Story Forum threads never truly die.
They just fade away until someone necros them 4 months to four years later, and the same argument starts anew.
Story Forum is the Shadowlands.
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When you put it like that, you’re right. And it is always the same conversation each time. Horde and alliance bias stuff. I swear, I’ve seen this happened in cata where it was horde bias having everything and the alliance not getting anything. Now the shoe is on the other foot
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Yes. Tell me, if the person who complains the most about their preferred characters not getting the spotlight accuses others of just whining when their preferred characters are not in the spotlight, what is that if not entitled?
I am honestly not sure what you even mean here. The chain was obviously a part of a back and forth where Erevien was trying to paint the Alliance players as doing as all the things he does.
And what truth do you think you in his claim that Alliance players are “entitled kids that always complain when their leaders aren’t the center of attention?” Because that was the post being responded to.
Erevein did not make a true statement. A true statement would be:
Some players (among both Horde and Alliance) complain when their preferred characters are not in the spotlight. Some players (again, among both Horde and Alliance) are just entitled kids.
Honestly, most aren’t. Most try to have decent conversations. Entitled children complaining when the characters they want are not the focus of the story are generally the minority. Many, like Everien can be very loud. But in terms of actual numbers of players, they aren’t that large of a percent.
I agree, that is also true.
And if you slog through Erevien’s posts I am sure you could find a non-zero number that are completely true. And if you were calling someone out for responding negatively to one of those posts you would have a case, and I would even back you on it. But that is not what happened here.
The response was to a false statement made by Erevien accusing the Alliance player base of doing what Erevien himself does more than anyone else here.
They can be, sure.
So, maybe don’t say ‘Erevien is sometimes right’ when it is in relation to a post he made that is petty, spiteful, proudful and ignorant.
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I mean, sure his Avatar is around a lot. But so many people Alt swap to sock puppet themselves, I just don’t buy it.
Erevien is one of the few folks who uses the same avatar regardless of all the guff he gets. So, people can and do hold him to account.
However, I remember during BfA, there was a flood of low level Night Elf Forum Posting Alts (or NEFPA) that were probably the same couple of people just making new Alts to flood the Forum about Night Elf issues.
They would also dramatically disappear with some sad tale about life being unfair, only to roll another Alt to spam the forums.
And so many folks say they aren’t posting here only then they come back on some Alt and pretend like nothing ever happened - and they know every thing about every poster, while no one knows what they posted before.
Personally, there has been too many new random low post count/low lvl avatars parroting the same tripe, for me to pretend they are each individuals.
Like someone said earlier “what’s with these low level Alts coming out of the wood work? did one of the toxic discords implode or something?”
Why not? If he agrees. He even said :
It’s short hand, if nothing else. Take from it what you will.
I agree to an extent with the spirit of Erevien’s point, though not the precise wording. Heck, I am an Alliance Player, I have 4 Alliance characters at 80 and 4 Hordies at 80 (I like my Hordies more though).
I usually use the term “posters” instead of “players” myself, in the forums. Like I will say “Alliance Posters this and that” or “Horde posters this and that” because the Players themselves aren’t often reflected by the posters.
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Your argument is we cannot know who alt swaps and who doesn’t so that means people do it enough to hide the fact they are actually doing more than him. Basically, we don’t know so you know…
Few? How do you figure you know that? Are there people that do? Probably. Saying even half the people would be a pretty extraordinary claim, which would require pretty significant evidence to back it up. Going every further and saying it is only a few that don’t is something you need really compelling evidence to make that extraordinary of a claim.
And your evidence? You are making claims based on guesses about what some people might do. Did it happen some? Again, probably. But you are making some pretty significant claims of fact that you are really just your guesses.
I get where you are going. I just don’t think there is justification for the hard conclusions you are making. So, let’s take this specific point.
Are there other reasons you would see a lot of low level alts? Sure.
Maying a toxic discord or forum did implode. Most of those alts could just be population from that other source. People that like to hid behind the anonymity of of the internet and use alts instead of posting on mains.
Maybe it is just because of the lull in content that more players are coming to the forums. And, like above they don’t want to put their main our there.
The point is, deciding that it is only a few posters who are not using many alts is jumping to a conclusion not supported by facts. Based on nothing more than ‘it could be.’
I was trying to give him the benefit of the doubt. He seemed to be condemning the petty, spiteful, prideful, and ignorant tendencies of humans. While he might just be lacking self awareness when doing it, given the two options I choose to proceed from the better option and assume he didn’t agree with the petty, spiteful, prideful, and ignorant take.
If I am wrong to give him the benefit of the doubt, he is welcome to correct me and let me know he really believes the prideful, petty, spiteful, and ignorant take.
I hope I am reading this wrong. Do you honestly believe the Alliance player base or even posters are really any different than Horde players/posters? I hope not. Because that would be a really idiotic take. The reality is that people are people. Whether someone has more fun with the Horde or Alliance doesn’t change the likelihood of them being problems. There are Alliance posters that do it. There are Horde posters that do it. It is NOT something unique to either group.
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You made this blanket assertion :
And you have no way of knowing that as a true statement. You just expect everyone to buy your clap trap.
You don’t even limit it to the forums or anything. You talk about the players. You have no way of knowing how much players are complaining about anything. Much less who is Alt posting on sock puppets.
I might complain more times about the Horde being mistreated by the Devs before breakfast than Erevien, for all you know.
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I am going along the lines of Carl Sagan and Occum’'s razor. We see more from him than anyone else. The simplest explanation is that he posts more. You posit that others actually do more, they just do it on alts. Well, you are the one presenting a claim that is counter to the available evidence. The more extraordinary the claim, the more evidence is required for it. Your claim is the more extraordinary. So, until you provide evidence that anyone posts more complaining about it than I have seen him doing, I am going with the simplest explanation. He does it more than anyone else.
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Your claim was about Players. There are players who don’t go on the forums, there are players who complain in game and on other social media sites.
I tend to keep claims to the forums, since that is what we are talking about. You made a claim about the players, with no way of proving it.
Bringing up Carl Sagan doesn’t make you right.
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All blizzard has to do is separate the forums into people who like the story and people who don’t like the story and I guarantee, you will not have any of these arguments ever again.
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Might not stop it completely. But it would certainly go a long way to stop the fighting about events that are over 15+ yrs old and haven’t been relevant or bought up in game since
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I can (sort of) see people upset about the lack of Horde representation, there are in fact a lack of main Horde characters right now (tho we are literally getting a Goblin patch AND expac centered in Silvermoon) but when it comes to the old OLD lore?
Its ridiculous…
“Remember when you guys did this thing ten years ago?!”
“…No?”
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Well, I meant more How many times is this forum going to argue over the purge. Amani this or Amani that, Arthas wasn’t…insert wild claim.
The stupid things that if you gave everyone a truth pill, nobody honestly cares about them. It’s just something to fight over
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Blizzard did an overdone job at removing every RTS character we used to have in the past and it shows. Everyone noticed it including content creators.
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11.1 will be more of a horde story.
There isn’t a story to tell when every NPC that could have provided here are dead. Gazlowe is factually the last goblin standing since we don’t know if they kill Gallywix or not.
Ähm, the last time i checked the Horde goblinleader will get focus screentime in this story.
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I will never accept Gazlowe as truly Horde. He’s a neutral graft, like Lillian Voss.
Also betting goblins play no part in defeating the expac’s end boss. That’s gonna be all Alleria.
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Thank you. I know its the popular thing to homogenize races in fantasy, but I dislike what they are doing with the goblins and forsaken.
The goblins were obviously a pretty one-dimensional joke on greedy, money-grubbing capitalists with little morals. I think its ok to try and pull away from this, but its not being done in a clever way. Its essentially redefining who goblins are, and that’s fine, but it also takes some of their character away.
Forsaken have been getting homogenized for a while now. They started as amoral characters with clandestine goals, their humanity and morality chipped away by the condition of undeath. Now, they’re just dead humans. nothing separating them except for a reskin.
Lilian really got on my nerves in Amirdrassil. First, Blizzard propped her in front of Rohkan and Rexxar during the "endgame cinematic. If you don’t know why that’s annoying, its because they are the Founders of Durotar during WC3. Chen Stormstout appears with them, fighting fire elementals in-game, but was cut out of the cinematic and replaced with Lilian Voss. She has no real connection with those characters, so we can assume she was only placed their for representation, cutting out pandaren representation.
Then, she has that obnoxious questline with Shandris, where Shandris is forced to be ok with Forsaken now because they really didn’t mean it and feel awful bad about all the bad stuff they’ve done, and they only did it because their meany-head warchief made them.
I’m just kinda done with Forsaken especially. They have no identity anymore as a race and I feel very bad for Forsaken players. Goblins at least still get to have the wacky antics side of their race intact.
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They show every sign of taking a race that is playable for the Horde and mostly ignoring the Horde. One finds it plausible that 11.1 will be using a Horde zone as background for Alliance characters.
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Assuming they just don’t drop Gazlowe out as things go along. I mean, they have already taking a minor characrter out of obscurity to set up next to him.
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