Less than you’d think. More than I expected. Disappointing all the same.
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well I’m a pvp player and I had really a good time on Mop monk (btw in my opnion the best gamplay for monk was in Wod but in a PvP perspective)
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I agree with the overall sentiment, but the WW raid representation isn’t because WW is bad, it’s because the other melee cleave specs are so retarded right now and mystic touch already often comes from one of the tanks normally, because BrM is so good at tanking raid bosses, so the top guilds have no reason to fill a spot with a WW.
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Does windwalker still have that mastery where you can’t use the same move twice? It gives me anxiety
Yes. Hit combo will still require you to just follow a rhythm.
Once a game is multiplayer then how you do compared to other classes 100% matters if there is a limit on raid spots. Right now that cap is 25 players. Most comps run even less. Since you are now officially competing for a spot and those are limited then you have to compare. That is just how business or even sports work. Again I do not mean this in any sort of hostile way. I am just pointing out what a lot of people over look. Any time you place a limit on space and you have different classes then good teams will not take class, that no matter how good they are played, that just do not preform BETTER than other classes.
Since WW is always cursed to be in the bottom half of dps, it has never been a class raid groups will ever stack. Enh Shaman and Shadow Priests where getting massive stacks of the same class in raids… WW was getting sat on the bench.
Well most players don’t want to do that and would rather mash buttons which might explain why its played less
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I can’t speak for most players. I enjoy WW monk but yeah sometimes I do want to shut my brain off and just got through raid mechanics so I raid on a fury warrior now. I can see the appeal.
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I place the blame for Monks being so unpopular squarely on “Combo Strikes”.
Combo Strikes takes one of the would be most fun classes to play in the game and makes it one of the least fun classes to play. Some of your procs require you to repeat your strikes which makes you lose your Combo Strikes. Combo Strikes is still IMO the most punishing class mechanic in the game.
Really who want’s to play a class where a single button mistake cost you 5% damage for next 5 seconds bare minimum?
2nd reason, Seems blizzard can’t make a decent looking tier gear for Monks for anything. My goodness Blizzard go to Japan and get nearly any Japanese Anime animator and they will do a better job. I don’t think any class has worse looking history of shat looking Tier gear.
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You’re overthinking combo strikes. You just weave the less important abilities in between important ones. Your procs do not require you break Combo Strikes, you just throw in a TP or BoK before consuming the second proc. Maybe it’s worth casting two Dance of Chiji’s back to back in some kind of burst aoe situation, but that’s very niche.
The problem with WW is that it has scaling issues in literally every expansion, and people are aware of that. I think the visuals is probably true to an extent as well. Their tiers are ugly and the abilities are a bit outdated. Fists of Fury in particular looks, sounds, and feels like a weak fart (on top of lasting for an eternity).
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Ya, I get that, still it does not feel good when you miss press a button that you’re going to lose 5% possibly on WDP or RSK. It’s a bad mechanic feels like a punishment instead of a reward. If I look at other specs which feel intensive you can make a mistake and not lose out damage on your next 4-5 attacks.
Combo strikes just has a bad feel to it and requires you to play differently than you do on nearly every other class/spec. It’s a real niche play style that IMO appeals to a very small portion of the gaming community. Combo Strikes is the sole reason I don’t play my monk. I love the idea of a monk, it’s one of my favorite fantasy arch types, yet Blizzards game play design is that which keeps my monk shelved. When PoE 2 comes out I almost certainly will be playing the new Monk Class. Yet ever since combo strikes became a thing my monk was shelved and there he sits till Blizzard changes WW combo strike to something that feels fun instead of punishing.
What in God’s name type of plant or chemical are you smoking?
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You’re daft if you think locks haven’t always had a high performing spec throughout WoW’s history.
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I take responsibility for monks being underpowered. See blizz has it out for me, personally. They know I play monk, so they want to give me a hard time. My bads.
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About a decade of leading the Monk community, answering questions, creating guides, collecting mountains of data, and diffusing doomers who’s anecdotal feelings don’t match the real world.
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- There are
368,230mythic+ parses for assassination rogue in the last two weeks - There are
60,412parses for outlaw rogue in the last two weeks. - When paired with a monk, providing mystic touch, outlaw seems to perform better and all high keys with a monk and rogue in them, appear to have an Outlaw rogue.
Despite this, outlaw has 1/6 of the representation that assassination does, because in general, without composition considerations, it is considered the better spec. ( source archon high keys / warcraft logs Nerub-ar palace / warcraft logs Mythic+ season 1 )
I didn’t name the “spec” in my post for monk, because there isn’t a “better” spec for Monk. No matter what spec readers of the post play, they aren’t feeling that great about the state of Monk. All specs are pretty bad, by the numbers.
Edit: For sake of argument if you update these numbers, they’ve went down since my original post, for all monk specs short of windwalker which remains the same. (source: mythicstats)
But also I’ve been Brewmaster exclusively this expansion, historically have played all specs, but adding this to suggest that I’m not really concerned with windwalker for example, but Monk in general.
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About 3 weeks after the Xpac release I came back to Wow after leaving for 2 years previously played for just 1 month shy of 18 years. So when I came back and started to look at what class I wanted to play I saw lots of post about “how much more fun” monk was to play than previously. I though for sure that with the mastery no longer being most important that Combo Strikes was finally done away so I logged onto my monk planning to go back to MoP WW fun… Well combo strikes was not done away with, it’s just not as punishing. Still I find Combo Strikes possibly the worst class mechanic in the game, so I stopped playing my monk once again.
As to the loss of Monk numbers in the start of the Xpack. WW for example was heavily nerfed at the start of the xpac. At first monk looked to be in the top 1/4 of the DPS and was nerfed. As each other spec got more and more buffs WW dropped lower and lower. That combined with the fact that Monk play style has not really changed at all (really I have no idea what all those guys were talking about) there is no real reason to play monk. You can play other classes and get more damage, without the punishing mechanic of Combo Strikes. The only place monk use to excel was movent speed. But you can fly in this xpac, and we now have other classes that are basically just as mobile without the punishment of combo strikes AND has far greater DPS range.
Really it’s a no brainer why people dropped the class.
Edit: In PoE for many many season melee was just trash tier only one single spec really was compeitive and only in the first few weeks of the ladder reset. Justification for GGG doing next to nothing was that “Only 10% of the player base plays melee”. This obviously was because melee so very bad. Eventually the best melee players started to boycot melee and people started to leave to play other games in which melee was being treated better. So finally GGG did some real melee buffs, and what do ya know Melee player percentage exploded.
So is this the same deal with Monk? Hardly anyone plays monk so Blizz just don’t care, but the reason no one plays monk is due to Blizzards handling of the class not the lack of people wanting to play it? I would say yes, this is the case of why Monk is where Monk is.
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Basically. However, there is the caveat of whenever we break something, it’s like the Eye of Sauron just blasts us. The last time this happened was S2 DF with bugged WW tier, then before that was BDB WW, and before that was in BFA with giga haste MW with corruption, and before that was BrM raid wiping ppl in WPvP with Hot Trub in Legion. I’m pretty sure we have something this xpac too with Celestial Conduit, but I don’t know if that’s been patched yet.
Beyond that, Combo Strikes is not a hard concept to play around. Hit Combo got nerfed and is optional now, and most if not all of our abilities that matter are nigh impossible to mess up combo strikes on. Have you tried lining up SotWL, FoF, WDP, or RSK back to back? I find it difficult to believe, but also unsurprisingly disappointing that people can’t figure it out.
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Combo strikes should drop one charge of the buff, no the entire thing.
People are confusing combo strikes (mastery) with hit combo (talent. Mastery does not have a stacking buff. It is at full strength whenever eligible. Hit combo has a stacking buff and drops entirely if an attack does not trigger our mastery.
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I didn’t say it was a hard concept, it’s just not any fun whatsoever. And as I said the most punishing class mastery mechanic I can think of in the game. You also have to pay way more attention than nearly any other class since again, you can’t make a mistake or you lose 5%.
See when you play any other class ya you can make a mistake that can lose big damage such as a missed Rip or you let a stacking dot fall off. But, you don’t have the chance to lose that damage every button press. And that is the difference. Once every 15 seconds or so, not literally every button press.
Like I said there is not a lot of reasons why Monk has been basically the least played class for nearly 10 years accept that people don’t like the way they play. Know what my first monk was? I played a Fist weaver healer, OH, blizzard nerfed that all together and removed it.
Then I played WW monk in MoP, Oh blizzard did a big rework again and made major changes to how WW played, both times Monk saw major drop those specs. Well, what then was left Ah, Brewmaster, once again Brewmaster climbed the ranks and lots of people liked Brewmaster, Chucking barrels was supper fun and one of my most favorite tanks ever to play. But then once again Blizzard did not like Brewmaster having fun, chucking barrles was somehow to op, so once again the fun was nerfed out of the spec.
Every time monk had the fun parts stripped away and replaced with far less fun mechanics. I remember my MoP Monk fondly enough that I come back to monk every now and then hoping Blizzard has come to their senses, but no, they will not change and monk will stay bottom of the barrel for play rate.