Yet, those same “randos” are the ones people complain that they dont get to see enough of, in game. Soooooo… is this an MMORPG or not??
Simply this: I’ve played since bc, ive tanked since bc in war, druid, and mostly dk, i’ve done my fair share of pug finder runs, raid bosses (mostly world) and this is what i’ve learned over the past 14 or so years.
- Tank leads the group but healer sets the pace
- Dps know their role and they know when they f up, just accept
they will still blame it on you. - pugs can be toxic at times, but its usually 1 or 2 players, and
almost always the fire mage… -_- - Above anything else dungeon runs are meant to be fun so if you
aren’t having fun with pug runs… don’t que.
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I’m the healer…ask me how much to pull…ty
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I assert my point, Healer sets the pace =)
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Yeah these days a lot of people seem to be impatient and would probably outright quit the game if it feels too slow. I personally am ok with a slow dungeon that is extremely hard and punishing for moving too fast.
I honestly think they should revisit the games older dungeons and rebalance them a bit to be a bit harder.
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Sad. Chatting in dungeons used to be fun.
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Actually it is the DPS that sets the pace, and no not just are they hitting hard enough?
DPS need to do more than their DPS rotation, they have interrupts, CC, defenses and self healing, are they using these to ensure the healer doesn’t get bogged down with spam healing?
Most importantly are the DPS just standing in the crap doing nothing but offensive spells while taking a ton of damage? That alone slows a dungeon down more than anything and if the DPS are just standing there not doing anything really useful things go wrong, no defenses, no self healing, no CC, not even moving.
And no matter how good the healer is there will be times you get 3-4 useless players who make it impossible to finish the dungeon. This is where the tank comes in and why a good one will always lead the team to a ‘win’, whatever that means to you, finish a dungeon or raid, finish on time, finish with a +3, a good tank can make this happen so long as the DPS can do at least bare minimum numbers required.
A good tank will ensure the right number of enemies are pulled, not to deal with the AOE cap, but for instance if I have a hunter, warlock, spriest and resto druid in ML I will not be pulling anymore than 1-2 packs at the start because we have no short interrupts but my own and will only end up getting CC’d by the enemies.
If I have melee DPS that don’t move out of the crap, I will move the pack of enemies and force the DPS to move to allow the healer to do something other than spam heal one person. It’s the same for ranged except harder, I need to possibly move further to force them to move, but it can be done.
Which packs a tank pulls in conjunction with other packs and the group setup you have and placement of those enemies is far, far more important than anything else that happens in this game, no matter how hard you hit, how well you are at avoiding stuff or how good your heals are, if the tank pulls the wrong 2 packs together for the group you have it’s game over.
Not only do we need to know all the dungeons, all the routes, all the enemies, which ones hit hard, do AOE, can be interrupted or need to be stunned, we need to know the CD’s on the DPS and healers and watch what spells they are using to know who has what defenses left, who has what interrupts or stuns.
On top of that we know need to know the M+ affixes and who can counter what with the group we have, like soothing a raging enemy, dispelling too many bursting stacks, who can hit faster and who is managing their resources better to deal with explosives easier, who has what AOE caps and when pushing higher keys be careful on the pulls based on those AOE caps.
Like I cannot pull 2 trouble packs with AOE caps because they are going to out DPS the DPS and force the healers hand which may not work, but I can can pull one trouble pack and 1-2 easier packs, maybe more if I had a warlock and spriest or balance druid because they have better AOE caps than others.
It’s a balancing act on par with the Cirque du Soleil when you want to tank well and yes, a good healer does make a world of difference, but a DPS who takes minimal damage just makes it a dream run. Couldn’t care less if you are hitting like a wet sock, if you take minimal damage and can stay alive it means we can keep up some sort of pace and get through dungeons much quicker.
Is Blood Boil capped at all?
I feel like I can pull 50 dudes and pop DRW and spam blood boil so freely.
When you constantly get berrated as a tank, you might just be doing something wrong.
I tank all the time, no one ever says a thing. I’m pretty far from perfect too.
Right now, stuff is just melting, just pull pack per pack. Mythic+ is trivial with the current scaling, you’ll time it without doing massive AoE pulls.
That complaints always odd to me. If a tank was doing little damage then their aggro hold will be GARBAGE
Everything is max capped at 20 or less for full damage effect. So if you have an ‘uncapped’ ability it will hit everything in the area, just do less damage per enemy when you start going past 20.
Mathematically it’s pointless to go past 20 since the damage is split, like if you kill 20 in one minute and hit at 100 damage per enemy, than pull 40 the damage is just halved for all 40 enemies meaning you will hit all 40, but do only 50 damage per instead of 100 per and it will just take 2 minutes instead of 1.
Tell that to raiders. You can sit on a raid boss and do 40K DPS while a DPS pulls 120K and still hold aggro. Tank abilities pull more aggro because they were never designed to pull massive DPS, but instead hold aggro, coordinate the enemies and the group and stay alive.
It’s always been an issue, with all the changes, the levelling, the borrowed powers (TD/EV/IS) and now the AOE cap, it’s always allowed tanks to push DPS into DPS levels. No tank should be allowed to pull 50 enemies, do more DPS than the DPS, stay alive longer than everyone and out heal the healer, what’s the point of the other roles if this is the case?
Just make us all tankier and let us run 5 man DPS. People are already running 5 man tank runs on beta and no doubt Blizzard are going to nerf tanks to the point they will literally do zero DPS even for the best of us and than we are screwed.
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This is why the AoE cap is a freaking horrible idea, with differences in the in how it is applied. It should either be the same for everyone or not exist at all. Making it larger for some classes than others are just going to screw over the classes with more restrictive caps.
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When I tank I just button mash and get excited. Idk.
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Things in prepatch are wonky all around right now. Honestly I wouldn’t waste time trying to do content outside of leveling / raiding with a guild for fun.
I like the dynamic that healers and tanks have, and that is both being stated from playing both roles in the past. I think a measure of patience is needed any time you do get paired into a LFR or any que content. Some people are still learning and sometimes even the best of us make mistakes. Then again that’s coming from me, someone of whom is patient with others. At least until lines are crossed into bullcrap territory.
tbh things like this make me happy aoe caps are a thing
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I’ve heard some pretty funny stories from friends who went on RF and had a tank or DPS try to pull everything and blow it because of the AOE cap.
Nah still gotta do CTA and carry your screaming babies through a dungeon.
You really should take a break from pugging.
Take it easy, play with some friends. You’re taking this way too seriously. 
I level every single day across my seven accounts, for long plays sessions at that. I don’t think I’ve seen one single person complain about the flow of the dungeon or for the Tank to pull more or less. Seeing someone whine about it on here randomly doesn’t mean a thing.