Next time yoy get in a fight be sure not to punch back! I’m sure the other guy will eventually see the error of his ways as his fists start feeling sore from hitting your unguarded face.
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Back from my silence, you finally got your wish, just took Blizz longer to respond.
Again, the residential district of said pyramid was hardly fortified, so that excuse is not a good one.
Not when invaders are already slaughtering civilians. Not sure about you, but when I see people setting free wild beasts and cataclysmic forces rampaging through the city with no regard for collateral damage, I will not assume that my life is spared because I was cornered by one of their aggressive wild beasts and am suddenly begging for my life, unlike the others who just tried to run away.
It means that these Molten Giants will lash out at anything, holding them back and stopping them would be considered Dark Shamanism because they would force their will on it, since the nature around Dazar’alor was not dieing, it wasn’t Dark Shamanism and thusly leet it rampage without a leash, meaning that Molten Giant will lash out at anything, soldier and civilian alike.
I reserve the right to call out the people who claim murdering innocents is bad and then say that it is okay as long as my faction does it because I feel justified in doing it. The Zandalari had nothing to do with the Burning of Teldrassil, blaming them for it and saying that because they are Horde, they deserve to be killed and slaughtered is hypocritical if you say that Teldrassil is bad.
Yes, they are speaking of the rogues that were told to strike certain targets, on Horde side that person tells you that we are ACTUALLY ordered to not kill civilians, but when you do it as the hero, the rogue congratulates you instead of telling you to stop, which leads to believe that the order was to not kill civilians but soldiers acting out against it. Which is fine right? I mean people justify Dazar’alor by saying those were some soldiers just not following orders.
That is wrong, let me give you the proper example of what happened:
One person punches you in the face, you are mad, you punch the person who was snickering in the face because you don’t like that he is friends with the person who punched you.
The Zandalari have nothing to do with who started this war, and the Alliance had more then one chance to try and stop them from joining the Horde by peaceful means, instead they tried to stop them by invading their city, killing civilians, killing their priests, defiling their holy sites and (in their eyes) threatening the Zandalari with enslavement, and murdering their King for not agreeing with their ridiculous demands. So, instead, pushing them in the arms of the Horde as they usually do, by proving Sylvanas right.
There was no civilians at stormheim. Genn attack Forsaken soldiers Horde response by killing Alliance civilians.
He still attcked without any provocation while the world was ending, and because of what the Horde did, and fine, if you think Teldrassil is bad, that is your opinion that is fine, what bothers me is when people claim Dazar’alor was fine when they stand on their moral soapbox about how killing civilians is bad.
And yet, you learned nothing.
They weren’t.
You mean controlled elementals.
Corralled for your own safety.
On their own maybe, but they were not on their own. They Dark Iron bargained for their aid, and we do not know the conditions of that contract.
Only if it is forcible, not if it was a mutually agreed contract.
Considering Dark Shamanism will kill the surrounding land, its clear that this wasn’t Dark Shamanism.
No one is saying that. The Alliance was not actively killing civilians.
They are aiding the faction that is responsible. which makes them a valid military target. Just because civilians were present for the battle doesn’t mean the Alliance was slaughtering them indiscriminately like the Horde was doing, and we have evidence to suggest the Alliance wasn’t actively slaughtering civilians at all.
No, they are speaking of the Horde in general. On Alliance side, we see a lot more civilian deaths than just some poisoned people in their beds (even though we saw that too).
There was plenty of provocation given the questlines in Azuna, which canonically come before Stormheim.
Again, the Alliance did not actively kill civilians in Dazar’alor.
800 posts and no real rebuttals. No amount of brigading can silence the truth!
I am used to it, so far the only arguments they brought is: They aren’t civilians. Which is not a argument at all, considering they are applying circumstances to dead civilians. Which is a thing I could do to the dead civilians of Teldrassil too.
…. You mean, a rebuttal to everything? The Horde doesn’t have a leg to stand on here. The Alliance didn’t commit any war crimes in Dazar’alor. Sorry, we’re not the Horde. War Crimes are the Horde’s thing.
If they are fighting, they are not civilians. They are combatants.
No, you are applying circumstance to dead civilians, because you are making the claim that this was genocide, which there is no evidence for.
No you can’t, because there is no question about the circumstances of Kaldorei deaths in Teldrassil, where as Dazar’alor, it is unclear.
You have no argument.
The circumstance is that each dead Kaldorei civilian could have been a freedom fighter and a rebel which would have caused the lives of many Horde Soldiers, thusly the burning of Teldrassil is justified, mind you that is a legitimate argument and the reason why I support Teldrassil and mind you, why I support Dazar’alor as well.
Could have been, but wasn’t, is the point. They never had the opportunity to be a freedom fighters, which is not the case for the Zandalari.
You have no argument, and honestly, you should be ashamed for making such a morally stunted comparison.
You are the one making the same argument, you assume because some fight back because they had no choice that obviously all the dead fought back. I make the argument that all civilians on Teldrassil would have been in essence combatants sooner or later. My argument is no different from yours.
The civilians of Teldrassil didn’t have the opportunity to fight back at all.
Thing is, they would have, thusly, combatants. Thusly, the Horde didn’t kill civilians, they annihalated combatants while destroying a military target.
You don’t know if they would or would not have. The only difference between a civilian and a combatant is a combatant is actively trying to kill you. The civilians of Teldrassil never had the opportunity.
Thing is, they could have, just like the dead civilians in Dazar’alor could have, see you are giving agency to dead people, only I am being consistent about it.
Not the point. The Zandalari Civilians had the opportunity to fight back, and many of them did. The same can not be said for the Civilians in Teldrassil.
We are left with this.
Every civilians in Teldrassil was an innocent. They were not combatants, if they were, they would have been in Darkshore, as it was said by Terran Gregory and the Novellas, that everyone capable of fighting was rallied to fight the Horde in Darkshore. Even non-military. So everyone in Teldrasssil were either to old, to young, to sick, or to injured to fight.
Even if there was any doubt that this was not the case, they are still innocent civilians until they take action to show otherwise, which there was no opportunity for them to do so.
So we KNOW for a FACT that those who died in Teldrassil were innocent civilians. Where as the dead in Dazar’alor is not so obvious.
Furthermore, Sylvanas went against her own War Plan to burn Teldrassil. Burning Teldrassil cost her the entire war, now that the Horde is within weeks of defeat. The original plan to hold Teldrassil hostage to deter the Alliance from counter attacking, was completely thrown out the window with the burning to Teldrassil. So EVEN IF the civilians in Teldrassil WERE combatants, the Horde has no reason to kill them all because capturing them alive was the only reason why they invaded to begin with.
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There were two reasons for our attack, one, occupy Teldrassil, but to do so we have to achieve goal b first: Kill Malfurion, which Saurfang refused, so occupying the Tree would not have guaranteed her a victory, considering that they would have just staged a rebellion as the Gilneans did when she had warprisoners working for her in the mines. They just were freed by their leader and staged a rebellion. So she has knowledge of how this works
No you don’t… That was an after thought. The capturing of Teldrassil was to deter an Alliance counter attack, Malfurion’s death had nothing to do with that.
This is besides the point. The burning to Teldrassil was Genocide. The attack on Dazar’alor was not. Period.
^Before we even head out to Ashenvale, Sylvanas says it from the get go: Malfurion must die.
This is an awkward inconsistency between A Good War and the questline. She tells us in the questline that’s a goal. In A Good War she notes it as nice, but unnecessary. And it only becomes an issue because his ‘miraculous survival’ would give the Night Elves the hope to resist.
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