We need different class designers for Monk (Week 5)

Community General Discussion
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numbers based on week ending on 11/19/2024

Performance

A follow-up from We need different class designers for Monk

According to mythicstats the top 2000 M+ keys last week for monk specs are:

increasing my precision here as number are below 1% now :face_exhaling:

  • 0.47% for windwalker monks (down 0.1% previous week)
  • 0.95% for brewmaster monks (down 0.2% from the previous week)
  • 4.9% for mistweaver monks (up 0.3% from the previous week)

Among all key ranges: (popularity)

  • 3.2% for windwalker monks (tied lowest class of all dps with priest)
  • 6.8% for brewmaster monks (lowest class of all tanks)
  • 11.2% for mistweaver monks (second lowest class of all healers)

Representation

  • MW 11.2% out of 7 possible healers (14% would represent even representation )
  • WW 3.2% out of 26 possible dps (3.8% would represent even representation )
  • Brew 6.8% out of 6 possible tanks (16% would represent even representation )

Amongst all key ranges (popularity):
Mistweaver is behind even representation by 20%.
Windwalker is behind even representation by 16%.
Brewmaster is behind even representation by 58%.

Amonst the top 2000 keys:
Mistweaver is at behind even representation by 65%.
Windwalker is behind even representation by 96%.
Brewmaster is behind even representation by 94%.

Sources:

According to mythicstats the top 2000 M+ keys last week for monk specs are:

https://mythicstats.com/period/985

Among all key ranges:

https://raider.io/mythic-plus-rankings/season-tww-1/all/world/leaderboards.

5 Likes
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There were about 40 posts like this, and some were even bigger and better and had graphs and charts and stats on why the changes to druid back in Season 3/4 of Dragonflight, and then teh doubling down on said problems in TWW…
They lost a lot of hardcore druid players because a lot of them feel like the people designing the druid class, especially the healing spec, have no idea what a druid even is.

They talked about it for months and never got truly heard, TWW came out and they still werent heard and nothing has changed.
I know 7 people who mained druid since BC that stopped because of the ignorant changes.

I hope you get some better luck.

oh yeah, and the vote they did for seaon 4.
We have literally data logged for over 800k different rogues all doing raid content and M+…but somehow only 11k rogues voted for sets…
All because blizzard sucks at communicating. First time they ever do a vote in all of their history…and they told nobody and expected third-party sites to do the telling for them.
They literally had the breaking news section and the launcher and the log-in-screen.
And they chose to leave it to the main page of wowhead or twitter, where most wow players simply don’t go. Can’t remember the last time I saw the main page for wowhead because, like most people, I just google “X achievement + wowhead” and get the result at the top and bypass the main page entirely.

Blizzard has been out of touch with class design since after legion. They did such a good job there, and then undid literally all the good work and now here we are, where five classes in the game all have MONTHS long forums threads talking about how crap the design is, just like this post.

Nothing is going to get done because they make more money off microtransactions than subscriptions.
Your vote no longer counts because whales are coming in.
Notice how many new cosmetics are being developed instead of literally anything else, like bug fixes on bugs that have been around since Wrath and are very much gamebreaking…

The community is overly toxic in the extreme, most of the good people don’t have chat turned on and as such all that gets left in the chat are the snakes and trolls and new players who keep getting scared off in droves because nobody wants to pay to play a game where the community is so toxic that we made a shirt and bought it.

“I survived the barrens chat”…

I wish you all the luck to getting the monk changes you guys want, because nobody else is lol

6 Likes
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Ignoring the vomit beneath your original post, what does this have to do with designers? I get the representation and allusion to throughput but none of what was said was a comment on actual class design

I think a lot of this is just a symptom of tuning as, at least for WW, it’s great to play it just doesn’t have higher-end throughput.

With HoF closing and MDI/AWC wrapping up soon (I think), we should see a tuning pass (rip enh).

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https://mythicstats.com/meta?expansion=all

Season 3 of DF was good for MW, short of this representation for all monk specs isn’t bad right now, its always been bad. So its more than just a tuning thing at this point.

From a perspective of a player that returned in DF, and landed on monk perhaps especially. Windwalker did look like it had some showing in a few expansions I missed.

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Being able to see that there is a problem, and being able to vocalize exactly what needs to get done and/or how are entirely different skills.

One may see that somebody is dying and wasting away, but you might not know what to do. IT could be cancer, it could be they have a fast metabolism and are low on energy or maybe they are diabetic. Or maybe they are just skinny. Who knows?
Either way, a professional needs to take a look at what is happening.

This player is just drawing attention to the fact that there is a problem. Hell, I played Druid for 15 years and gave them a literal pdf and spreadsheet and a video essay on the many design flaws.
Nothing changed. They have their philosophy and won’t change it for anybody, not even if they lose a chunk of the players maining that class, they will do their changes and ignore any feedback until it reaches a critical point.

So again, it’s not really on the player to come up with solutions, though many have tried and done a great job…and also got ignored, even when people can have a few hundred people backing the idea and they come in with data and evidence to support their claim and ideas and even artwork…
Ignored.

2 Likes
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Monks need some real love and that is a fact. Very fun class to play, especially brewmaster, I love my brewmaster monk, it’s just a very gimped tank at the moment.

5 Likes
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That’s great but that isn’t anything you’ve commented on, you’ve just compiled some information with nothing else attached

What design failure lead to the “downfall” of MW? I don’t really see any glaring failures on the account of WW, and now we’re on a spec by spec basis rather than saying that “monk designers” need to go.

once again we could do without the lorem ipsum, but you’re right. Players can certainly help, but saying the monk designers need to be changed out while not suggesting why is just… yeah

it’s really a tuning issue and the fact that monk is historically one of the least played classes.

And if it’s a design issue, say what it is

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Yeah I’m with Kyriae here… You’re not worth the 20 characters a post requires.

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thanks for posting data without a shred of analysis then calling for someone’s job to be replaced then

typical GD nonsense

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Is this not the Dunning Kruger effect?

If you have a plumber come fix your sink and it leaks all over after he leaves, do you tell him what he should have done, or you get a new plumber? You’re saying here, that you need to know your stuff when it comes to plumbing before you can say he did a bad job. Maybe he just needed to turn the wrench a few times right?

I’m not a game designer, maybe you think you are, but I can tell when Gini is mega high for tanks year after year that something is not working.

If you’d fire the plumber why are you more lenient to the devs? You pay them both.

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Your fundamental misunderstanding of design vs tuning isn’t going to be saved by pulling the “dunning Kruger effect” out of your back pocket

Either say why you think the design is bad or has caused an exodus from monk (which would support you wanting new designers), or pivot the conversation to wanting buffs (for the millionth time, a tuning issue)

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Okay. Dear Blizzard… Please fix my 6 season long tunning issue with Brewmaster. My 9 out of the last 10 seasons of Mistweaver tuning issues. And the last 4 seasons of windwalker tuning issues.

Apologies for confusing years of tuning issues as design problems Faminex.

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lol

I give up, you just want to scream fix it but don’t know what you want fixed or why you don’t like it

gl being miserable I guess

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years…

https://mythicstats.com/meta?expansion=all

I did find this ignore feature now. Neat.

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monk bad all the time, make monk good

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A brief overview of patch notes shows some classes get a lot of love and others get ignored. Perhaps this thread is taking the emotive hyperbole approach because it is the most effective for change?

It is not on us it works this way, do you think people want to devolve to this level of theatrics?

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Statistics are fun to play with.

If you include all the PVP leaderboards (Solo,2v2,3v3,Blitz,RBG), highest represented spec over 2400 rating is Mistweaver Monk.

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Given I asked them several times why they think the design is attributing to these numbers, yes. That, or (more likely) they just want to complain for the sake of it.

I myself am hoping ww receives quite a bit of love in the next tuning pass

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This is absolutely crazy considering the hundreds of thousands of people that play monk. Slap in the old face.

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Well, consider this face slapped. Indeed.