Why are people so obsessed with Hunter being melee?

[Tripi-barthilas]

That is good imo

[Bepples-barthilas]

All that talk and still not a valid defense of removing a core mechanic of the spec to address a wonky interaction with a short-lived stat that wasn’t even overpowered.

Do you think they were right to remove the initial tick of Serpent Sting?

What about MoP, SV’s all-time height as a spec, before Multistrike even existed?

[Emowan-cenarion-circle]

Because its fun.
Because there’s a lot of lore and class fantasy from some of our favorite heros behind it.

as for your logic, its is so full of fallacies it could be a textbook on them.

[Toxiktraktør-thrall]

@Plzrespond-dalaran

Nope

idk homie looking at the talents its pretty melee to me. I know just because they also had a bow it meant to operate like MM but lets be honest here

@Plzrespond-dalaran

dont make up things so you can nerd rage about it

you did this with survival from 2004, also Im not wrong

@Plzrespond-dalaran

Again i’ve never said they were the same you need to work on your rage issues. Im saying that there is alot of unexplored space for ranged weapons, melee dps should have more specs than ranged weapon users since there is more fantasy to cover but right now all the ranged weapon fantasy is crammed into 1-2 specs.

You on some molly if you got rage out of this response

@Plzrespond-dalaran

You were the one suggesting picking explosive shot for MM to replace survival. And while spells change alot of them still fill the same space in rotations. Explosive shot is one of the abilities that no longer does that, plus a large draw of old explosive shot was how good it felt with lock and load procs which it no longer has access to aswell.

you really on the stuff tonight if this is what you wanna roll with.

@Bepples-barthilas

If Blizzard arbitrarily deletes people’s playstyle choices those people should stand up for themselves.

Demo and Combat rogue players seem to be chilling pretty fine so

@Bepples-barthilas

I’ve never seen a Rogue complain about this and if they did I would dismiss them as a stupid person.

You literally think 4 of the specs in the game are the same thing because they dont stand at 40yards

@Bepples-barthilas

Yeah people say this a lot but they sure do end up making fools of themselves.

You literally just told me 2 days ago Democrats have never done anything wrong in all of American history and blamed it all on the other team

[Bepples-barthilas]

“Classic” Hunter players (quotation marks very much needed there) sure do a lot of forgetting about how agility gave 2 ranged attack power and 1 melee attack power per point, and how Survival gave +15% agility.

[Toxiktraktør-thrall]

Nobody forgot we could read. We also remember how the talents were set up so

[Plzrespond-dalaran]

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

idk homie looking at the talents its pretty melee to me. I know just because they also had a bow it meant to operate like MM but lets be honest here

Even if you went deep survival you would still dps from ranged, you would only go melee if you had no other choice.

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

You on some molly if you got rage out of this response

You keep making up things so you can argue about them you need to chill.

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

@Bepples-barthilas

It was a solid spec when it was ranged with Explosive Shot from WotLK to WoD

Marksmen can use it too now, so you are free to live out that dumb playstyle again

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

@Plzrespond-dalaran

Explosive shot is a completly different ability today than it was then

I really hate to be the guy to tell you this, but literally every spell in the game is a different ability in some way then when it was first introduced in some way.

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

@Plzrespond-dalaran

You were the one suggesting picking explosive shot for MM to replace survival. And while spells change alot of them still fill the same space in rotations. Explosive shot is one of the abilities that no longer does that, plus a large draw of old explosive shot was how good it felt with lock and load procs which it no longer has access to aswell.

you really on the stuff tonight if this is what you wanna roll with.

I have no idea why you keep making stuff up so you then can rage about them on the forums.

[Graou-terokkar]

@Bepples-barthilas

All that talk and still not a valid defense of removing a core mechanic of the spec to address a wonky interaction with a short-lived stat that wasn’t even overpowered.

But it was very much overpowered for SV to the point you could easily drop 20 ilvl on an armor slot to swap for multistrike and increase your DPS.
On the other hand mastery was incredibly weak. They removed the initial tick of SS AND buffed essence of the viper at the same time but it was clearly not enough (ES nerf to compensate for mastery was stupid imo). This should have happened way earlier in WoD and tune SV accordingly. The buffs came way too late in HFC and MM was still way stronger anyway with all the target swapping.

@Bepples-barthilas

Do you think they were right to remove the initial tick of Serpent Sting?

Not that late in the xpac no.

[Asthelon-area-52]

Just kind of crazy such a “well designed spec” entirely hinged on the initial tick of serpent sting if you ask me

[Bepples-barthilas]

@Graou-terokkar

But it was very much overpowered for SV to the point you could easily drop 20 ilvl on an armor slot to swap for multistrike and increase your DPS.

On the other hand mastery was incredibly weak. They removed the initial tick of SS AND buffed essence of the viper at the same time but it was clearly not enough (ES nerf to compensate for mastery was stupid imo). This should have happened way earlier in WoD and tune SV accordingly. The buffs came way too late in HFC and MM was still way stronger anyway with all the target swapping.

Wow maybe they shouldn’t have tuned SV around it to the point of making Multistrike SV’s attuned stat. This isn’t an excuse for removing the initial tick.

@Graou-terokkar

Not that late in the xpac no.

The correct answer is that it was never the right thing to do. It was a key part of the spec going back several years, and they even brought it back for Serpent Sting’s reintroduction in BFA. If they were worried about the multistrike interaction, they should have fixed the multistrike interaction. This wasn’t even an issue since SV was already underpowered going into 6.2 due to its damage profile not fitting that raid and the nonsense that was the legendary ring, and they were going to remove multistrike anyway. There was no urgent problem, meaning it was another Blizzard-invented non-issue to disguise an ulterior motive.

Didn’t you say you were giving up several posts ago? Why are you still here insisting on dying on this particular hill of all things?

@Asthelon-area-52

Just kind of crazy such a “well designed spec” entirely hinged on the initial tick of serpent sting if you ask me

It’s crazy to pretend it was a design flaw. Having SV add an initial tick to Serpent Sting provided a powerful and unique bonus to an otherwise classwide ability. Because back then, believe it or not, they actually cared about class identity. So some aspects of each spec were shared while the spec they represented had unique improvements to them. Having this as the primary mode of AoE was a very simple and effective way to make SV a strong AoE spec with a fun playstyle.

Lots of specs in the game have key mechanics; removing which would gut a spec’s viability. It’s nonsense to judge a spec by the standard of “does it still hold up if we start arbitrarily tearing parts out of it”.

[Asthelon-area-52]

@Bepples-barthilas

they actually cared about class identity

they clearly care about it now too, what an absurd thing to imply. each spec right now plays a lot different from each other. don’t be so dramatic

@Bepples-barthilas

fun playstyle.

pressing multi shot was a fun playstyle?

[Jinday-ravencrest]

@Plzrespond-dalaran

And it was the most popular spec back in WoD when it was a triple ranged DPS so its not like people do not like the fantasy of being a Bow/gun wielder.

It was not most popular. It performed well so it was picked by majority because of The performance. SV is considered least played spec , but when they made spec perform good in M+ and raids , suddenly it was only picked hunter spec.

I will not deny that it had more popularity then current SV spec, but calling it the most popular spec it’s completely wrong.

[Plzrespond-dalaran]

That was a typo i was talking about hunters being the most popular class by a large margin when they were tripple ranged dps so it seems that people vibe with the fantasy. However when survival is strong it does not dominate the other hunter specs in % of players in a similar way than when BM or MM is strong or even back when SV ranged and strong.

[Asthelon-area-52]

@Plzrespond-dalaran

i was talking about hunters being the most popular class by a large margin when they were tripple ranged dps

do you have any evidence to back this up? I feel like very consistently druid and paladin are the most popular classes

[Plzrespond-dalaran]

Mentioned it above, warcraft logs. You can also look for babylonius google sheet where he tracked spec po
oulation numbers and % but he only covers WoD to nathria, there is a wowhead article on it you can google for if you want a link. His numbers might also be just from the last two weeks of each tier, dont remeber exactly was a while since i deeped dived into the numbers.

[Orimbooze-emerald-dream]

Having no experience with SV hunters I do however have a Marksman (yeah I know the flavor fav) One issue I’ve noticed, and this is with every MMO I’ve ever played. Most NPC’s tend to be melee, and melee with a gun is counter productive! I wonder what would happen if the closer something got to you the higher chance of crit went up. Melee range, you crit all the time. One aimed shot to the face and it’s all over for you!

[Toxiktraktør-thrall]

@Plzrespond-dalaran

Even if you went deep survival you would still dps from ranged, you would only go melee if you had no other choice.

Its pretty much exactly how it is now

@Plzrespond-dalaran

You keep making up things so you can argue about them you need to chill.

you the one saying I was raging lol so whos really making up reality here

@Plzrespond-dalaran

I have no idea why you keep making stuff up so you then can rage about them on the forums.

I dont, I point out the flaws in peoples points or mock the silliness that is spewed here. If I were to rage here I would end up seeing you next year when Im aloud to post again

[Ogdenir-alleria (Ogdenir)]

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

idk homie looking at the talents its pretty melee to me. I know just because they also had a bow it meant to operate like MM but lets be honest here

Lacerate was the only melee DoT that Hunter’s had. It was the 31-point talent in Survival Hunter’s tree and requires a melee weapon. However, it’s damage was worse than a Rank 4 Serpent Sting, because of this it was considered the worst Talent in the game, let alone worst 31 point talent in the game. Very few people ever took it for anything other than a joke. So, in less than a year after its introduction it was removed in Patch 1.7.0 (2005-09-13) for Wyvern Sting a completely ranged ability.

Survival Hunter was not a melee spec it was that its tree improved on traps and melee abilities. Just as Beast Mastery made pets stronger and Marksmanship increased ranged abilities potential.

Classic Hunters were a range class with melee abilities that we used when it was necessary. You didn’t start off with a pet until level 10, so you needed those melee abilities for survival as it was not always easy to get away. Hunter were always designed for range combat first.

[Plzrespond-dalaran]

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

Its pretty much exactly how it is now

No you want to stay melee now, you only attack from range if you have no other options.

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

you the one saying I was raging lol so whos really making up reality here

@Toxiktraktør-thrall

I dont, I point out the flaws in peoples points or mock the silliness that is spewed here. If I were to rage here I would end up seeing you next year when Im aloud to post again

You keep trying to argue points people do not make. You try to bend the truth so you can continue to argue. And you say things and then turn around and deny saying them even if we just scroll up and see that you said them. You need to relax this is a gaming forum, if you wanna talking about how much you love survival, do it. Just stop lying and talk about why you love it instead.

[Weedgoku-illidan]

because d&d ranger can be either melee or ranged, duh