Just curious what is the opinion of real shaman players.
I’ve only leveled both spec but never really did end game.
To me though Elemental is the real DPS spec and I could really see ENH becoming a Support Spec. I mean shaman has already tons of utilities to bring to a group, even more than Evoker. Not much is missing to make it support.
-Earth Shield could boost all healing received and reducing damage receiving by a %
-Skyfury could also boost spell damage maybe?
-Maybe some buffs could come from the totems radius?
“support” is going to play out the same way “hybrid” played out. Shaman as support is/was a thing already with healing totem, bulwark totem, earth elemental, earth grab totem, tremor totem, poison cleansing totem.
The biggest support is doing high amount of dps to kill mobs before they kill the group.
I mean, thats kind of what shaman used to be WAAAAAAAY back in the day. I can’t say converting a established dps spec will be a popular move or a good one. However, making a fourth spec who’s purpose is to be a support spec would be real cool. Could even give it the two-hander everyone wants and it wont disrupt enhance.
If they give us a fourth spec, it should be a tank spec. Blizzard should turn Augmentation into a pure DPS and give up on the idea of support specializations.
No. If i was king of the WoW I’d actually roll support design into the healing specs. That way healer “damage” was more functionally relevant and impactful.
I don’t believe WoW’s current party comp configuration supports the idea of a pure support spec, I think it’s actively detrimental to the game and that Augment should probably be redesigned as a tank spec.
Fair enough, and same I vehemently disagree with you entirely I really don’t like the idea of ‘support’ (stopped playing evoker because I don’t like aug).
See now, I disagree with this line of reasoning. True, Augmentation made a huge splash when it first showed up and was unbalanced as all hell but they did bring it to heel. I think a 20 year old game like this needs to evolve and test new ideas, and I like seeing it experiment for it’s health.
Rolling support design into healer specs almost sounds appealing but it would put a lot of power into one role. The real problem is the lack of support roles. Since there is only one dps like this and it’s not an official role, fights and parties are not designed for it and as a result it makes everything wonky. But, if they built fights and content for it going forward while adding new ones and making them a role you queue for, it would settle into it’s place.
Only so many dps and tank specs you can pump out before you repeat designs and concepts. This is a good way to get fresh content and specs into the game.
See, this is the exact reason why I’m vehemently against it. Trying to rationalize a role by enforcing a role queue for it seems like such a short-sighted experiment that will damage the game, it screams ‘solution seeking out a problem’ to me.
Support specs (in the context of buffing specs) can only exist in a game designed to weaken/worsen all other specs to legitimize it’s existence. You touch on this, “parties are not designed for it”. So to design for it, every other spec was to be made worse in functionality so they can be balanced for being ‘helped’ by a support. They can only exist in games that have been highly strictly designed to expect their existence and balanced around that - so we’re talking very predictable content, very predictable gameplay, and very standardized character functionality.
Sure, test new ideas, but a majority of WoW’s problems are in the encounter design. Content design (m+, raiding being the ‘only’ thing to do) is highly limited - delves are a great attempt, something like Torghast but divorced from player power would be fun, heck I’d still like a reiteration on warfronts I still think that was a good idea poorly implemented. Evokers ‘hold down to cast’ thing is severely underutilized and might be worth bringing into other specs. Wow’s problems with specs/classes is in gameplay balance vs class feel - how do you design a class themed on always needing to inflict pain but have useful abilities in a party setting (in regards to death knights) for example.
I hate hate hate the idea of support, because that approaches us towards a game not based in class theming, but role requirements. It’ll be more akin to a MOBA, where you technically could pick different characters, but they have hard set role expectations. This is not behavior I want out of an MMO. You throw in a bunch of supports, now to legitimize them beyond just being a dps with a buff aura, you gotta cram them full of utility. And if you do, dps specs have to lose that utility to differentiate their roles amongst each other.
Right now, as a Shaman, I can get totems for utility. I can pick up an interrupt. I can be useful to the party beyond just zug-zuging dps. All themed around a core of mysticism, and connection with the elements. I don’t have to be any particular spec to accomplish any of that, or identify with that theme. I do not want to go down a path where attempting to legitimize 'support’s existence homogenizes the functionality and feel of other specs and classes.
See, this assumes a lot. You dont have to worsen other classes to make support a meaningful presence on the field. You can design enemies to better suit the the need for support like specs on the field, or, alternatively, gimp the support so they need others to get their full effect. Honestly, I really don’t think it would make the game worse and it would open it up to more varieties of play.
I want to mention that I do see your point of view here, it’s not like it would be the worse thing to happen if support was killed and other classes were given more support options in their kits. But, I also think it’s a mistake to wholly abandoned an interesting new idea for the game just because you are scared of what it might become. I am interested in what it could be. I am also willing to drop the idea of it having a dedicated role to see these playstyles of supporting others to get your full effectiveness out come alive.
If hypothetically I were to pick a way to do roles, it would be flex spots. There let’s say in a dungeon group you have, tank, healer, two dps and then a flex for a third dps or a support. The support would up the dps of others to even things out. Or potentially, give resources in groups that might be having mana problems with their healer. Either way, it’s less about forcing the need for a support and more about getting that gameplay in for those who enjoy it the most.
I mean, a spec called Enhancement seems like a very logical fit for a buff spec or support spec as we are calling them.
With that said, if they did rework a shaman dps spec into a buff spec that would probably be a competition with Legion Survival Hunter for the worst class design choice in the history of WoW. Enhancement has a dedicated player base and despite what you hear I don’t think shaman as a whole even has that small of a population. This change would royally piss off a large number of players.
