i like sand.
I donāt mind the players, but I just canāt stand Blood Elves. I donāt think they fit aesthetically, thematically, or even truly have loyalty to the mood of the Horde and its gruff, tribal exterior.
I love the players (Iām dating a guy IRL who plays a Blood Elf rogue), they arenāt the problem, itās just the themes of the race as it exists in the game that I take issue with so much so that I will only join Troll only guilds. I canāt even join the guild my BF is in, and is lead by the Troll who I absolutely idolize for his skill, because they accept Blood Elves,
1 Like
I would argue that thematically the Blood Elves did fit somewhat well into the Horde, depending on ones perspective. If one looks at the Horde as a collective of disparate and pragmatic peoples Blood Elves fit the bill quite well when they were introduced.
Granted Iām putting emphasis on time, as I find it somewhat more difficult to justify them thematically nowadays; though the core of my opinion remains unchanged. In many ways they come off as High Elves 2.0 nowadays, with the Nightborne all but repeating significant parts of their story; but I digress.
1 Like
Coming from someone who plays and RPs Horde elves most of the time, I see exactly where youāre coming from. They stand out. Aesthetically, the oher races of the Horde are kinda metal and use skulls, spikes, and savage imagery.
Then you have these elves who still have flowery designs and ornate, advanced styles to their aesthetic. This is something I like to work with. Itās seeing these elves who generally wouldnāt want to affiliate with these āsavagesā being thrown in by their alliance with the Horde.
And then over time you get to see them learn they arenāt too different to the Horde. Like Yonara said, they are culturally kindreds to the Horde. Theyāve suffered greatly and have been forced to pragmatic measures and working united to survive.
Having an elf overcome their initial āprissinessā and learning what it means to be a proud member of the Horde is a really fun experience to have. Itās happened with Altielle and itās been quite rewarding.
5 Likes
the real problem is factions, no i wonāt be accepting questions
3 Likes
I wouldnāt bother engaging, everything they said reads like a textbook white supremacist dog whistle. āIām not racist butā¦ā Just flag and move on.
1 Like
Mmmm thatās a bad take.
Yeah I agree - I think the Horde moved past the āgruff/tribalā aesthetic a long time ago. Certainly, despite all the edgy stuff, I could never imagine describing the Forsaken as a gruff and tribal people. So Iād argue the Horde hasnāt been a collective of tribal peoples since Warcraft 3, even if it is dominated by them.
I think the theme of the Horde as outcasts is the most accurate. Many of these people were pretty downtrodden before finding a new level of freedom in the Horde. The Orcs had escaped internment, the Darkspear Trolls had been persecuted by the Gurubashi, the Alliance, and the Naga-led-murlocs. The Tauren tribes had been nearly wiped out by the centaur before uniting. The Forsaken were a small fringe faction of undead to begin with, surrounded by enemies on all sides. The Sinādorei lost 90% of their populace, had been betrayed by a key Alliance representative, and were struggling to cling to control of both their kingdom and their willpower, based on the loss of the Sunwell. The Bilgewater Cartel fled the destruction of their homeland AND their attempt at a second homeland. The Nightborne and Highmountain were both fairly damaged by the war against the Legion, and the Nightborne in particular were threatened by the night elves while trying to reclaim their home. The Magāhar were a tiny remnant of orcish culture following the Draenei persecution on their homeworld. The Zandalari society was falling to chaos from within, and was arguably saved by Horde intervention, thanks to Talanji. The Vulpera are characterised by hardship, eking out a living from a desert with few resources, and theyāve endured attacks from the Alliance as part of the war. Iād say the only Horde race not characterised by suffering is the Pandaren, and they choose to join based on philosophy.
So, in my opinion, Blood Elves, Forsaken and Nightborne, arguably the biggest Horde outliers culturally, actually fit the overall theme of the Horde quite well.
I flatly disagree with this. Preference of certain races due to certain themes in WoW, which letās be honest is a game that very much deliberately emphasises the differences and conflicts between fantasy races, does not mean that someone is a white supremacist. I disagree with her perspective personally but sheās entitled to it, so long as she doesnāt use it to ICly and OOCly bully others, you know? Itās a game, with fake races, in a fake world.
Fantasy racial preference does not equate to real life racism. Especially in a game like WoW where racism in lore seems to be all but actively encouraged, especially between factions.
6 Likes
You have to be careful however, because people use the āitās fictionā argument to hide their RL bigotry. Thatās exactly what a dog whistle is, a signal that goes unnoticed by most but letting other bigots know that āthis is an allyā or āthat is a safe place to hateā. It usually takes on a totally innocent comment with an underlying and very malicious message behind it. And NEEDS to be called out before it is allowed to fester.
I get that dogwhistles exist but I donāt agree that this was one.
Firstly, white supremacists tend to celebrate different cultural features than the one Kattani says sheās a fan of. From my study of the matter, they tend to mostly adulate Norse strength and stories, as well as certain cultural features of post renaissance Europe, with a specific focus on music and the arts. The tribal features Kattani is saying she loves the Horde for are in stark contrast to the ideologies of white supremacists. So thereās that.
Secondly, she went to great pains, twice, to emphasise that she has no issues with blood elf players, and is even dating one. I doubt white supremacists would be so quick to announce a relationship with someone of a āraceā they disapprove of.
I mean, believe me Khollorn I get your caution. Iāve seen some pretty dubious racial posts before. But in my opinion, Kattaniās perspective here was not an IRL white-supremacist one. Just the perspective of someone whoās playing the game due to a love of a certain aesthetic. I canāt blame them for that, even if Iām personally quite the opposite in my preference.
Iāve actually never been able to get into RPing the more tribal races of the Horde, though admittedly Iāve never had trouble RPing WITH them - actually quite enjoy it. But in terms of my personal toons, I have a real love of Forsaken and Sinādorei, though I donāt currently have an actively RPed Sinādorei toon. (My Renādorei stole the spotlight xD) So I guess, despite my opposite perspective, I defend Kattaniās right to feel the same in reverse. The Horde is a culturally diverse faction and weāre all going to enjoy RPing certain themes within that.
5 Likes
My guild the southfury watch loves elves and do not hate them at all nope not ever.
4 Likes
Iād agree that Bloodelves fit the Horde perfectly thematically, just like Vulpera do. Theyāre survivors, willing to do what it takes to make it in a world that isnāt necessarily kind to them. Thatās been the Hordeās like, main theme, since Warcraft 3
1 Like
You accept and drink my gifts of wine but you never invite me over for dinner. I call bull.
1 Like
All the talk of orcs just makes me want to point out that technically, Trolls have more claim to Azeroth then anyone. And we say the orcs can stay. So THERE.
8.3 Thread - #1625 by Kattani-wyrmrest-accord
That seems pretty āracially superiorā sounding to me, just saying.
Edit: I found even more racist undertones in her message history:
Kattani would like to see Darkspear at the forefront of a resurgence of Troll power. Seeing them pave the way to rebuild and unite the tribes, and make the world safe for them again. Erasing any possible evidence that night elves are related to them, while reclaiming ancient lands from even older enemies.
If Your Character Was Racial Leader - #3 by Kattani-wyrmrest-accord
That is very āfinal solutionā-esque if you ask me
If you allow even the smallest amount of bigotry to fester, it will grow out of control.
aight so then maybe lets drop it, yeah?
1 Like
Come over for dinner.
1 Like
You have 13 posts. Post on your main and Iāll find some questionable posts to bring out of context and disproportionately blow up to be something more than what it really is
3 Likes
Literally all I said was I didnāt like the RP aesthetic of Blood Elves, and this crusade you launched against me makes no sense whatsoever. Please leave me alone.
3 Likes
Iām a classy lady. Iād like a letter-invitation.
ā¦Iāll bring fresh-caught fish? 
1 Like
Iāll bring the hot dogs
1 Like