Kvaldir Tidesage Zombie Pirate Navy is what God intended
Yeah agreed.
Plus imagine the possibility for the story: Lilian and Sally confronting eachother for who they were in life being Scarlet Crusaders; Koltira and Velonara talking about Quel’thalas; etc.
Done.
100%.
Must happen.
Explosions. Magic sundering. Something. They’re winging it with Shadowlands, they didn’t think this through, there’s no defined rules. Having the machine of death break can do unexpected things.
As for the second point, though:
The Horde exists for that literal reason, though. Survival.
Survival doesn’t equate to military aggression (though the company seems to believe it does, given recent /creations/.). The pursuit of continued existence can be as mild or as exciting as one writes it to be.
I fail to see how the Forsaken aren’t symbiotic with the Horde, though. Their background literally hits all of the beats of all the other societies within it (save for more recent additions, such as the Blood Elves, Goblins and the Allied Race societies that came with Legion/BFA). The Forsaken as a society run a whole wheel of ideals, from problematic to something more palatable on a neutral scale.
They’re so close that they chose the Horde over the literal General who lead them during their infancy days.
Nobody flings feces when there’s a Troll Witchdoctor in Stonetalon doing some decidedly vile stuff, for example, he’s doing it of his own accord, that’s not on the head of the Darkspear.
Hell, the orc clans had a literal dictator seize control of the Horde and was backed by a considerable amount of supporters, but they don’t take flak, the sin of one man shouldn’t fall to everyone.
The double standard shouldn’t apply to the Forsaken.
I normally try to avoid getting down on people for having opinions, but I needed to say this very loud and clearly, because if you permit Calia into the Forsaken story, she will do irreversible, crucial damage to the story that defines them. You cannot humor the idea, because it broadcasts to those who’re reading the content here that we want to see more Calia. And I don’t! I personally do not, in the slightest. And I know for sure I’m not the only one who thinks that way.
She is the very antithesis of the Forsaken.
I think it’s really ironic that people complain about the idea of Alliance-aligned undead because it would detract from Horde themes when odds are they themselves see the Forsaken largely as an opportunity to co-opt human themes (and more importantly, land claims)
Anyway the answer is this:
Nobody likes the Forsaken. Even the people who do like the Forsaken like a concept of them that doesn’t exist and never will. Every time they come up they just make everyone angry. If they’re going to be around let them be Goblin-esque comic relief.
Hard pass, especially in regards to Darion. He´s just another Calia with a different window dressing (no seriously, typical human character with gross Alliance flavoring and even more gross Alliance background), he´s just emo while she channels the leader of “My Little Pony”.
Tragicomical -if that´s even a word in english (tragicomedia does exist in spanish)- is more like it.
I feel like crying but is SO absurd it makes one laugh too -just not happy laughs-.
Tehd IS written like an actual regular Forsaken: sarcastic, smart, UNAPOLOGETIC. Foraken haters LOVE to say the race was nothing but a boring bunch of sad sacks that went genocidal thanks to the “lack” of “Light” -pun intended- in their lives. After interacting for more than a decade with several Forsaken characters of different background, I can say they -just like the Adams Family- just are perfectly ok with gross controversial stuff cause what can be more traumatic and gross than inhabit one´s rotten body? That´s why they act the way they act: cause I imagine VERY little stuff can disgust them… and they don´t feel like apologizing for this “lack of prejudices”.
LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK!!!
I mean guys, THIS is the reason the WC3 Horde exist. Conquering and pillaging was the deal with WC1-WC2 Horde, but WoW´s one? Survival. Why do you people think Horde has some vague “Band of Brothers” esque feeling to it? Because it´s the story about VERY different people that HAD TO learn to live together (with both the good and the bad… the things they liked AND the things they disliked) thanks to extenuating circumstances that would had exterminated them if confronted alone by themselves. Do you think soldier LEARN to support their comrades because they happily like each other always? No, they learn to do so because they KNOW those comrades, regardless of their personalities, are the ones that will get their backs whjen it counts and their lives are in danger.
Survival and stressful events are indeed VERY powerful motivators for people so they can build lasting connections with others.
Says the most well known Forsaken hater on these forums… why am I NOT surprised? 
It would be nice if Blizzard didn’t have to turn to Alliance Lore to come up with a leader. But then, give how Blizzard writes the Horde, maybe that is just as well.
Its an interesting idea. But it probably means that the NEs won’t get a new capital. Both factions lost a major capital. Blizzard is going to make sure both factions get a similar result. They won’t take an long standing Horde faction city, reduce it to being in a neutral zone and put a new Alliance capital next to it and restore the NE capital to full status.
Honestly, the Ruins of Lordaeron themselves are pretty small. The Alliance settlement would be more equivalent to Theramore (which in my conception, would be what Capital City is replacing) than a proper gameplay capital, so that still leaves some flexibility for Night Elves
My biggest fear is that the Forsaken will end up like the Worgen.
They are the saddest waste of potential to me. Victorian England but werewolves is a trope but its a great one. Because just like the society itself you’ve the height of flowery civilized society masking the reality of a feral, monstrous status quo.
Beyond that werewolves are a great allegory for all sorts of personal/societal problems. Mental illness, addiction, any scenario where there’s a hungry, desperate and\or angry part of you that you’re afraid to show to even the people closest because you don’t want to be that- but every now and then, it’ll flair up and cause problems.
Such a fertile ground for fascinating storytelling that would really resonate with people.
And what did we get? Marry Poppins Chimney Sweeps with Fursonas. Who even lost their pretty interesting architecture along the way.
Now because the Forsaken are part of the Horde, which is the only side that gets to be edgier than a dulled butter knife these days, I doubt it’ll be that bad.
But the fundamental point of identity to the Forsaken should be they aren’t human anymore.
But yet they’re still themselves
Undeath warps the mind and body, but not the soul. People may find themselves suddenly having a taste for raw flesh and suddenly finding giant spiders adorable, but that doesn’t change your values as a person.
As Pontius shows an undead who’s passion was raising dogs is still going to raise dogs. Only they raise darkhounds now because those devil doggos aren’t thrown by the walking dead. Likewise Meryl Felstorm, going on millenia of undeath, is still basically the same nice if awkward mage.
Undeath should be a liberation. People can now do whatever they wanted. They have no need for food, shelter, sleep or even breath now. All obligations are cut like puppet strings.
So now that they can do whatever they really wanted to do; what do they do?
I’ve got some bad news for you RE: how it appears Maw magic works
Even if they make the rest of Tirisfal Glades a Horde zone (which I’m not sure how that would work), they aren’t going to then shoehorn an Alliance city without shoehorning in a Horde city into an Alliance zone.
If you want to be realistic, you have expect that anything the NEs get will be similar to what the Horde gets.
Why does Wowpedia list Michael Goodchilde as the ruler of Tirisfal Glades? 
a minor note:
While the souls probably not, the link is not quite as it was
The souls of the undead (Forsaken, PC death knights, ghouls, etc.) are imperfectly attached to their bodies; the dark magic that sustains them is a buffer that prevents their souls from properly joining with their bodies. This is why undead feel only faint sensations of pain or discomfort from most physical stimuli, and why the Light is so painful to their existence.
So, the souls are ok-ish, but the whole system is messed up. There more about it in lorekeeper.net/en/maldraxxus-shadowlands-and-beyond-interview-with-steve-danuser/
A few extra details that could be boiled down to: there is no logic in how it work, or how raising will end, in general “negative emotions” are amplified, senses and “positive emotion” are faint; in general the magic that sustains them makes the whole “package” imperfect.
Why is this info is not in the game - I have no idea. Blizz does have a tendency of “telling” instead of actually adding something in game, which waters down the player experience by a lot.
He’s not a traditional necromancy undead though, but used arcane iirc.
gl hf
I don’t feel like Koltira will want to be around forsaken after his previous treatment in their care.
Does that mean he wouldn’t help the horde? Not really, but I’d think he’d not want to hang with the people that tortured him since Cata.
Ayup. Koltira wont go anywhere near the Forsaken. Velonara on the other hand could be built into a palatable character. She’s way too much like her brethren atm, but she’s also not totally devoid of some individuality either. For example, her choosing to remain with the Horde Commander in WoD, rather than return to Sylvanas once her mission was complete … was Odd for a Dark Ranger. She was also deliberately shown to be the last named Ranger to fall in the BE Heritage Questline. And I also seem to recall her implying at one point that many Dark Rangers only forgave Sylvanas for raising them, because she was compelled to by Arthas. No other reason.
Plus, she had her whole “We will no longer be slaves to this torment” twist to that classic Sylvie line. Which, who knows, maybe we’ll see something come of that and her down the road?
Hey I am all for building up characters, and not saying Valanora can’t be interesting far from it. She could be a very intriguing character if handled right, but the idea of Koltira wanting to hang out with a group that tried to take his free will all for respecting his friend Thassarian, and not trying to destroy him.
I felt rescuing Koltira could have been a far greater event, yet they merely had us free him and Koltira refused to comment on his time. I felt dissatisfied with that, but was happy to free him. Also Koltira and Thassarian are a great bromance.
They really are.
And they have been since wrath.
Anything to do with Lordaeron or the Forsaken being “citizens of Lordaeron” is going to by nature be pretty much entirely Alliance lore. That can’t be avoided and it’s one of the reasons the Forsaken are so stuck.
If you want them to be developed entirely independently of anything to do with the Alliance then you need to go the way of the Draenei and remove them from an Alliance/Alliance adjacent environment entirely, which doesn’t seem all that popular among Horde players because it would involve them leaving the Eastern Kingdoms.
It’s like if Dark Irons were made Horde and everyone expected their development to be entirely divorced from the Wildhammer and Bronzebeards, or if Leper Gnomes were made Horde and everyone expecting Gnomeregan to never be a thing for them because that’s Alliance stuff.