damage, which includes your own abilities, minions, and mercs. As a potential fix, the developers could take the Poison Bit Rate Damage and carry over to the next available Frame so Poison Damage is maintained.
| Weapons - Max Sockets | Current | Improved |
|---|---|---|
| Battle Dart | 0 | 1 |
| War Dart | 0 | 1 |
| Francisca | 0 | 1 |
| Hurlbat | 0 | 1 |
| Francisca | 0 | 1 |
| Flying Knife | 0 | 1 |
| Winged Knife | 0 | 1 |
| Flying Axe | 0 | 1 |
| Winged Axe | 0 | 1 |
| Poignard | 1 | 2 |
| Bone Knife | 1 | 2 |
| Rondel | 1 | 2 |
| Mithril Point | 1 | 2 |
| Hatchet | 2 | 3 |
| Tomahawk | 2 | 3 |
| Cudgel | 2 | 3 |
| Truncheon | 2 | 3 |
| Jo Staff | 2 | 3 |
| Walking Stick | 2 | 3 |
| Quarterstaff | 3 | 4 |
| Stalagmite | 3 | 4 |
| Lochaber Axe | 3 | 4 |
| Ogre Axe | 3 | 4 |
| War Spear | 3 | 4 |
| Hyperion Spear | 3 | 4 |
| Military Axe | 4 | 5 |
| Feral Axe | 4 | 5 |
| Battle Sword | 4 | 5 |
| Conquest Sword | 4 | 5 |
| Battle Hammer | 4 | 5 |
| Legendary Mallet | 4 | 5 |
| Knout | 5 | 6 |
| Scourge | 5 | 6 |
| Shields - Max Sockets | Current | Improved |
|---|---|---|
| Pavise | 3 | 4 |
| Ancient Shield | 3 | 4 |
| Blade Barrier | 3 | 4 |
| Mummified Trophy | 2 | 3 |
| Fetish Trophy | 2 | 3 |
| Sexton Trophy | 2 | 3 |
| Cantor Trophy | 2 | 3 |
| Hierophant Troph | 2 | 3 |
| Minion Skull | 2 | 3 |
| Overseer Skull | 2 | 3 |
| Hellspawn Skull | 2 | 3 |
| Succubus Skull | 2 | 3 |
| Bloodlord Skull | 2 | 3 |
Instead of limiting normal/exceptional pally shields to 3 OS, I think to keep within the spirit of this thread for buffing lackluster items, I think we should add Blade Barrier, Ancient Shield, and Pavise to the list of 4 OS shields, which means the following comparison:
True, Monarch would probably drop out as the shield of choice but adding the above three would give some differentiation.
If low STR req. is the most important thing, obviously Ancient Shield will be chosen. However, if you are making a max block build the Pavise is better, 23 more strength, but you save alot in DEX. And if you want higher defense that you get from an Elite shield, the Blade Barrier makes a good choice over Ancient Shield or Pavise. There is also the fact that Pavise reduces FRW by 10%, Ancient Shield by 5%, and Blade Barrier/Monarch by 0%. Lastly, we are proposing to nerf Spirit, so this is less of an issue and adds more options.
The fire, lightning, and cold damage are all one stat called “dmg-elem” with a minimum of 50 and max of 200.
Something interesting is that Famine has the “ethereal” stat but it doesn’t work, maybe they had the idea to tie in the theme of famine and have the item have “scarce” durability or something.
We had a deep discussion about 4OS for earlier shields. But one point I dind´t pay enough attention to. So would do that now again. Monarch hast 156 Str req but is a light shield (so no penalties apply to FRW and Stamina - anyway irrelevant at this point). I could see 1 or 2 exceptionals getting 4 OS in general (only because we nerf spirit and might limited normal an exceptional pally shields also to 3 OS).
A Pavise is a heavy shield so -10% FRW applies and str req is 133 (block on sorc is 44%).
That would be ok. Less strength, but FRW penalty.
But the Ancient shield has only a strength req. of 110 (!) and is medium (so only +5% FRW applies). The block on a sorc is only 8% lower (36%) than on a Pavis.
So that would be the new meta shield for all mainly for casters!
Same with Blade Barrier. Light shield like the Monarch but only 118 strength req and only 2% less block than a Monarch…
I personally would only go fo a Pavis. There you have a tradeoff for the much lower strength req. On Ancients you don´t. I would not include this one. Rather add a Hyperion but this as well has only a strength req of 127 (medium shield with 44% block on sorc).
Secondly anyone with reservation for limiting normal and exceptional Paladin shields to 3 OS? If not, I would like to as Charles to include those as well! Thanks for deviding the list! Better overview
Rest of the updates are all good! Thank you!
I agree that Pavise and Hyperion would be good alternatives for 4 os shields. I would also like to improve a few other shields as well…
| Shields - Max Sockets | Current | Improved |
|---|---|---|
| Defender | 1 | 2 |
| Barbed Shield | 2 | 3 |
| Luna | 2 | 3 |
| Pavise | 3 | 4 |
| Hyperion | 3 | 4 |
But you know what that means? You would not see casters with monarch anymore. They will all go to Hyperions instead. In my opinion only a good change if Spirit is nerfed simultaneously (+1 skill etc.). Then you would have old spirits in Monarchs and new spirits in Hyperions. That would be ok for me tbh.
So I would add a footnote to Hyperion:
*(only if Spirit RW is nerfed as proposed)
Right ?
Change lower shields with more sockets is fine with me.
I agree with adding a footnote for Hyperion as you mentioned. I’m curious what other people think on this issue?
On another note, what do you guys think about adding a few elite 3 socket wands/orbs?