No i didn’t acknowledge parity at all. In fact all i agreed with you was that the customization and art assets TO ME were superior and that is reflected in the player base using those 2 races. I never said or implied that there was ANY type of parity in the AR’s.
Nope, it is agreeing in a specific instance that i think the art assets for the Void Elves was better.
This isn’t a thing. I bring up what is not fair on both ends. I know you just happen to read this thread and anything having to do with High Elves…but i have many many times gone to the mat for Ogres for the Horde with the same veracity and enthusiasm i have said High Elves should be Alliance.
You do you my dude.
I asked if you were Broflake, that you are seemingly confirming it is the ONLY confirmation i have received at all. I have to in fact name a specific poster if i am asking if that person is you don’t i? How else would i find out?
Yes because YOU are the ONLY one who comes up with these things like i am lying and has a need to say the same things you always say. YOU also have the same habit of trying to use words no one else uses in real world conversations like vapid. So yes, YOU (if you are in fact Broflake) are the ONLY ONE who came to mind. If you aren’t Broflake then i think you pretending to be him or whatever game you are playing here is pretty ridiculous…but that would be in keeping with Broflake.
Besides WHO else would i ask if you were Broflake other then here in this thread? Where else would or could i possibly get this information from other then to ask here?
And since you haven’t actually positively or negatively affirmed you are in fact Broflake i still am not completely sure, just mostly since you have elluded to it.
You seem to presuppose that High Elves couldn’t fight for the Alliance, were they to choose to do so.
My question only has one answer, so by definition it can’t be a “damned if you do, damned if you don’t”-type situation. I’ll answer it myself, since you refused to do so. Typically, people want their opinions to be heard by those in positions of authority because they fear that remaining unheard will result in something they perceive as negative occurring.
This understanding is what motivates those in favor of playable High Elves, and those opposed to playable High Elves.
Those in favor are candid about their concern, a concern that Blizzard will continue to ignore the High Elves for fear of alienating fans of the Blood Elves – which is why those in favor are consistently conceptualizing and proposing narrative adjustments which would allow Blizzard to overcome their own reservations.
Those opposed prefer to imagine that it is a foregone conclusion that High Elves won’t ever be implemented, that they’re merely present in these threads to attempt to demonstrate to others how foregone a conclusion it actually is – when the reality is as Guzzle suggested, there is a serious concern from this group that Blizzard would consider playable High Elves if they suspected there wouldn’t be much in the way of resistance to the addition.
My pointing out that you’re hypocritical in your argumentation style, and loose with the facts, is hardly on the same level as you wholesale dismissing posts and being infantile.
If you want to pretend I’ve been equally as vitriolic or sardonic as you’ve been, it’s a free country, but like so many of your posts… wrong again.
I, too, would prefer we don’t get playable High Elves.
This has precisely nothing to do with the fact if you asked the question, as a general rule “High Elves”, “Vrykul”, “Furbolg”/“Arrakoa”/“Jinyu” will be the majority of the responses you get – doesn’t matter if you’re talking to people who exclusively PvP, exclusively M+, exclusively Pet Battle, exclusively World Quest, the answers remain consistent.
(Avoid RP servers, you get weird answers there – like “half-Gnome, half-Tauren”).
Unfortunately for you, none of this is supportable because knowing the motivations of an individual along with the emotions tied to those views varies from one person to the next, and is not something which can be predicted within this situation.
Hold up a second, I just need to point out some irony here.
You’re doing it to try and point out my hypocrisy, but when I do it to point out your hypocrisy, its not valid.
You haven’t stated it, but the tonality of your comments suggest a disbelief that they would – and while I’d agree with you that they’re not likely to interject themselves into any Alliance-Horde conflict, we disagree as it relates to why that is.
You implied that when I point out that you’re utilizing flawed reasoning, it’s equally as infantile as your decision to arbitrarily ignore entire posts or even fling ad hominems.
They’re not equal, and your equivocation is not valid – but I’m not going to argue this point anymore, the other thread-goers will judge for themselves who spent more time being elusive and antagonistic.
Why does that matter? The only difference between MU orcs and AU orcs are a skin color from ingesting a specific source of magic. This is the same superficial difference between the High Elves and Blood Elves.
To fail to delineate the difference between Blood Elves and High Elves purely because of superficial appearances is extremely short-sighted. They are ideologically, culturally, and politically different bodies that Blizzard spared no opportunity showing between Wrath and MOP.
Please explain why superficial differences are that much more important than their other differences.
So the argument you’re making isn’t that Pandaren don’t dilute the faction identity, but that their numbers are so insignificant that it doesn’t matter.
Blizzard may regret it, but the genie is out of the bottle. They have a race with the exact same silhouette on different factions. And, if you want to get technical, they already have this with Blood Elves and Void Elves. Tentacle hair that gets hidden under most armor graphics doesn’t make them stand out nearly as much as people want them to.
For the longest time, Forsaken history was Human history. It wasn’t until Cataclysm that Forsaken got unique architectural assets, and that was only in a few places. Undercity was still a ruined human kingdom that didn’t ever see a significant aesthetic change. The change in BfA was a HD replacement that still retained its original human aesthetic.
Why are you discounting the fact that at any moment all Blizzard has to do is decide they want it and could develop unique architectural assets for the High Elves or the Blood Elves?
I’m glad that you admit cultural differences are just as important. I’m curious that you’ve dismissed it for High Elves/Blood Elves but consider it for Kaldorei/Shaldorei. Why is that?
It wasn’t strictly demonic magic. The main difference schism was over the decision to sap mana from living sources. HIgh Elves found this abhorrent and endured.
You’re leaning back on superficial differences and dismissing the cultural differences.
The Mag’har in Outland were just brown orcs. It wasn’t until WoD that there was any consideration for what Mag’har did to look different from other clans. Blackrock Orcs and Shattered Hand orcs got significant redesigns. Any artwork of Blackrock Orcs that were uncorrupted are brown-skinned like every other Mag’har orc, but since WoD they’ve been recontextualized as ashen-skined and even red-eyed. There’s no indication at all that this is unique only to the AU Blackrock orcs croming from the alterate draenor, and there’s nothing suggested that the orcs in MU Outland couldn’t have had cultural distinctions and that their absence was a matter of a limitation of assets and nothing more.
Blizzard can, at any time, declare that High Elves are discovering forgotten trends that are coming back in style. After all, in western culture there’s a whole subset for retro aesthetics where retired fads and fashions are embraced all over again. Are you discounting this as a realistic movement for High Elves in an effort to differentiate themselves from the Blood Elves?
We don’t need to know exact numbers. Here’s a thought exercise:
The standing Thalassian population, before the Scourge, was 100%. 90% of them were slain, leaving only 10% of the remaining population alive.
Of that 10%, there was another 90/10 split between those that christened themselves Blood Elves, and those that didn’t. So we have 9% of the remaining population as Blood Elves, 1% of the remaining as High Elves.
Blood Elves and High Elves were comparably active in many wars until BfA. For the sake of the argument, let’s presume comparable losses respective to the total population of that group and keep their numbers about where they are when Umbric decided to leave.
I posit that there are fewer Void Elves than there are High Elves, and you only have to argue it’s not realistic to say the inverse is true.
The Blood Elves that migrated to Telongrus Rift were exiled from SIlvermoon and are Magister Umbric’s followers. In order for the number of Umbric’s followers to be larger than the remaining population of High Elves, he has to have greater than that 1% remaining population. In order for that to be true, he needs to have a follower base that is 1/9th the total population of Blood Elves.
You then have to rationalize why Lor’themar would permit either of the following:
Exiling about ~11% of a population in a time where Blood Elves are already bordering on extinction
Allowing ~11% of a population to just desert Silvermoon. Wars have been fought to retain a body wishing to secede from a nation.
I put forth it’s not at all reasonable to say Umbric has a follower base that is this large, or if he did, that he would’ve been allowed to claw away this many people form Silvermoon without intervention.
It’s not Ion’s job to know the lore. It’s his job to create a functional game that is profitable and keeps people interested. The job of creating the lore is very likely delegated to anyone but him, and we know that Danuser is the Lead Narrative Designer, with people like Golden assisting with the story (for better or worse).
It’s evident that Ion Hazzikostas is not the one who should be fielding questions about the lore. He’s stated that the High Elf question was simply a matter of not kicking a can down the road any longer. Unless he’s the only Game Director for the life of the game, if he leaves or is replaced by another, they may very well decided to reopen this consideration.
So there are Allied Races crossing faction lines, and some that aren’t. The precedent is already set that could allow for High Elves.
Please substantiate why this is a requirement. This wasn’t the case for the Void Elves or Nightborne. You’ve already conceded that they cross faction lines. Are you going to quantify why the ‘mix up’ for Void Elves/Nightborne is more or less than it would be for HIgh Elves, and what would that be based on?
Silver Covenent has a base of operations in Crystalsong Forest and could establish one anywhere. If Telongrus Rift can be pulled out of literally nowhere, Blizzard can slap a Silver Covenent landing wherever they wanted to, if they insisted it couldn’t be their half of the Alliance-leaning Dalaran.
This is drastically misinformed.
The Purge of Dalaran and Isle of Thunder was MOP-era content, and while that’s getting on in the years it hasn’t been a decade. In both of those events, High Elves were inextricably associated with the Alliance as fighting on their behalf in those theaters. The content patch for Isle of Thunder was released in March 2013. It hasn’t even been 7 years.
Blizzard has done nothing to suggest that has changed in any meaningful way.
There is more evidence of Blood Elves being favorable to a departure of the Horde than there has ever been to suggested that the High Elves have ever left the Alliance.
After conceding that there are already the Pandaren on both sides (regardless of whether or not Blizzard regrets it) and two Allied Races that ping-pong the other factions aesthetic on the other side, where does this insistence that faction identity isn’t already eroding?
Is that even what faction identity is?
Throughout this ‘primer’ you’ve leaned into superfiicial, visual differences when it was convenient, while dismissing cultural differences, and then did the inverse when that served your argument better.
Your rational works, and only works, if you concede that faction identity is rooted in a visual, aesthetic apperance and not a set of values and ideology. For your dismissal of the Pandaren, their starting zones end with a very succint description of both factions that very skillfully represented the essence of the factions.
The Horde is not a faction of bestial monster races with fair-skinned elves. They’re a faction of dogged survivors, outcasts banding together and enduring in a world that tried to snuff them out with an ardent code of personal honor.
The Alliance are not just the clean-cut ‘mostly human looking’ races. They’re a union standing on the foundations of courage, bravery, brotherhood, and a moral good.
What you’re doing by reducing the Horde and Alliance to visual aesthetics is something that would get you labeled with some very colorful, vile things in the real world, and once you acknowledge that, you’ll quickly come to realize that the differences between the Sin’dorei and Quel’dorei, as well as the Horde and the Alliance, are a matter of values, not a matter of surface-deep visual traits.
