Anyone have any ideas? I’m at a loss. And speaking of loss…
The Forsaken must be the biggest losers in WoW right now. They lost the war, lost their leader - their founder, the character their entire race was wrapped around - lost all their EK territory, and lost in Kalimdor too so the night elves could cover their own losses. Their character roster, bleeding since Wrath, is gutted. Even their dubious method of procreation is gone. They are utterly directionless, non-entities in the post-Sylvanas narrative, and any two Forsaken players can’t seem to agree on what to do with them either.
I’m curious as to what people more invested in this race than I am think about it, and where they might go from here.
I mean, I have my opinions on them, but they are likely not super well liked.
Personally, since it looks like we might be stuck with Calia, we might as well embrace the honestly pretty conceptually interesting Dual-Identity briefly explored in BtS. Between those that would reclaim of as much of their identities they held in life as they could (The “Citizens of Lordaeron Identity”). And those that have largely moved on from that for any number of reasons, and more thoroughly adopted their Forsaken Identities. With a massive spectrum in between, and neither really being inherently negative (its just Sylvie exploited the latter).
So, embrace that dual identity, with a Dual-Leader situation. If Calia has to be involved, than conceptually she can represent the Citizens of Lordaeron side of that peoples selves. While Voss, as forced as she also is, can be conceptually built up pretty well to represent the Forsaken side. As she has always represented Forsaken Free Will and the Forsaken experience very well. Even if those things took her away from the Forsaken up until recently. Theoretically supporting both sides and the spectrum in positive ways.
After that, once Zovaal’s influence has been severed. Let them get back to basics. Using the now free Scourge as a resource. Finding and nursing back to health those minds among that teeming mass, those that can be brought back. And harvesting those too far gone for parts. Add in a little bit of Primus/Maldraxxus knowledge (what the Scourge was clearly based off of) … and it could help the Forsaken stabalize and grow their population. Plus improve their quality of life greatly. I however think Calia needs a reason to create some distance with the Alliance though. For the sake her of own people. If she’s going to stay around, that is.
Calia becomes the next queen reforming them all. They got to get away from their destroy all life faction mission statement that we saw in BFA.
And then they go freeing all the mind controlled and lost souls of the scourge.
Well whatever is left them by the time we get back.
Turalyon and the Horde are probably take care of them while we are away.
Just idea with what seems to be the direction Blizzard is going with the Forsaken.
The Forsaken were always doomed to have no future because they straight up aren’t supposed to be on the plane of the living. This problem was always going to become more prominent as time went on and with BfA at least people seem to be more clear eyed about it.
The Forsaken themselves don’t seem to have any good idea of what they want to do, which is what Calia is there for. Her stated intention is to give them a purpose that is constructive rather than destructive, but it’s hard to imagine what that might look like if they remain part of the Horde absent massive changes to the Horde itself.
To be honest they didn’t really have much direction ever. They were a vehicle for Sylvanas and that was pretty much it. The biggest thing that it’s been suggested that they would do more of if not for Sylvanas’ influence is reconnect with the Alliance.
Honestly hoping there’ll be some late expansion stuff for the Forsaken and the Maldraxxi. Besides the cancerous ideology of Maldraxxus, there’s a lot of possibility for the Forsaken on that front.
Ironically ‘Scourge 2.0’ becomes even more correct on that path, so that’s enjoyable.
These kinds of threads are not very interesting. There used to be a much larger pro-Forsaken group here on the story forums, but they have been driven away over time. Now it’s just the same terrible ideas about Calia and redeeming the Forsaken and turning them into just another boring race like every other boring race in the game, humans with a skin condition.
You can search for several really good discussions on this topic in previous years though, in older threads.
If we’re just talking about territory, I would propose dual use of Undercity/Capital City by the Alliance and Horde.
Forsaken get exclusive residence and access to Undercity. Humans get exclusive residence to Capital City. Both populations are administered by the Conclave, and residents of either get access to the other under the supervision of the Conclave.
Order in Capital City is kept by the Argent Crusade with Alliance observers. Order in the Undercity is kept by the Knights of the Ebon Blade or Earthen Ring, with Horde observers.
Faction champions (ie the player characters) are special and get unfettered access to both locations.
Thus, we have the first non-neutral, shared capital in the game.
To be honestly blunt, they are screwed. They never really fit into the Horde. The Tauren were prevented from ever engaging in their goal of ATLEAST TRYING to cure them of undeath. The Horde from WC3’s themes are at odds with the Forsaken. The only solutions were
Make the Forsaken lose some edge and making them “softer” (like the trolls giving up cannibalism after entering the Horde) to better fit into the Horde.
Make the Horde embrace undeath and become more like the Forsaken instead.
Make the Horde extremely stupid and continue to ignore all the atrocities the Forsaken have committed
The Forsaken are doing pretty good with Calia in the wings. All things considering the Mawsworn, and Jailor’s forces are pretty much just stand ins for the Forsaken, because we couldn’t wage war with a playable race.
She is likely the new leader whether anyone likes it or not
At the moment she looks like what Banshees in real world mythology look like, including the White Lady ghost motif, especially Cliodhna the Banshee Queen
I think Anduin is going to be forced to turn her into a Banshee, but instead of how Sylvanas/Uther/Jaina reacted to Arthas, Calia will forgive Anduin and Uther/Jaina will not abandon Anduin
So she’ll have Normal Porcelain Calia but also a Scary Death Banshee Calia, but instead of shadowy black like Sylvanas it’ll be ghostly white tendrils (Light + Death)
re: Lilian
She represents the Now-Traditional Forsaken, even though she was raised in Cata and not by Arthas
Velonara identifies as both Sin’dorei and Forsaken as of 8.3
Narrative can be worked on so Lorthemar can apologize to the Undead Elves for not reaching out sooner
Aelthalyste is basically Forsaken’s Cult of Forgotten Shadow person as of Legion, but is a Banshee too
re: Derek
Missed opportunity for a Davey Jones character
Once Helya is killed, the Helajar and Kvaldir will be leaderless
Maybe they’ll want to join the Forsaken?
re: Cult of Forgotten Shadow
Legion “revealed” the Cult had died and it wasn’t a Forsaken religion
Legion made Natalie Seline a living Human
But they made her Black which is cool
I’d retcon it so Natalie is actually undead, replace her eyes with one of the Forsaken eye options, just say “The Void preserved my flesh, and luscious curls”
Have Natalie Seline and Aelthalyste be the Cult of Forgotten Shadow leadership
re: Delaryn
oof
Guess we gotta do something
Chuck her under Velonara basically, Ranger-Captain of the Dark Rangers, Velonara as new Ranger-General of the Dark Rangers, sprinkle some Undead Nelves next to the Undead Helves and Belves
re: Faranell
give this man a promotion, Grand Apothecary Faranell
re: Forsaken governance
Calia is ruler, Banshee Queen part 2
Core ruling advisors = Girl Power of Velonara, Delaryn, and Lilian
Core military advisors = Helcular, Belmont, and Faranell
re: Forsaken Raison d’Etre
The Sepulcher looks like may be on Azeroth (the thing Zovaal wants that the First Ones hid and he needs the Five Sigils to open)
Willing to bet it’s in Lordaeron
The Forsaken exist ultimately because the Primus got himself captured
Primus should maybe feel responsible for the Forsaken
Primus may be impressed by the brutality of the Forsaken military efforts
Boom, House of the Forsaken, Calia is Margrave of the Forsaken
Baron Lilian and Baron Velonara
The Forsaken are now tasked with eternally guarding the Sepulcher in Lordaeron
Plague Deviser Marileth, now Margrave Marileth of Plagues, works with Faranell to clean Undercity, witty banter ensues
Natalie Seline and Aelthalyste learn proper necromancy from Margrave Sin’dane
Maybe some Forsworn are tasked with scouring the Maw for souls that would be good to be given a second chance at life to avoid the Maw or Revendreth
Forsaken are no longer only raised citizens of Lordaeron, but Maw-souls given new Construct bodies
Well, as someone with Forsaken fatigue after two expansions of Sylvanas and her Blight Horde, I feel like some “redemption” is necessary. I get that you and others enjoy the race’s malefic quality, but this only really worked when they were doing their thing in an insulated bubble and the wider Horde wasn’t welded to every bullet point of their sinister quest. Everyone knows what the Forsaken are about now, and what that is is not really sustainable with the pendulum swinging back to a not-evil Horde.
This is the only thing you wrote that I like here (no offense, you and I have had that conversation numerous times and simply disagree).
Having the incredibly obvious so as to be too obvious Sepulcher in Lordaeron end up being the “of course it was the obvious Sepulcher” Sepulcher that the Jailer wants would tie the Jailer back into the Forsaken, the Old Gods, maybe a chance to reitroduce Yogg-Saron, and give an excuse to update Lordaeron/Undercity as a 9.2 or 9.3 style hub zone. I like it.
Blood Elves had a unique backstory and theme and Blizzard “redeemed” them and now they’re boring and terrible. Lor’themar is a wet blanket. Asking them to do that to the Forsaken is naive and short-sighted.
I’m suffering from Night Elf fatigue, how about that?
