There’s a weird amount of “Its Blizzard’s game they can do what they want make your own game then” in this thread. Obviously its Blizzard’s game. That doesn’t mean people can’t voice their opinion and give feedback on what they want.
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Gear progression mattered less for the VAST majority of WoW players from Vanilla through WotLK. Most people never looked at raiding at all and didn’t care for it. They just enjoyed the content they could access. Hell, the only times I enjoyed PvP was what was essentially beer-league BGs in Vanilla BEFORE most people took it seriously.
As raiding and other hardcore content have become more prominent over the years, the playerbase has shrunk bit by bit.
Most people do NOT play video games seriously, period. It’s entertainment and a hobby, either you’re having fun right now or you’re not. If you’re not having fun right now, you’re not going to bother finding out if you’re having fun later.
I don’t see the problem still. If you’re running it solo, then it doesn’t matter. If your whole group agrees to run it that way, then it doesn’t matter.
No different than people using skips in M+ as I’m sure Blizz didn’t intentionally add mobs for you to not kill.
People keep bringing up the point that you only get timed after the 10th floor and you’ve gotten the relevant rewards, but that only makes it worse. If you’re only moving forward as a challenge, and the first 10 are the ones that give rewards, it sounds backwards to me. lol
No timer on the part that grants rewards, but a timer on the part you’re doing for fun. Ok.
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I disagree that gear progression mattered less, but at this point we are just grasping at straws.
You can raid and participate in m+ without taking video games “seriously”.
I don’t feel I take WoW “seriously”, yet I am able to participate in mythic raiding. But then again, it depends on the flexible definition of “seriously”.
They have more mobs than required for the add percentage. So I am gonna go with “yes, they did add mobs you were not going to be required to kill”. Sometimes adding mobs just adds to the ambiance of the zone.
I don’t know anything about it, I’m not in alpha and can’t comment.
I was just clarifying OP’s hyperbole.
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Does anyone actually think that doing hard floors in Torghast should be required to be competitive in raids, M+, and PvP?
This rings true from my experience, too. I spent most of vanilla leveling and even after hitting 60, I spent a lot of time just grinding out Tier 0 from dungeons, PvPing in AV, etc. Raiding didn’t enter the equation until like 1.9 or 1.10, and even then it was just ZG/MC/Ony/AQ20. Similarly, the furthest I got in TBC was Kara and heroic dungeons. In WotLK I finally got around to running an “end of xpac” raid with ICC, but that only happened because patch 3.3.5 stuck around for so long, there being robust gearing systems via badges, and ICC being so pug friendly.
To be frank, I think you’ve been isolated within the hardcore facet of the community for so long that you’ve lost all touch with what the other aspects of the community are interested in.
The same could be said of Blizz in general when it comes to WoW, or at least it feels like that.
I can agree on that, though I would posit that your definition does not align with majority. Whether or not that is true is up for someone besides either of us to decide.
That being said, I think it’s time to drop this.
Now all that’s left to do is get the last word in.
To be frank, I am not sure you really know what my playstyle actually is. What I value in game, what I spend my time doing in game. I find it just a touch annoying.
But I am fine dopping it. 
No, I and many players are getting fairly tired of the intertwining of loot systems. PvP is even more of a joke than it was before BfA.
I can see some one like yourself saying that towards me , but I really don’t care about what goes on in the pve community except what happens in the pvp community .
Pvp is probably done in shadowlands , but I am getting ready for the next expansion . THE 1# IN THE NEXT EXPANSION IS TO FIX PVP . once and for all .
If we’re not told how to play at all times, and if we’re not getting our hands slapped when we try to do anything different, how would we enjoy ourselves?
Well, that’s subjective. It weakens it for me in some cases. What would add to the ambiance is if all the mobs in dungeons were more natural and not just standing around waiting to be killed. Have them performing tasks, playing cards, asleep in their bunkers. Then THOSE you could try to sneak by and it would make more sense.
And having eyesight of more than ten yards lol
I think aggro in general works by sense of smell. 
LoS isn’t line of sight, it’s line of scent.
Here’s what Torments should do.
Imagine a perfectly-efficient Torghast group. They are willing to do whatever it takes to climb the tower. At the highest difficulty they can manage, that means waiting for all cooldowns on every pull – unless there’s some reason not to do so. This is our problem: that’s not fun to play, but it’s the right way to play if you want to win.
Its towards the bottom on https://www.wowhead.com/bluetracker?topic=143250®ion=eu not about “gospel” muskwa, its about being told what I need to think is fun and not caring about players opinions…
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You pay to play their game. Remember that.
I and many others are tired of being treated like we’re just along for the ride and not paying for anything; I’m getting off the bus. If you want to brown nose on your dime then go right ahead.
Thats like saying I went to a restaurant and they didn’t ask me what food I wanted they brought out whatever they felt.
then Billytehkid replies- remember you pay to eat at their restaurant…
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Because it’s their game and their rules.
Don’t like it, make your own MMO.