Yes, the Forsaken and Sylvanas were always the “Token Evil Teammate” on the Horde. The Void Elves seem to be like that for the Alliance, but they don’t compare.
I disagree. For obvious reasons, one being a Sylvanas fan. I think using the Blight saved the Forsaken from both the Alliance and Garrosh.
Regardless of her reason the entire thing left nothing but utter contempt from any worgen/Alliance fan regarding her and Vol’jin bringing it up would make anyone seethed.
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Again, that’s fair.
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It goes back to that earlier comment about how a faction’s point of view is deliberately painted to make the other look the worse.
Just as Alliance players were greeted with a description of Vol’jin meant to put us off, the Void Elves are painted in a MUCH darker light for Horde players.
As an Alliance player you mostly interact with Umbric, and get a lot of lip service about how they want to prove their loyalty to the Alliance, and also a lot of reasoning behind how they’re using void magic responsibly. They reanimate the bones of a dinosaur to wage psychological warfare because hopefully it’ll break Zandalari morale and result in fewer deaths. They send Horde ambassadors on one-way trips to the Void to deprive the Zandalari of important intelligence that’d result in the deaths of even more people. From start to finish the Alliance player see’s the Void Elves striving to reduce casualties and making sure their powers don’t get out of hand.
On the Horde side? Well, if you face the Islands Expedition team of Void Elves they all sound like they’ve already succumbed to the whispers, and then you have Umbric and his people corrupting the eggs of raptors.
In both cases what the Void Elves do is evil, but the Horde doesn’t ever see any sort of rationale behind the actions of the Void Elves, while the Alliance do.
Of course it does… The Alliance is part of that story. If the story is executed poorly, that reflects on all parties involved in that story. If you cared about the Alliance, you would agree with me.
Yes. As the main figureheads engaged in the writing of that story are now known sexist pigs.
And he wasn’t the only problem. Those that didn’t actively abuse women, stood by and allowed that abuse to continue for years. No one is innocent.
Even though the issue predates Cata. I am not even sure what you are on about here.
Name one that we actually got to know intimately throughout the book and who we didn’t have past novels about? Funny how the only people who fit into that category are women. Pained and Kindy.
The fact that you even made this argument counters what you said earlier. You are not defending the Alliance here, your issue is with women.
Night elves have been sitting in that pit since Classic, my guy. I live here. After 17 years, I finally decided it wasn’t worth the wait.
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If the story is executed poor that would be on Blizzard. Not on the Alliance.
As far as we can tell people like Metzen, Kosak or Danuser had no knowledge of it.
Then I should clarify that mantra was only told to us in Cata but it has been how Warcaft story was formulated since the beginning.
Easy enough, we have Saphonnetta.
You have not had it worse then most races. As an example the gnomes still do not have their city fully, both Westfall/Darkshire are still a mess and in terms of destruction, Stromgarde was just rebuilt and Theramore will probably forever remain a crater. Darnassus burning has been about 2 expansions ago. It took about 3 before the Park District of Stormwind got repaired.
This latest state of night elves being homeless is actually a shorter one then several other races.
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Like it or not, what Blizzard does is canon within the Story. I don’t like the fact that Blizz made the Alliance an Empire of human dominance, but that doesn’t change the fact that is what they have done and that is what the Alliance is.
What? Brutalizing women?
… Literally who? lol
If you have to reach like that, then maybe you are wrong. Based on the name, that sounds like a woman anyway.
Yes we have. But go ahead, continue to prove my point by mansplaining away a woman’s experience.
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Damn who would have thought that posting a WoWpedia article would have caused multiple forum meltdowns
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I don’t think it was ever Vol’jin’s intention to shatter his “monster image”. He didn’t need to- the cooperation was pretty much a done deal at this point, both sides knew they needed the help of the other. And Vol’jin had only recently worked with the alliance before, against the Zandalari.
He was never a monster, but neither is he a cuddly toy like Baine. He wouldn’t grovel at anyone’s feet. That he made friends with a human doesn’t mean he loves them all, he has little reason to. I think his reaction was only appropriate. And as others have said before, he never intended to pull through with the threat.
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The Alliance is not an empire otherwise Anduin should have force Tyrande to stop rushing headlong into every dangerous situation she can.
That Warcraft is a story were kingdoms/empires fall, sometimes at the peak of their power. Some get back up, some dont.
I thought you wanted a female character we got to know in a book and wasnt killed off. Also she and her goblin husband were popular enough in the novel to be part of Operation Mechagon/have an actual mount related to them.
First off night elves are not just women. Second off, the various Alliance races have women in them who also suffer due to forces outside their control. Using “mansplaining” as a good to excuse to end arguments is getting tiring.
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He certainly tried. And your manner of talking down to Tyrande for pursuing justice really shows how you feel about outspoken women.
And for some reason, the Matriarchal society is the only who is most often on the receiving end of violence.
A remarkably minor character that we didn’t get to know anything about. Just a token mix race couple, and that is the entire character, and the entire identity. Whereas Kindy and Pained have several heart warming and wholesome interactions in several scenes, throughout the entire novel.
Comparing them to… Whatever her name is… is just beyond ridiculous, even for you.
They are female lead, Matriarchal society. And just so happens to be either the damsel trope from non-nelf, male characters, or the punching bag to elicit emotional responses.
You are not this stupid.
Because it is exactly what you are doing.
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No, I would feel the same way/did feel the same way about if say Varian or Daelin(which he did) started another war for no reason or decided to rush headlong into danger without at least giving it some thought.
There were 7 human KINGdoms. All were destroyed at one point or another(granted Kul Tiras was destroyed non canonically in Warcraft 2, but they did suffer alot during BfA). No Matriachal societies are not the only ones who suffer.
As oppose to Kinddy and Pained?
That is just the thing. Both of them only had those interaction in ONE novel. Same as Sapphy.
Actually no. If anything they were more of an allegory for the two factions. That if they actually put their differences asides they can actually make marvelous things.
And male characters have need help/rescuing themselves. Hell, without Malfurion intervening Varian would probably have remain a roid rage monster. It was actually Tyrande herself who once saved Kael’thas(nominally Alliance at the time).
Heck, we can also say Tyrande “saved” Vol’jin and Baine when at the gates of Ogrimmar they were literally bared from doing anything while it was Tyrande who busted the gates.
No it is. It is just your preconcieved biases.
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The difference here is Tyrande is pursuing justice that she rightfully deserved. Varian and Daelin were just racists…
Again, the fact you equate the two shows just how low your opinion of women and women’s issues is.
Back when the game was an RTS and the canon depended solely on which campaign you played. Having total destruction on both sides was Blizzards way of bringing both campaigns into a singular canon. The moment Blizzard committed to a singular canon, the Night Elves have been their punching bag of choice.
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Daelin literally had his son killed by these same Horde that escaped on HIS navy(he was Grand admiral of the Alliance at the time). Varian/the Alliance he lead at the time was constantly attacked by the Horde. Not to mention Sylvanas was experimenting on Alliance forces in his adopted home. Maybe you need to check your biases against male character?
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Man this trash fire is still burning huh
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Both those things happened 10-20 years ago and don’t hold a flame (pun unintended) to the Genocide of War of Thorns, and all the issues that will plague the Kaldorei species from the loss of the Dragon aspects blessings.
And that is just one of countless examples, and not even the most heinous of sexism in the Warcraft story, that uniquely impacts night elves.
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It’s just zerde defending everything the alliance does, while ignoring that the kaldorei have indeed been a punching bag since classic. But you know, some men like to think sexist writing in wow isn’t a thing
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As far as this being a “women’s issue” thing. As a woman, I disgree. I think Zerde has made valid points and has not shown any disprespect towards women in this discussion. He’s not advocating or condoning violence against women. Akiyass you are grasping and projecting.
Questioning a female characters choices or actions is not inherently sexist.
I’m all for calling out sexism, misogyny and interanized bias but it seems Zerde just has a conflicting opinion and that’s okay. As far as I’m concerned BFA did play up the general Alliance’s concern that Tyrande at the end of BFA may be a loose canon… and she was.
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Varian’s city was torched by the Horde. Daelin lost his son. So in 20 years time the night elves are suppose to not care about the War of Thorns and let that not have an effect on them?
Humanity has literally had to deal with the impact of the Third War(and continues to do so to this day) and has only slowly begun rebuilding some of the things they lost(case in point Stromgarde)
If they were the only punching back in Azeroth had I would be more sympathetic. But as of right now every human nation in Azeroth was at one time or another destroyed(san Kul Tiras) by one force or another and even the supposed perfect humans keep getting hit by Cultist(Darkshire), Defias(Westfall), Scourge(we are not even sure Lakeshire exists anymore because the Scourge attack them)
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