Is it news that the Alliance isn’t above killing civilians? I mean…go do the goblin introduction again.
The Horde is much more proficient at it, though.
There was no Zandalari interaction before this that suggested they weren’t a hostile nation as a whole, unlike the Alliance. Even many of the ones who had previously cooperated with us on Yojamba, such as Jin’rokh or Al’tabim, had turned around and attacked. These two scenarios aren’t comparable.
I’m not just talking about Dazar’alor. I’m talking about the entirety of the troll tribes history. The Gurubashi, Amani, and Farraki are beaten basically into submission, even now by the Horde. The Drakkari and Shadowtooth are nigh extinct. The lesser troll tribes are little more than extra bodies in a constantly dwindling army.
Dunno if you did the same quest I did, but most of Stormsong’s people tried running for their lives and ended up getting skewered in front of their children.
Because what you were doing is evil and goes against the values of the Horde that Thrall and Baine’s father started.
Just because he is doing things you don’t like doesn’t make him an Alliance character. Saurfang isn’t an Alliance character either.
Rexxar is Horde, as he was named Champion of the Horde. Rahstakhan never that much of a relationship with the Horde.
Not everything has a payoff. That’s life. You guys are fighting on behalf of an evil faction. Get ready to lose.
there is a difference between not expecting everything to have a payoff and not expecting ANYTHING to have a pay off. Currently for the horde, it is the second one.
I know i used to complain how the horde was flat out ignored in legion storytelling, but now i miss the days when blizzard forgot the Horde even existed. That would be preferable at this point.
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Just because the game doesn’t bother to show them, doesn’t mean the Zandalari don’t HAVE those things. The city, the ships, their armor, weapons, and ornamentation…all of those things came from somewhere. Blizzard is just extremely bad at remembering societies have infrastructures.
The loss of the Zandalari fleet is a blow, certainly, but they surely must have the infrastructure to rebuild it, and there are acres of jungle and rainforest to provide the raw materials.
Of course, this requires Blizzard to remember that the fleet wasn’t actually created from thin air by the will of the devs, and that logically a nation which relies on its fleet would always have at least a few vessels in drydock for repairs, and others being built…which is a lot to expect from Blizz.
Teldrassil
Also G’huun
You guys gained more from teldrassil than the horde did.
Our payoff was “you are monsters, you dont deserve to live.” Teldressil is the exact opposite of a payoff. It has done nothing but bite us in the butt every single step of the way.
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Indeed we are, and it is apparently news to the Alliance players who try to ignore it. Because you know: Horde does it: OUTRAGE! Alliance does it: Yeah!
All interactions that the Horde had with the Alliance is hostile. So they are justified too?
Point granted.
I did see quite a few fighting back, and justifiably so, if you can’t run and are being cornered by a soldier that wants to kill you, the reasonable response: Fight back.
Thrall wasn’t a pansy back then, thrall was more then willing to fight the Alliance, he had one hand out for peace, with his other on his hammer. So no, and Cairne was much the same way. Baine is not Cairne, not even close. He stands by as his people get slaughtered in Taurajo and banishes the survivors who want vengeance. He allows the Grimtotem to leave and band together with the Alliance. He warns Jaina of a attack from the Horde on her city which was hi-jacked by the Alliance as their staging point to fight in the Barrens. Everything Baine has done, has been for the Alliance, never for the Horde.
See above.
Teldrassil is the only viable one for this war. Let us see, what has the Alliance done?
-Stopped our allegiance with the San’layn.
-Destroyed one of our allies and nearly broke them.
-Made all of our war-campaigns basically a waste of effort
-Lordaeron
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Not really. Some people just have to make a strawman out of the idea.
not neccessarily, no but:
-we DO see all of these things for the kul tirans
-zanadalar control a mere fraction of their own island
-zandalar has virtually no settlements of any kind outside of their city
I don’t know what you expect us to do with all these burnt Night Elf baby corpses.
It was a payoff… You guys got to destroy our city, and strike the biggest emotional blow to the Alliance in WoW history, and lose next to nothing in return. Maybe you didn’t want that, but you can’t deny that it is a Horde victory.
Not when he was wrong and the Horde was burning people alive and making undead mind slaves.
Baine is the only person standing up to Sylvanas, who is making the Horde more like the Scourge in it’s deeds.
And this does not make him an Alliance character, that makes him a Horde character. Perhaps the truest Horde character left.
Good
Good
Good
Where the Horde plagued more Alliance, than the Alliance actually gained.
The Horde wasn’t wrong, the Alliance started this war, Sylvanas was shot in the back, she took said arrow and shot it back. Simple as that.
Not a counter-argument that the writers are obviously prefering the Alliance and giving them all the benefits of winning nearly anything, not because they are stronger or smarter, but because of sloppy writing, plot armor and deus ex machinas.
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Crocodile tears.
Oh look, the person who has literally no arguments returns, reported for spam.
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You know damn well this is false.
Yes - much like furious merchants and those who stayed and fought in Taurajo. Them? Fair game. The Brennadam invasion itself? Unwarranted and unprovked. The numerous civilians attempting to only flee - aka, the majority I’m referring to? Killed all the same.
“lose next to nothing”
Alliance lose a city and some civilians. They gain savage night elves, nightwarrior, and non neutral savage malfurion
Due to teldrassil horde:
loses UC
Baine/Saurfan betrays the horde
our leaders are all torn apart about the Horde.
We are constantly reminded we are bad and should feel bad and that we are doomed.
Horde gained NOTHING from Teldrassil. If you are better off doing nothing, then there was no payoff to your action. Hell, teldrassil was a bigger psychological shock to the horde than to the alliance.
They didn’t fight, they wanted to escape but were slaughtered by the Alliance, but Baineduin Bloodrynn didn’t do anything about it, he even banished those who wanted vengeance for the slaughter of their loved ones. Again, those civilians were backed in a corner, it was either lay down and die or fight. It wouldn’t have mattered if they hadn’t picked up weapons or not, the Alliance would have killed them either way.
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You cant be serious.
God, we really gonna talk about Taurajo again? Alright…
No, it was not one of those two options, the Alliance purposefully left a huge break in their ranks to allow the civilians an exit - which the majority took. The ones who died were the ones who fought,
Nope.
Anger flooded Saurfang’s mind. He knew he wasn’t hiding it well, but he didn’t care. “Are you so eager for another war? After all we’ve seen?.. You are not Garrosh Hellscream. Why do you want to throw the Horde into the meat grinder again?" -Saurfang in A Good War
The context heavily implying that the Alliance and the Horde were not at war yet, and the two are discussion going to war.
The Horde started the War. Officially stated in the Lore. Simple as that.
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