A level a day will keep the addiction away.
I think.
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They have as much meaning as people ascribe to them… just like in vanilla. Just like in ALL video games.
Did the world first of MC happen in 1.12? No. How about BWL? nope. It seems like that’s a massive change… in fact it’s a whole bunch of changes. And we haven’t even talked about layering.
Once again, none of this matters. The fact that it’s the same wouldn’t make the world firsts any more or less real.
Classic world firsts will be a thing without your support. Nothing you or I say here will stop people from paying attention to them or ascribing meaning to them.
This is objectively incorrect. Even ignoring the absence of patch progression, the layering, the new hardware, the radically different social climate, the addons and external tools that have changed, etc, there are still things inside the actual game that are different.
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But, once more, it’s not first if you’re not first to do it. It’s been done in 2006.
All of this is opinion based. Just because you want it to have value, doesn’t mean that it magically acquires value. They’ll boast first whatever, and most people will reply ‘thirteen years too late mate.’
Everything I’ve posted has been fact based and proven by Blizzard and the design goals. Everything you two have said has been emotional romanticism.
If you’re the first to do it in classic that’s a classic first. * Shrug * I don’t know what else to tell you, man. You don’t have the authority to tell the community that these aren’t world firsts.
Kinda? It’s all up to how the community reacts.
Maybe you didn’t understand me the first time, so I’ll say it again. It’s not a matter of what you or I personally want. The value of any achievement in a video game is given to it by the players and community… it’s not a matter of one player saying they don’t care. If other players care, then the thing has value.
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If I was going to humour you and agree (I don’t), then to me all of this just devalues firsts even more, because completing the content today, we have better equipment, lower latency, better connections, more experience, more played time, better…Everything. So it makes any first seem quite empty to me as they’re immediately easier than the first time, when most were blind. Even then, many firsts in the old days were achieved by former internal testers who had experience of that content.
What’s the fun of an achievement in steamrolling thirteen year old content that’s been done to death since 2006?
When p server or internal tester guilds get these supposed firsts, are you going to be happy for them or are you going to curse them for having had vastly unfair advantages over normal players across numerous years either through direct access as internal testers or from past experience of practicing on p servers?
I guarantee you all of these supposed firsts will be from those two groups. Normal players who access the game legally and never stepped foot on a p server are at an instant and vast disadvantage.
You keep saying Classic meaning that it’s new, but it’s not. It’s a recreation, a rerelease, an identical copy of content from 2006, Blizzard’s words. It’s not a new game by Blizzard’s definition.
Ultimately it boils down to one easy to understand fact: it’s not a new game so completing it now isn’t doing so for the first time. Classic is in the exact same iteration as it was in 2006, with minor non game play affecting changes. Old game, old content, old firsts apply, please join the line and take a ticket.
All of that is true… except for the Molton Core stuff. I expect the first guild to down that will be extremely undergeared.
Thus I expect people to pay close attention to the Classic world first Ragnaros kill (and maybe US first IDK)… and then far LESS attention to the other world firsts.
Be jealous probably? They put in the time, so they’ll get the first (assuming one of the hardcore retail guilds doesn’t get it). I’m not sure how this is relevant to the rest of the conversation.
I don’t see how my disadvantage changes the meaningfulness of a world first.
It’s not even close to identical. If it were, it wouldn’t change the existence of Classic World Firsts.
Vanilla firsts are vanilla firsts. Classic firsts are their own thing.
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I mean the whole point of Classic is to allow people to play a game they played 15 years ago… You didn’t like when retailers laughed off your desire to play vanilla again so why laugh off people chasing a classic world first? Those who down the bosses first in classic can rightfully say they are the classic world first boss kills because classic is its own entity now.
The group that kills the bosses first had to earn their way to the kill just as much as the vanilla groups did.
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That sounds like a personal problem to me. If you cannot see that it’s morally wrong to illegally access p servers and to then use that experience to achieve a first, thus completely tainting it, then that’s your problem I’m afraid. My point is, criminals are going to get these supposed firsts, or people who have more experience because they were internal testers. Either way, that puts your average, non ToS violating player at a huge disadvantage. You’d seriously be happy having firsts claimed by people who spat on Blizzard and illegally accessed p servers and violated the ToS without penalty?
Incorrect. If you keep up with the updates you’ll see that most things are being labelled as working as intended, or as they were in 1.12. the content, the classes, the mechanics and the balance is not being altered, please do not tell porkies.
No it is not. By Blizzard’s own definition, not mine, Classic is a recreation, a copy, a rerelease of the game. It’s not it’s own entity, it’s a clone, nothing new, nothing different.
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Method is not a guild they are a professional gaming organization. They will account share and anything else they have to in order to achieve world first. It is not like they get punished for anything.
No one is going to to play 20+ hours a day. They rotate shifts.
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They’re also Blizzard’s go to testers for unreleased raid content if I’m not mistaken, linking back to my how on earth do you expect to compete with these people point.
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They dont win 100% of the time and most of the races are close. The unfortunate thing about the teams racing for world first classic raids is itll all boil down to what team entered the instance first cause all bosses are dying the first time they enter most likely.
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It’s going to be p server veterans with a decade of experience replaying the same content over and over until they perfect their ways, or it’s going to be professional go to testers with first hand up to date experience of the raid content. Either way, normal players are screwed over. If I subscribed to firsts, needless to say I don’t since it’s the same game by Blizzard’s own admission as the one in 2006, then I’d still argue that they’re ill gotten.
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Personal disadvantage… is a personal problem.
I straight up don’t care about this issue. I actually don’t think the world first group will be one of the pserver guilds, but even if it were it would still be a world first.
However, for this to be a problem in the first place, you must first acknowledge the fact that classic world firsts are a thing. Then we can talk about whether pservers gave one guild or another an unfair advantage.
And the “working as intended” Classic 1.13 is radically different than vanilla was.
Also, “most” things aren’t working as they were or working as intended. Did you play the beta or stress tests? There are a metric f-tonne of bugs and other issues that likely won’t be ironed out until well after release.
The absence of patch progression RADICALLY alters balance and mechanics (class mechanics and dungeon mechanics). That ain’t a small change.
It really doesn’t matter what blizzard is saying. It only matters what they actually do. What they’ve done is create a very different game from the one we played in 2004-2006.
ANYWAY It all boils down to this:
Classic is a fresh start. It’s like having another race on the same track. There will still be a first place even though someone won that race last year.
If there were a ladder system, we probably wouldn’t call these kills “world first”, but I don’t think there will ever be a ladder system in WoW
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Either way no one is getting world first without account sharing which is a violation of blizzards rules (unless you are among the chosen ones).
Please stop lying. No it is not. Blizzard have confirmed themselves, and I trust them more than you, that there are no changes to the game play, the content, the raids, the mechanics, the classes and the balance. Please stop lying. It is the exact same game with a few MINOR non-gameplay impacting, QoL changes.
The op already slipped up on that point earlier by admitting that, as an example, the first patch to follow the release of BfA does not alter the game enough to undo those world firsts and to warrant a fresh set of firsts.
If they changed the classes, their spells or damage, or they increased everyone’s armour or tinkered with a bosses damage output, loot or resistances, you might have a point, the game would be altered, it would be a different experience.
However, Blizzard HAVE confirmed no changes and that this will be an authentic experience, i.e. nothing new.
Exactly. Key words: Same. Old. Previous version. Recreation. Rerelease. Authentic experience. Already used iteration. 1.12 from 2006. No changes. Basically, a clone.
Just because you don’t like a truth doesn’t mean it’s a lie.
Share with me the blue post that says they’re removing layering, fixing all the bugs, adding patch progression, and somehow removing players’ access to new addons new external tools, etc.
Nothing will likely ever alter the game to the point where we’d get new world firsts… because altering the game is irrelevant to the nature of world firsts.
Remember, you’re the one ranting about how it’s the same game. I’ve already told you multiple times that even if that were true it’s irrelevant.
My point wouldn’t be supported by changing class mechanics. It would be as irrelevant as it is now.
However, class mechanics have been radically altered from the way they were in vanilla. The changes to some classes between release and 1.12 were as big as the changes that came in the BC prepatch. Without patch progression, everything is VERY different. Layering also changes the game substantially, as do bugs, as do addons, as do external tools, community changes, etc.
I keep saying it but nobody is listening. It’s not going to be the same experience.
And still there is a first place. That first place will be called a classic world first.
And you haven’t accounted for the radical changes involved in Classic.
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For the last 102039r8r729101038391th time private servers aren’t classic servers. Dang people and private servers. It’s not the same, not blizz like and it isn’t what vanilla was.
I totally agree with you. The classic experience (especially molten core and onyxia) will be much different than the experience the players who first encountered them had.
Which is why I find it funny the no changers dont want tuning done to bosses because it would be inauthentic… Well, groups one shotting molten core the first time they enter the instance is inauthentic also.
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No not the rest of the community…just private server elitists who think that stuff matters.
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And I want to add that I think it’s OK that it won’t be the same experience. We really can’t go back and recapture what we had in vanilla because not only has WoW changed, WE’VE changed.
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