10/28/2018 11:10 PMPosted by
Xukon It makes me wonder if OP is trolling based on his lack apparent lack end game experience.
I have to wonder why people keep going back to this excuse.
Ever consider that people don't raid in WoW because they don't enjoy it? I had my fill of raiding back in WoD, dropped raiding almost entirely early on in
Legion... and pretty much stopped giving a damn about ANY sort of progression in WoW with BfA. And over the course of the last few weeks, I've been slipping back into FFXIV.
... on the other hand, I got 18/36 appearances out of the Mage Tower during
Legion. Had a lot more fun doing that than I ever did raiding.
Come to think of it, this sort of mechanic would be GREAT for a Mage Tower type of challenge.
I feel sorry for the tanks, There job is to take damage all the time.
I mean not avoiding a mechanic already has downsides. Usually this is taking a bunch of damage. Sometimes Blizzard adds more complicated ones like DoTs/Debuffs.
For instance on Ghuun Heroic if you get hit by the mothballs you get the debuff that makes you shoot out mothballs, and on Mythic if you get hit you get the debuff and you instantly shoot out mothballs. On Mythrax if you don't dodge lasers or be at least 12y away from imminent ruin you get max hp reduction stacks. On Fetid M if you stand in DoT circles it spreads the DoT to you.
Why implement a mechanic like this that would ultimately punish the healer more than the person who stood in the bad (assuming they are not one and the same)? If you want people to pay more attention to their surroundings, then the debuff would need to be specific to their role, ie: 10% reduced dps for 10 seconds, etc.
Yeah this is more accurate. But also doing something like permanent debuffs for not avoiding every mechanic would be stupid. There are plenty of places where you will need to get hit by one mechanic to do another properly, or where you are fine getting hit by something (ex: Gestate on Vectis, no one actually avoids it).
But yes, even in LFR would be dealing with this.
Here's where you lost me. Disclaimer in advance: I don't do dungeons or raids so I have no dog in this fight so to speak. That said, plenty of folks do LFR because they don't have a good enough computer or good enough reflexes to do higher level instances. What's avoidable to someone getting high FPS and who has good reflexes is not necessarily avoidable to someone without those benefits.
they received a generic debuff which increased their all their damage taken by ~30%, which lasted for around 90 seconds and stacks?
That's a huge penalty for folks who may be playing the game with big handicaps to begin with. I understand why you're advocating for this, but extending it to LFR will make that content no longer accessible to quite a few folks, and since the point of LFR is to make the content available to as many people as possible, that's not a good thing, especially when more and more content that used to be soloable (like professions and flying) is being gated behind dungeons and raids.
I'm going to entertain the OP for a moment to explain why this is a bad idea on such an inconceivable level that any response other than outright rejection is absurd.
Firstly, who decides what mechanics this should be avoidable? Sometimes it is a legitimate strategy to ignore a mechanic such as gestate on Vectis (even up to Mythic), if this gave the debuff like the OP suggested then the fight suddenly becomes much harder.
Or what about the blood on Taloc which is technically avoidable but you will inevitably take some damage from it while you are dropping the debuff? Okay Taloc just went from very easy to much harder.
What about the caster adds on Zek'voz? Their damage is technically avoidable, and it going off is likely to kill someone on mythic, should it give the debuff? Should one of the faceless adds exploding give the debuff?
Clearly certain degrees of the debuff would need to be implemented because certain raid mechanics like the Mythrax beam don't hit particularly hard, but hit moderately at a very fast rate? If this gave a 30% debuff the fight would become brutal.
What about on Mythic Zek'voz where it is a legitimate strategy for certain characters with heavy defensives to go out when surging darkness happens so there is a suitable spread for eye beam.
Sometimes its better to ignore mechanics to nuke the boss, sometimes bosses present situations where two avoidable mechanics happen at once and the only way to survive is to get hit by the lesser of the two. Sometimes mechanics due to the way they are designed are unavoidable for some of their damage but not all of their damage.
No OP, this is such a terrible idea that if it were implemented it would kill the raiding scene as we know it.
Sincerely - a mythic raider.
Firstly, who decides what mechanics this should be avoidable?
The developers, who else?
Possibly as a way to prevent players from subverting or ignoring mechanics. When that's the case, any "legitimate strategy" built around ignoring the mechanic will have to be reconsidered because of the debuff.
It doesn't have to be applied EVERY mechanic, just the ones which SHOULD be avoided.
The Devs make the call.
Players will learn and adjust regardless.
... honestly, it's like I have to coach people about critical thinking and using their imagination here.
Firstly, who decides what mechanics this should be avoidable?
The developers, who else?
Possibly as a way to prevent players from subverting or ignoring mechanics. When that's the case, any "legitimate strategy" built around ignoring the mechanic will have to be reconsidered because of the debuff.
It doesn't have to be applied EVERY mechanic, just the ones which SHOULD be avoided.
The Devs make the call.
Players will learn and adjust regardless.
... honestly, it's like I have to coach people about critical thinking and using their imagination here.
If you had critical thinking and imagination you wouldn't be making this garbage suggestion in the first place.
Now don't go whining saying we aren't gonna contribute to the discussion or have a counter proposal, but what you're giving is so far off the deep end, any attempt to engage is an unequivocally undeniable bloody mf waste of time.
... they received a generic debuff which increased their all their damage taken by ~30%, which lasted for around 90 seconds and stacks?
That wouldn't teach anybody how to play, and would especially hurt new players who'd be getting severely punished in any instance they join.
Also good luck ever finishing another LFR again with that debuff going around.
Firstly, who decides what mechanics this should be avoidable?
The developers, who else?
Possibly as a way to prevent players from subverting or ignoring mechanics. When that's the case, any "legitimate strategy" built around ignoring the mechanic will have to be reconsidered because of the debuff.
It doesn't have to be applied EVERY mechanic, just the ones which SHOULD be avoided.
The Devs make the call.
Players will learn and adjust regardless.
... honestly, it's like I have to coach people about critical thinking and using their imagination here.
This would take all player creativity away in fights because Blizzard would have to decide what should or shouldn't be avoided, and maybe there is something that blizz thinks should be avoided, but if it had not been implemented players might have used it as part of the strategy. And there is such a thing as strategically getting hit by mechanics.
Also personally I would have a lot less fun on raiding farm nights because getting hit by mechanics on purpose is part of the fun.
Please stop trying to defend your idea, its embarrassing.
Lag is a thing that exists, and aussie players would pretty much just not be able to raid ever.
I have to wonder why people keep going back to this excuse.
Questioning someones raid experience when they propose a sweeping change to raids is reasonable.
If this guy was talking about world quests, his raid history would be irrelevant but he's not, so it is.
Kind of defeats the point of multiple difficulties, if people could perfectly do mechanics at that level than they would all be doing Heroic and Mythic.
That would suck. There have been MANY times over the years I deliberately eat a mechanic so the rest of the party/raid doesn't have to.
just a 12 hour non damaging stacking debuff that reads
"I stood in the bads"
This would be great because then things like tank cleave fights would be screwed up with tanks not wanting to stack because of the debuff since the cleave is avoidable.
Won't happen, people are used to getting babysat by healers.
They'd rage that mechanics actually matter now
10/29/2018 01:07 AMPosted by
Shiez Won't happen, people are used to getting babysat by healers.
They'd rage that mechanics actually matter now
Nevermind that as people have pointed out elsewhere this would just put more strain on the healers than how it is already.
Mechanics do matter unless you are a scrub who only does LFR, which isn't a bad thing by itself, but those people should really refrain from having an opinion about raiding.
If bad ideas were a crime the OP would get a life sentence.
Can we just let this thread die now?
It doesn't have to be applied EVERY mechanic, just the ones which SHOULD be avoided.
The Devs make the call.
Players will learn and adjust regardless.
Wow it's like that's exactly how raid mechanics work right now or something. The devs have set what they believe to be appropriate consequences for being hit by them.
So your point is....?
Oh yes, let's make my job as a healer even harder.
Because they're NOT going to get out of that garbage everytime and likely will purposely eat as many as they can with out it being an instagib cuz "dodging hurts muh parsez".
Just putting more pressure on your healers to keep these numpties from pushing daisies.
Playerbase and devs seem to have this insatiable urge to make healers lives harder and harder.
It should reduce their damage done, not taken. People don't notice when their damage taken is going up, until they die. They do notice when they do less damage, unless they are truly truly awful.