Sounds like you’re seeing more than I am, because I ‘might’ see 2-3 in a week’s time.
2 Likes
Here are a few more topics worth highlighting…
- Public Ordering & Alchemy’s BoE vs. BoP crafts
- Elemental Potions of Power vs. Elemental Potions of Ultimate Power
- Accountwide Primal Chaos & Main-Draining
Say it with me: the capped public order system works well enough for BoP gear, it doesn’t work for consumables.
Also, at the moment, Alchemy is held back by having most of what anyone would want already be available on the AH, sometimes at a session loss to the crafter. The BoP crafts it does have exist in a frustrating niche where they are helpful, but they aren’t helpful or rare enough for most players to care about ordering them. In situations where the use is minor (eg. profession phials) the crafts are obtainable enough for people to simply roll an alchemist alt and supply themselves without friction. In situations where the use is major and inaccessible to most alt supplylines (eg. Elemental Potions of Ultimate Power) the use isn’t major enough for the average player to feel inspired spending beyond the base potion craft.
Exacerbating this is the recent change to Primal Chaos. Like the lowering of max public order counts for gear crafting, allowing Primal Chaos to be transferred across characters is a net-positive for a lot of the playerbase. However, it overlooks the impact for ultimate potions specifically, as they cost Primal Chaos. Every Chaos shipped to an alt saps the total amount a main has to buy Ultimate Potions. In fact, theoretically, there is the new, cursed possibility that alts save their transferred Primal Chaos for an ultimate cauldron drop as opposed to ordering the actual potions. It’s a stretch, but…
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Thinking about the above, here are some easy solutions: merge the two Elemental Potions into one, don’t have them cost Primal Chaos (and don’t have profession phials cost Mettle, for that matter…), and create a separate max order count for consumable crafts.
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By far the worst part : I am an enchanter. I cannot enchant my own gear because I cannot create the enchants high enough to use for raiding… so crafting = worthless this xpac!
The RNG.
Inspiration should not exist. They should have called it Focus and made it a determined, constant value instead of a random proc that literally slides with the pull of the handle just like a frickin’ slot machine.
Finesse, Resourcefulness, and Multicraft should be constant values rather than procs.
The RNG. It’s always the RNG.
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Worst part is people habits, they dont like changes, especially after so many years of the same systems.
Personally, I like this inspiration and other new stats, along with rng it brings.
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I don’t get any orders unless I sit in trade chat all day. I have over 250 KP
Buy from auction house
The dude who advertises 85% rank 3 chance for the t3 primalist gems. I hope the people he tries to sell insight to set the gems to rank 3 since he apparently can’t guarantee with an insight.
2 Likes
LONG WINDED POST!
TL:DR I might be full of poo but the system is honestly really fun with some hiccups that can be ironed out of this Completely Overhauled system. Ask a friend for help, give it a try, and remember it’s for fun which is what we should help each other achieve… and a new shiny coin for the gold pile.
Hambrick response
his is where personal orders need to be open. That guy has scammed so many people on purpose because I cannot believe someone is that ignorant or stupid. A simple open statistic of the crafters inspiration and skill based on mats you submit would solve this 100%. Unfortunately I have people on my server doing this as well, I believe anyway as they haven’t provided proof yet. There’s only so much I can do to combat that awfulness by explaining things to people who don’t understand the crafting system. Actually had someone add me on Discord to make sure I wasn’t lying about my inspiration procs! Which as a side note I’m super proud of her as she’s now a LW/BS updating me on all her progress. Actually happy about that.
To get onto topic though. Some of the complaints here are very valid such as catch-up, knowledge points, and confusing specializations for some professions.
Catch-up lacking
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To start with catch-up mechanics. I’m going to use my GM as an example here who started last week on his BS journey. It’s a gold and time sink 100% and he had the aid of already getting high into the 20’s on faction renown as he’s played since the start. The gold sink on my realm was between 200k-300k and I know that because I spent it for him to help him. The next thing was that he was previously an enchanter, dropped it for BS’ing. He didn’t get ANY of those points so he was basically fresh. But even with that he’s made himself 100 skill, has gotten over 1 mil gold in com’s, and has set a name for himself in trade chat. That’s not saying it’s easy though, it’s actually relatively difficult because you just have to look at what the path was.
a fresh player coming in with no gold, lets say maybe 50k into DF, and no renown they’re at a huge set back from the start. So without the gold and renown they’re screwed for 3-4 weeks as they grind itout. I think some specialized quests or lowering the renown requirements will really help this matter. The quests can also be weekly, giving the reward of choosing one of the locked profession patterns. To help encourage them at least to continue on.
Specialization and Understanding
- The next long bit, sorry, is tied together with specialization points and confusing specializations. The bad part about the points is the fact there’s no take backs and that there are very much useless branches, like resourcefulness. I really don’t know how to fix this though to where it wouldn’t get abused or just useless. I do know though for some specializations, like Alchemy, it can be a lot clearer. It took me a good half hour just looking it over completely to understand fully what each specialization did and offered. That’s shouldn’t be the case, especially when I do understand the crafting system relatively well at least I tell myself that lol.
Closing thoughts.
but beside those two points, 3 really due to people that Hambrick isn’t allowed to put on blast unfortunately, the crafting system has been really fun! Inspiration is definitely a mixed bagI can understand the frustration of it as well. I think it’s okay personally and get all happy with people who com me when it happens. I used to think making public crafting orders require a set quality was also great and gun ho for it until I realized it’s the worse thing plausible for new crafters. Public orders would only ever be used by people like me who have nearly 290 specialization points and maxed prof gear. It’s creating an extremely unhealthy market place that’s already doing fine-ish. I do think it needs improvement, how, idk but quality setting on public orders isn’t it.
But beside that most of the time when someone complains about the crafting orders to me on Stormrage it’s because of a misunderstanding of how it works. Which after about usually 15-20 minutes of explaining, they walk away much happier about it or hyped to get into it as example one of my commissioners and GM who’re both earning gold income now off of professions unlike any other expansion. Blizzard really did make a system that crafters can truly dive into and play with. It just takes a sitting or two to grasp it, which, ask for help. People, like myself, are more than willing to help guide for everyone to have fun with this.
First off, I love that the updated crafting system feels more fulfilling.
-Having a small number of recipes for armor that can actually be used while leveling is so much nicer than having hundreds of recipes that I have to create just for the skill points and vendor for pennies or disenchant for lowest-level enchanting mats
-Specializations that add new mechanics (e.g. skinner bait crafting) and knowledge-hunting makes it a more dynamic area of the game to invest your time in
That being said, I’ve been disappointed by some of the changes as well.
-The crafting orders system in general just doesn’t seem to have worked out. In about a month of playing I’ve seen less than a dozen total public orders (I check a couple times a day), and none that I could actually fill. I know lots of folks complain about this same thing because crafting orders are the only way to get to max level on their profession, but that’s not my main issue. I’m bummed because if all I’m doing is gearing up my own characters, the grind feels a bit hollow. I had hoped the crafting orders system would make all the work I put in to my profession easily accessible to anyone (if I had the inclination to engage in Trade chat, I’d market any recipe I can make for no tip and basic mats provided – I just like the satisfaction of helping out a fellow player), but sadly it just hasn’t worked out that way.
-The knowledge system in general needs tweaking. Having a cap on points you can earn per week is a bummer (I like grinding it out for hours a day; it makes the later days in the week feel crummy when I’m doing the same activity but not getting rewarded for it). Having unclear benefits for specializations that turn out to be underwhelming makes the forcibly drawn-out specialization process that cannot be re-spec’ed even more painful (maxed out bait crafter here… I thought I’d have a chance at something rare or unique, turns out you just get more quantities of the same items. Bummer. Also, why is there absolutely no in-game way to even get a hint of where to place bait for rare creatures? Randomly placing bait everywhere and anywhere in the Dragon Isles on 12h cooldown for basic rewards is not my idea of fun. Nor is searching wowhead for coordinates.)
Furthermore, I’ve heard several times that WoW developers designed the system such that players could be, for example, “the go-to helm crafter” on their server. As a profession enthusiast, that is a really unsatisfying concept. I don’t want to spend tons of time and money leveling, specializing, and investing in my profession only to end up with a single recipe that is actually marketable. It would be far more satisfying to be able to specialize in a broader coherent category like “leather armor”.
TLDR; moving in the right direction, but Crafting Orders needs some kind of overhaul and knowledge and specializations need to be more rewarding.
“Also, please make the WO interface connected to the AH, so people can buy the mats and place a order quicker.”
100% this.
3 Likes
As an alchemist, I can probably say that the WORST aspect of it so far was being tied to experimentation that then went through a 4-hour cooldown when you inevitably blew up on your third try. I know they lowered the explosion chance, but it sure didn’t feel like they lowered it enough to not make it a frustrating log out point on a regular basis.
I get that what they wanted to do was make professions an “endgame” goal, in that it would take a long time to find the recipes and build up the skill level and spec points to make the best stuff. I’m actually OK with that. I have alts in every profession and the progress has been pretty slow. All of them with non-gathering professions are level 70 but I don’t play any of them enough to have maxed out their profs. The only one maxed is my main, the alchemist, because I was determined to get somewhere. As noted, alchemy is probably the worst of the lot, since getting to max level gets you basically nothing if you were hoping to make enough gold to buy the best recipes from the rep vendors. Again, that may have been their intent: Make professions non-trivial and something that needs to be worked at to really pay off, rather than being the sideshow of everyone being maxed out within two days of expansion release and then just churning out the top end stuff to glut the market. Unfortunately, that doesn’t really mesh well with the pace of M+ and raiding needs.
It’s clear that they didn’t take into account the ability of people on the big servers to have played a ton on the PTR, know exactly what paths to follow, and then take advantage of some early bugs to corner the market. The Public Order limitation to restrain the bots is the right idea, but has some execution issues. Among those issues are the inability to really produce a dynamic market in low population servers like, say, mine (Blackhand.) I’ve been playing since opening day. I have yet to see a Public Order. The only ones I’ve fulfilled are personals among my alts. Anyone saying that there’s an option to sit yelling in Trade Chat for hours is encouraging a complete defeat of the purpose. Public Orders were supposed to alleviate that, in the same way that LFG alleviated people sitting in the main channels for hours looking for people to run dungeons, way back in the day.
I think the main problem is that, for many, the attempt to make professsions less of a sideshow that you paid attention to for a couple days before making all that you needed is that they’ve turned into the converse sideshow. They’re so difficult and complicated for most and/or people are so far behind those that cornered the market that people are just giving up on what was intended to be an “endgame” activity. Yes, Hambrick, I know that it’s not unintuitive to you, but when the vast majority of responses here are people complaining that they don’t understand the system or that they DID misunderstand it and misapplied their permanent spec points, you’re the exception. That means there’s a problem with the system or a problem with how it was explained, if not both. Just because you glommed onto it quickly doesn’t mean that everyone can.
Anyway, I’m unfortunately mostly a solo player (the few friends I have that still play are Alliance and all my toons are Horde; can do things “together” except, y’know, run dungeons which is the main thing I like to do…) and on a low-pop server with a guild that largely exists only for the perks (I almost never see another guildie on anymore.) So, I’m in the situation that is probably least favorable for trying to advance at this kind of thing, since I don’t have anyone to cooperate with without logging out and on multiple times between my own toons. That’s not an indictment of the system, per se, but it is kind of discouraging to not have access to the top end stuff if I wanted to get into M+ or something like that because I have neither the gold nor the skill levels to make it happen.
I kinda like the new prof sys. Not from gold making standpoint, but it put depth in the profession.
One thing it dedinately achieved is preventing a single account make all the gold. I am a veteran crafter, 2 accounts and an army of alts, made millions of gold to the point I dont need to worry about it anymore. I dont make much gold in DF.
I think there are 2 ways to make gold in DF as a crafter (not gatherer)
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Focus on one thing, aquire the recipe early, live on the trade chat. Its not my playstyle
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Make intermediate materials, put your points in inspiration, multictaft and resourcefulness. You still make gold this way today, but margin are thinner by day because more and more ppl are doing it
Both method need time investment in playing the game acquiring kp on every crafter toon. Which means you cant do them all. So the system made the gold making much less concentrated. While in SL you can litterally craft every single max level lego as long as you have enuf liquid gold to begin with.
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The crafting system LOOKED like it could be fun.
…but then I spent 4 hours focused purely on mining, only to be able to blacksmith for less than 2 minutes. Not a single public work order in sight. Really?!? I’ve spent some time trying to figure out what I’m missing, but all I’ve discovered is that the parts I was looking forward to are broken in some way. The changes to Professions are a collection of great ideas horribly executed. This can be a GREAT system, but it needs more time in the oven.
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Endlessly fishing for inspiration procs to get rank 5. I am in the process of trying to fish for an inspiration proc for a customer. I have 24% chance of a proc to get the rank 5 they want and with my current stats I can’t guarantee it even with the appropriate infusions etc. After 8 tries we still haven’t had one and I feel bad for the customer.
Most important things you can do is get all 3 good profession equipment (with the two inspiration ones at rank 5) and atleast a rank 2 inspiration enchant. Also max the generic skill and inspiration trees.
With the inspiration trees maxed, I’ve never had a problem forcing that proc. In fact, I just tell customers 5k for guaranteed rank 5 (this price would likely be higher for something with really expensive mats).
Most times after dropping incense and using optional inspiration regents, I only hit the button twice and have yet to not turn a profit after offering insurance.
I agree, they have really made professions a drag unless you are just a gatherer.
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I feel bad for the customer for even accepting a 24% inspire chance
For me, the worst part of Dragonflight professions wasn’t obvious at first but it’s crystal clear these days. To understand what I mean, a little background information is required.
I’m a long time member of a small AoTC guild. We’re a tight knit group with almost no turnover. We stopped farming normal Vaults just last week and now focusing solely on heroic.
We’re the type of guild where everyone contributes to the guild bank and we only take what we need which is generally very little. At the end of each expansion, the officers clear out the bank to make room all the new stuff that we’ll be putting into it.
If you open our guild vault these days, be sure to stand to one side so you don’t get hit by the tumbleweeds falling out. By this point in an expansion, it would normally be around one third full, most especially with those items beneficial to raiding. This simply hasn’t happened in Dragonflight.
The new profession system may be challenging to players but it leaves much to be desired when it comes to supporting actual gameplay, at least in the way professions have been used for this purpose in the past. All the bells and whistles are there but the end result is less than satisfying.
5 Likes
I would say “worst” part are those recipes hidden behind a 1% drop rate.
The fact that you cannot see what is added by R2/R3 materials comes in close second.
Honorable mention to ranks on end products. It’s silly to have two ranks, but do we really need 5? Should be either you succeed or you don’t and have to wait and try again (or sacrifice materials/mettle)