/shrug it’s not my fault you don’t understand how batching works. If you win a coin toss is it skill?
Explain in detail how batching is comparable to a coin toss.
By forcing to type out your argument in detail, I will be able to point out all of the weaknesses and misunderstandings in your point of view.
If you are confident in your point of view you should have no problem delivering on this challenge. If you know that your argument is weak then you’ll try to find some way to weasel out of it and make excuses. Let’s see which it is.
With no visibility to the actual batches it’s RNG whether your spell will fall within the batch you want it to.
OK, so we’ve established a few things:
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You’re talking about intentionally landing spells on the same batch in PvP
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You think there is no ability to tell when batches happen
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You think players can’t repeatedly, intentionally land spells on the same batch as their opponents in order to counter them… if it happens, it’s luck not skill
Now let’s talk about why each of these points is weak and inadequate:
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Intentional batching in PvP is only one application of spell batching, it doesn’t reflect the entire game. Batching also matters in PvE, and in PvE, making the batches 40x smaller means that players will have extra time to react to incoming damage and mechanics than what they had in real vanilla WoW.
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You can tell when batches happen by looking at cues for when the server updates the game state from prior abilities resolving (seeing health totals change on a heal or damage). You can setup addons to make these things easier to determine. As a Rogue you can even look at your energy ticks to tell the server’s heartbeat.
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There are documented cases of players performing these techniques in a manner that is repeatable/reproducible. It was not only a common and well understood technique in TBC, WotLK, Cata, and MoP, it’s still common and performed with regularity today on private servers.
For a simple example, in a Rogue vs. Rogue if an enemy Rogue is stunlocking me it’s a fair bet that I might be spamming my “Blind” button was I am coming out of the stunlock. If the other Rogue expects this, that player can use their Vanish right as the stunlock is ending and they will very consistently be able to Vanish-immune my Blind. Therefore there is an element of prediction and mindgames in determining what your opponent is likely to do. At high levels of play, there are only one or a small number of correct lines of play, so if you know that your opponent knows what they are doing then it is possible to predict their next move with good consistency.
In this same scenario, if you reduce the batch window by a factor of 40x, now there is a lot more RNG involved in trying to vanish-immune the blind, because the batch window is much smaller and the blind can get processed before you activate vanish. This change increases the contribution of RNG/reduces the predictability of the game server, and makes it less likely to punish your opponent’s action even when you correctly predicted what it would be. Therefore it reduces the skillcap in this specific PvP application that you brought up.
QED
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LoL not my fault you don’t understand RNG is RNG.
Batching allows for you to perform the exact same actions with the exact same timing but get different results. With the much narrower batching window you will get much more consistent results.
This isn’t rocket science nor does it need an essay to explain.
Ziryus, you didn’t address anything, you’re just repeating the same circular logic.
Here let me help you out by quoting what you need to respond to:
I’m sorry but there’s nothing more to say than that players have zero visibility to the batches. Which means at best you can try to get as close to using an ability as you need to. Which means it’s down to RNG whether it’ll actually turn out how you want or not.
By narrowing the batch window abilities will perform much more consistently which increases the skill cap as bad players like you can no longer try to roll the dice and get lucky.
As previously stated, with a larger batch window if I can predict my opponent’s next move, it’s more likely and more consistent that I can punish it by landing a spell on the same batch
With a smaller batch window, it’s more likely that even though I correctly predicted their next move, I didn’t punish it because our spells landed on different batches. More batches for spells to land on = higher chance to land on a different batch = less ability to consistently and intentionally land spells on the same batch even when you correctly predicted the opponent’s move = more RNG
It’s basic logic and basic math, buddy… probability theory 101. It’s cute that you call me a “bad player” when you want to create more scenarios where someone correctly predicted what their enemy would do, and yet failed to capitalize on it due to RNG. Yikes!
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You’ll still have a 10 ms window to demonstrate your awesome skill at batching, sounds like you just need to git gud.
You’re backpedaling because you realized you lost the prior point.
OK, cool, I can mop the floor with you in this argument as well.
WoW is not a game that is about insane precision fast twitch reaction time. It’s about prediction, and it always has been at the higher levels that you never sniffed. The superior players aren’t the ones that have the best reflexes, they are the ones who understand the game so well that they see what is going to happen / what is likely to happen / what are the possible outcomes that can happen in advance, and they already know what their plan is for dealing with each of those possible outcomes.
This is a totally non-controversial point of view that any gladiator/R1 player will enthusiastically agree with. Game knowledge / prediction ability / the ability to “make reads” are the reasons for their success.
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/shrug And now that abilities won’t randomly not work properly because of batching you’ll have to actually learn to play instead of relying on RNG.
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You’re totally in denial and continuing to repeat your circular logic that I already refuted.
Every time you lose a point you just jump back to repeating one of your other points that you already lost lmao, throwing in a few ad hominems or implied/outright insults for good measure.
You should go back and read some of your posts.
There is a difference between ad hominem argument and ad hominem fallacy.
I can showcase the weak credibility of my opponents on a particular topic without needing to make it my central argument.
This poster, on the other hand, is falling back on baselessly calling me a “bad” player because I’m able to use batching to my advantage (how does that make sense? lol) without advancing any other points.
Not to mention the fact that they lose a line of argument, change the subject to something else, and then once they start losing on the new subject they change back to the first one and try to start it over without saying anything new LOL.
At the end of the day removing batching increases the skill cap because things work much more consistently.
Sorry you don’t realize this.
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For the 10th time, they aren’t removing batching. They are changing the size of the batch windows from the authentic vanilla/tbc/wotlk/cata/mop size to the retail zoomer wod/legion/bfa/shadowlands batch size.
And no, it makes spell batching less consistent, for reasons that I already demonstrated to you with very basic math. More batches = more opportunities for a spell to land on a different batch = more RNG / less predictability.
As already explained to you, in a way that you totally failed to grapple with or address at all without changing the subject entirely, it creates more situations where a player 1. successfully predicts their opponent’s next move and makes a play to punish it, then 2. fails to punish it due to bad RNG.
Any observer reading this thread could clearly and obviously see which side has answers and counter arguments that examine points in detail, vs. which side keeps trying to jump around and change the subject. It’s plain as day.
Then there should be no problem, you’ll just have to git gud and adapt to the new batching window 
Since according to you it’s all pure skill.
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More trolling behavior because you are unable to formulate a coherent and defensible argument.
Abilities will work much more consistently with the smaller batching window.
Not sure what confuses you about this. And yes that means your gimmick will almost never work now which is good.
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Abilities already work in a consistent and predictable manner. If you die right before a heal lands on a later batch, there is no variance in what happens in that scenario. If your hit points go to 0 before the next batch is processed, you die 100% of the time.
I don’t know why you are so fixated on one single example when I’ve given a good half dozen examples across both PvE and PvP.
But regarding this specific point, vanish-immunes are not a “gimmick” it was inentionally designed behavior. You can go back and look at any of the old Tweets from former lead designer Greg Street (Ghostcrawler) on this topic when they were changing the behavior in Cataclysm.
They could have designed it different. They could have designed it so that when Vanish + another ability land on the same batch, the other ability wins and only vanish gets wasted/negated. Or they could have coded it so that both abilities happen and neither gets canceled, so that trying to vanish a blind would leave you both in stealth and blinded.
Instead they made the intentional design choice to code the abilities in a certain way such that vanish and any offensive ability landing on you in the same batch will both cancel each other out.
But this is one single example. There are batching plays available to every single class in PvP. Warlocks for example use Hellfire to break incoming blinds and polymorphs, as long as you have the game awareness and knowledge to know when to activate it then it becomes easy to do.
EDIT: Gave a better example