Yrel, their leader, calls Grom her old friend. Right before she charges us with the rest of her army and presumably captures/kills him. Personally, I dont trust someone who forcibly converts/wages war with their friends.
The Iron Horde had no play in the lightbounds motives. Grom, while we may consider him a war criminal, obviously wasn’t held to that degree by the lightbound/Yrel… which were the people directly affected by him.
Their motives are to forcibly convert. Your argument boils down to “Yea the lightbound are evil, but I think the orcs deserve what they got”.
My rebuttal about brainwashing was in response to the above quote of about Illidan and his free will. That cinematic was so full of edgelord cringe all Illidan was missing was a trenchcoat, a katana and the line “Nothing personal, kid.”
Ah then perhaps I was unclear when I said take away his free will. I did not mean make him a puppet. I meant it was his choice to reject embracing the Light and that was not acceptable to the Naaru.
I think people here - myself included - got a bit sidetracked. Their join or die stance is wrong, but they have a point. I don’t think they should be written off as evil or irredeemable.
I understand you don’t agree with “join us or die.” The problem is that negative far outweighs any positives and the sheer presence of it makes any positive a direct result of the negative.
“Gang violence is gone! Because they either joined our group or died.”
“There’s no more backstabbing or power grabs! Because dissenting voices either unified in the overall goal - joining us - or died.”
“Conflicts between groups are over! Because they either joined us in our crusade or they died.”
Personally, I think the only way they can avoid being written off as evil or irredeemable is if there’s a splintering within the faction - one side remaining fanatical and the other denouncing (and even fighting against) those tactics.
In fact, there might even be an amusing commentary from the chrome dragon flight - “everywhere else in the multiverse, the lightbound are virtuous and good, but see what happened when Garrosh created this alternate universe by screwing with the timeline? Bam. Evil.”
All that aside I think there should be some parts of the Light that are oppressive. The Light only sees one path apparently and that is foundations itself for a fanatical branch that uses the Light as a tool of oppression as an opposite of how the Void can be liberating.
Not having just a black and white universe as far as cosmic forces is way more interesting and complex. Good and Evil may not be so black and white when it comes to the Light and the Void.
Blizzard could just go for The Horde Method and blame it on corruption or misleading. We could even have our second “Draenor is free!” moment with Yrel at the end.
Didn’t the AU literally collapse in on itself and cease to exist? Why does any of this matter? Does a literal non-existent world that no longer exists really warrant 2 entire threads dedicated to arguing back and forth over it? You’re not changing each others’ minds.
Maybe? It’s time-travel related so it’s pretty flimsy.
As far as the story (after WoD) goes, we find out that the Draenei and Orcs worked together to drive the remaining demons from Draenor and then lived alongside each other for years. Then the naaru started arriving in larger numbers and then compelled the Draenei to spread their influence. Some orcs converted, others were forced to join, others died. Similar treatment also happened to the Ogres. Decades later the planet began to die.
This whole backstory is found out during the Mag’har recruitment scenario during BfA. I emphasized the decades later part because Garrosh time-traveled to some time before the original Dark Portal (something like 30 years prior to our timeline). In BfA though we connected to Draenor at roughly the same point in time as our own in the main universe. So while a few years had passed since our little time-traveling jaunt, it had been something like 30 years on AU Draenor.
It’s possible that the +30 year AU Draenor is dying because of something involving timelines and time-travel shenanigans. The Mag’har blame the planet dying on the Lightbound, the Lightbound blame the Mag’har, and most players say “Wtf is Draenor?” (or blame it on being 3 expansions ago).
If it wasn’t clear in this post, I hate time travel as a plot device. I wish the first dungeon in Legion would’ve been something where we could go back in time and stop Garrosh from time-traveling therefore repairing the timeline and stopping the existence of the AU.
Maybe it would have been better if Yrel just said “We don’t trust the orcs not to attack us again and kill us all like last time. So this time we are converting them to light so we can live peacefully for sure.”
it’s not always Alliance posters but we can talk about how the Alliance is coded as imperialist and why some people are more inclined to choose Alliance and stay only Alliance as it’s a comfort zone for people with imperialistic views.
Reminder Warcraft 3 and WoW came out in the wake of 9/11 and the language of internment camps and immigration bans and waging wars of retaliation against Muslims writ large was in bipartisan agreement for the majority of the 2000s.
Warcraft 3 is older than Homeland Security and ICE.
