Generally curious why blizzard doesn’t allow pvp vendors in the game for pvpers just to get all their gear and hop into arenas? Make the gear lower ilvl than pve gear, but have it scale in instanced pvp. Why is this such a hard concept that this would increase activity in pvp? Pvpers dont care about lore, we want to hop into the game and pvp. It’s so simple, so why not do it?
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Because Ion still works for Blizz. Ion is on record stating he believes pvpers should be able to feel good about destroying lesser greared players. This means rolfstomping.
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The problem is if there’s no progression then most people won’t keep playing and that gear is the best way to motivate people to do content in wow. While for sure there are people that would want something like templates which they tried in Legion it didn’t work really well. Personally I like the no-rating requirement approach for pvp which I feel is a middle ground but I don’t pvp much nowadays so who am I to say.
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All of this seemed pretty good to me. 
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what i find stupid is the fact they made the blitz bg count towards pvp vault but are now just removing pvp track altogether for delves. either way im all for increased conq cap because that lets me get more starter pieces for pve in the first two weeks
while pvp gear atm isnt as good as raid gear and that it is indeed good enough as a starter pve piece and 1600 week 1 is like 2 pieces depending what you pick
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I don’t think gearing has anything to do with why people aren’t interested in PvP.
The skill gap over the years has just gotten far too high and it’s to the point new players just won’t stand a chance or stick around for very long. It’s also much harder for your average player to find people to PvP with considering the elitist mentality most have with it and don’t wanna be held back by someone else.
I think a big thing is to lower the damage output in PvP to where it’s easier for players to see their mistakes and learn from them. Your average player is going to just get chain stunned/ccd and get deleted so fast they won’t know what happened and will just get frustrated and stay out of it.
Lower damage output means you see your mistakes unfold a lot easier and can learn from what exactly killed you, and will make you want to try again because it will be easier for your average player to see a mistake as opposed to “oh I just got stunned and died going from 100 to 0% in seconds”.
War mode is also awful, 90% of the time it’s an unfair situation where it’s like 10v1 and most newer players are just going to turn it off to avoid the hassle which means PvP never becomes something that intrigues them because they just associate it with an unfair annoying type of mindset. Ultimately PvP needs to appeal to newer or your average skill level players to grow, and it simply won’t the way it currently is
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Because actually balancing PvP by making a dedicated PvP set that scales up in PvP and say locking out the use of PvE gear would be a smart decision which Blizzard is incapable of making.
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Nah its gear second poster nailed it. WoW pvp skill roof is very low. It requires basic knowledge of cds and the ability to land a interupt. That is enough to get you to 2400.
There is an absurd amount of bs surrounding the gear. Its getting better but its still a unacceptable pain point.
This is quite easy to say when Blizzard has never tried any method other than the one currently employed. The sample size is, shockingly: 1
Guild Wars 2 does precisely what the OP suggests and it’s fantastic. It works. Cosmetic rewards, titles, gold, there are a slew of ways if even a fraction of thought is applied.
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blizz just need to bring back the dedicated pvp gear set and balance pvp that way, worst thing they did was make it all use the same set. or better yet disable set bonuses in pvp and just make it all pvp gear. cant balance pvp properly if pve sets are giving unfair advantages to some classes
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Wrong. Comestics, rating, achievements, etc are what motivate people to play. Gear is what you have to do in order to get all of the above.
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If you truly believe basic CD knowledge and being able to interrupt will get your average player 2400 it’s almost laughable.
The problem is the players who have pvp’d for years don’t see it from your average players perspective, they are completely ignorant and incapable of seeing it. PvP numbers wouldn’t be in the state it’s in if what you’re saying was actually the case.
I’ve played many games where the skill gap just gets so high that the game slowly kills itself because it’s inaccessible to new players and at the end of the day, casuals make up the majority of a games playerbase
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The conquest “increase” actually is terrible with them removing the vault. It’ll take even longer now to get fully geared. The devs clearly dont play their own game.
I agree.
In fact, and I’ll say this again, there should be PvP dedicated servers with a “choose your character” option where you get a lvl 70, and you get gear vendors, and just go at it.
If people are scared that this will make people leave the game, just add cosmetics as rewards for achieving levels, add a battle pass and make this game be a 2024 game.
Every other game in the world is addopting this model, and this would not impact PvE servers at all.
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I’m not saying those can’t motivate people but let’s put it this way.
If warfronts didn’t drop any gear would there have been less or more people do them every week. Or when pvp in season 1 Shadowlands dropped good gear for pve it had a much more bigger playerbase.
I agree that pushing more cosmetics is also a good way but I also wouldn’t underestimate how much of a “power gamer” playerbase wow has.
I’ve played guild wars 2 for at least 6 months I think mainly for pvp but guild wars is still a way smaller game than wow is. It does work quite well for its playerbase but it also bored me after a while which I guess I’m not alone. They did put a skill progression system for world vs world which I guess is something. I don’t remember pvp being that much worth when it came to gold tho.
Yes but the thing you aren’t looking at is that people weren’t doing PvP in shadowlands because they enjoyed it. They were doing it purely for PVE reasons to get the gear to help them in the content they actually wanted to play. You basically proved it by saying nobody would have done warfronts if not for the gear, at the end of the day warfronts were bad and people didn’t actually want to do it
Adding good gear rewards in PvP is just artificially inflating the numbers by forcing people to do it and not actually solving the problems of why nobody wants to do it in the first place. Once people got that gear in shadowlands they stopped pvping.
Cosmetics definitely do help but at the same time if it’s something tied behind a rating that your average player looks at as unachievable they won’t bother to do it in the first place. Like ya gladiator mounts are cool, but only a small fraction of the playerbase doing PvP will even get them anyways so it’s not really a selling point to get a new player in there
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I think it’s a bit of both, while they might go too far for some content if there’s nothing to get from pvp less people will want to do it. In BFA I mostly did it only to get one piece of azerith each season I didn’t dislike it but if it wasn’t there I would feel like I’m wasting my time there. A bit the same problem with warmode, unless it has enough rewards I don’t see the point in a world where you can simply turn it off.
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I agree and disagree at the same time. Look at m+, most serious m+ players are fully geared a few weeks into a season but play the full 6 months knowing there is no loot to be gained and are doing it out of pure enjoyment of progression.
I think the problem with PvP has nothing to do with rewards or cosmetics, and has everything to do with the content itself and the barrier to entry for most players.
PVE is something any player can go into and learn and improve upon each run and see their progression and feel the reward of completing it. PvP is something you either have the skill level to succeed or you don’t, and it’s not something that’s easily learned considering you’re facing another player that’s not a scripted fight to memorize so it automatically makes it a harder mode to get into.
Getting more gear in PvP for your average player isn’t going to make them better the same way it would in pve. You still have to read and react to what the other player is doing and counter it which is something people who have PvP’d for a long time underestimate how hard it is
You go into PvP and constantly get stun locked and killed in seconds, most players first thought will be “this is stupid”, and won’t want to continue doing it. It’s simply not fun to lose control of your character as often as it happens in PvP. And while skilled players know how to counter this, your average player doesn’t
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Welcome to why I don’t pvp anymore.
Because WoW’s gameplay loop is centered around improving your character through gear. It’s as simple as that.
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