Was The Alliance Trying To Achieve Maximum Dazar'alor War Crimes?

Lore Story Forum
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Thing is, Theramore was 100% justified, Theramore was what supported the Alliance war in the Barrens, Southshore I am not sure… need to look up on that, so out of all Garrosh’s crimes, Theramore isn’t one of them. Considering he made sure they knew a attack was coming so they would evacuate most civilians and call in more soldiers and high-ranking animals.

Southshore I can’t really tell you, not sure what that one is about.

I did not know they dispelled them, thanks for clearing that one up.

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Umbric basically states at the start that Imbuing the remains of the Devilsaur is not mana efficient and that it’s meant as a Psychological Warfare Tactic because the Zandalari have weak stomachs when it comes to the undead (and I would consider Psychological Warfare to be sufficiently dark on the moral spectrum as well). At the end of the Quest he congratulates you and states they need to begin undoing the enchantments before the Undead Void Devilsaur cannot be controlled anymore. I guess the longer it was in use the stronger it became.

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Wellll…you see this one is also a bit iffy because Molten Giants were involved.

See, Molten Giants aren’t like other fire elementals, they were in fact a plot point in Tides of War. They can only really be summoned by Dark Shaman and they are violent and uncontrollable, they’ll slaughter indiscriminately in whatever area they are deployed. Since they are so extremely destructive(And indeed even the process of summoning one damages the land around it.) they have been banned by the Earthen Ring for quite awhile now.

The Dark Irons are Dark Irons so of course they wouldn’t care, they have been doing Dark Shamanism before Garrosh ever got his hands on it, but it is worth considering that using these monsters at all…much less in a marketplace…would probably count as a war crime.

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you are initiating a suprise attack on a major population center, i think only a fool would believe that no civilians would be killed. Civilians are not soldiers, in a crisis they are bound to panic and run into danger.

Course, that does not excuse the dark iron dwarves going ham and murderizing everything in sight, but it does fit their race. DI seem to fit the same role forsaken USED to fill. Vicious dogs of war that are highly effective, but REALLY want to keep a tight leash on so they dont go off the rails or else…well teldrassil/darkshore

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Fair enough, i can concede to the argument that Theramore isn’t a warcrime, but my point about the Horde going down that path still stands. I just wish Garrosh was still alive and Sylvanas is the one who was killed in MoP.

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Early into the Alliance’s War Campaign when you set up a base in Zibala, the Dark Irons summon a Molten Giant to slaughter hundreds of Goblins. Part of the process involved explaining how they specifically maintain control over the Molten Giants, a feat which required, I believe, certain idols.

My overall impression was, when it comes to the element of Fire, the Dark Irons have a lot of knowledge and tricks no other Shamans would have, as a result of their prolonged servitude to Ragnaros. So I don’t think the Dark Irons summoning Magma Giants poses the same risk that Garrosh’s Dark Shamans posed back in Tides of War.

[Edit]: Found the Quest: https://wow.gamepedia.com/Fragment_of_the_Firelands

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I disagree, I wish Sylvanas would have never become Warchief, and I wish the Writers would stop retconning her story so they can turn her into the villain they want her to be.

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Dark Irons and Void Elves in general have been an excellent addition to a morally grey Alliance. I hope they aren’t forgotten in future expansions.

I agree with that, but her being dead after Southshore/Gilneas is no different to me since i was never a fan of her character, except for maybe 5 minutes in wc3.

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That is actually somewhat interesting, though I think that the Dark Shaman thought the same thing from their own point of view. That doesn’t stop the ritual from being dangerous and potentially backfiring in a horrific way. Which frankly makes the Dark Irons kind of cool in my eyes, but still…Marketplace.

Even if true, they are being thrown at big but relatively harmless Brutosaurs and shopkeepers with broomsticks.

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Agreed. I was amused when the two groups first interacted in Zibala and it was a fairly friendly one. I rather hope the two groups become friendly in the future to be honest. Whatever dark elements the Alliance has will need to stand together and back one another up if they are to have a chance of maintaining that.

As it is, I could easily see Anduin chastising the Dark Irons over what they did in Dazar’alor.

That said if Umbric stood up for them, and Genn, and Tyrande, I think Anduin would have a hard time actually doing anything.

Someone mentioned it ages ago, but the idea of a, ‘Dark Alliance,’ within the Alliance, one that does terrible things for the Alliance, is something to be hoped for. Void Elves, Dark Iron Dwarves, Worgen, and Night Elves could easily be exactly that.

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After BFA i kind of hope the Alliance (and Horde for that matter) split.

You’d have traditional Alliance like Humans, Dwarves, Gnomes and High Elves. Then a darker Alliance of Worgen Night Elves, Void Elves and Dark Irons. Not sure about draenei or pandaren though.

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I agree except for the part about the Brutosaurs. Something that large can easily do a lot of damage just by walking around. Shopkeepers with broomsticks, on the other hand, yeah, not really much of a threat.

I still wish the Night Elves had a chance to shine here.

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I’m hoping Night Elves get their time to shine in 8.2

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Yeah, seeing smaller factions based off of how different races interact would be much better than our current set-up of two factions that consume everything.

I imagine Pandaren and Draenei could fit into the traditional Alliance with the Humans and the rest. Oddly, maybe the Lightforged would fit into the Darker Alliance. They’re zealous enough for it.

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The thing is, Gilneas was more justified before the retcons where she literally had no choice, where Garrosh pulled a Garithos and gave Sylvanas a impossible suicide mission task.

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As much as i’d actually hate to see them split, the current factions seem to be held back by their races being banded together. Maybe you could still group for example with the dark alliance/alliance but not the two horde factions.

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True, but Brutosaurs are easily spooked and subdued. Wave a saurd in the things face and it’s practically paralyzed with fear, they are after all are mostly herbivores.

Then again to the alliance it does look like a giant dinosaur and given how much the Zandalari wage war with said giant dinosaurs it could easily be mistaken for a warbeast, so fair.

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I’ve mostly played the Alliance content, and recently completed questing on the Horde side (not the War Campaign, mind you, and not the after-zones questline), but I can’t say I’d ever come across anything that made the Brutosaurs out to be quite so meek. I remember a quest about them in Zuldazar, a goblin and troll try to get a male and female to breed and all, but nothing about it suggested they’re easy to spook or subdue. In fact if I recall correctly you basically help one of the two fight off some predators.

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Damn, i was too late too post “laughs in Teldrassil”

VARIAN, MY LATE KING, I HAVE FAILED YOU!

In all seriousness though, the dinos prolly had it coming but those dark iron and the elementals totally went off script- they would prolly be sanctioned if anyone alliance side noticed them and/or the worldbuilding wasn’t a mess

Sure, kill every single last zandalari holding weapons during the attack… but civilians is too far man- I prefer my wars #morallygraymane.

The Ebon Blade stands together, brother! :muscle: :skull: :crossed_swords:

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Well one, thanks for playing Horde content because I feel like we don’t have enough duel faction perspectives here. But in response to that, it happens in the world quests, they stomp around if a Saurd gets in their way and refuse to move, obviously they are more aggressive in the wilds but the ones that the Zandalari domesticate are fed watermelons and the like. They are unlikely to have actually ever killed a predator, don’t really need to when you have a entourage of guards.

If push comes to shove, the Zandalari subdue them by hexxing or polymorphing them. Of course they don’t like doing that because then the crates spill all over the ground and get broken so the merchants are…yeah.

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