Ms is strong, folks need follow up… We need a damage source, ret has holy, rogue has bleeds, poison, armor reduction… We could use something like an improved exposed added onto MS or Slam, preferably slam to help out fury.
who else remembers them saying that some of the talent fixes they were thinking of were combining talents that make sense like polearm and axe spec because they are the same thing just for different weapon types… they also have not done that, Turtle wow has but not official wow.
I guess you’ve missed how ridiculous everyone’s damage is BUT warrior. On PTR I can get a ret or boomkin premade char to unload on the target dummy for 4.5k dps pretty easily solo with no raid (just the bought consumes and WBs) but warrior is like half that. And then in PVP you have armor so half that again. Rets and rogues can routinely kill people in a single stun that you take 20+ seconds to kill in your videos. BGs with the stam slow this all down but youre still doing terrible damage compared to anyone else with your gear and consume usage.
Our healing debuff is what we trade for top level damage, all damage is welcome though.
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rogues are towards the top of damage and also have a healing debuff… and chain stuns. Paladins get bubbles, freedoms, cleansing, healing… priests get high mitigation, dispersion, dispels, heals, bubbles, healing, hots, etc. Druids get tank like armor, offhealing, massive range, tons of instant cast damage and dots…
even in original classic when Arms damage was comparable to other classes in non-raid environments any more than 1 in your battleground was a waste. Now they do less than half the dmg of other classes.
This idea is so off base.
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Warriors should do lots of damage… but they can’t be as mobile as they are. There should be a tradeoff.
I would be ok if MS hit like a mack truck. Its their signature move. After fighting a bunch of warriors the last few days on my mage. They aren’t missing much. They have mobility and decent damage. I would make stance dancing a thing too… Defensive Stance reduces X amount of damage (but you hit like a wet noddle).
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We still stance dance, the tier gives grace period but most warriors are still using all stances.
We are wearing plate and have a ton of utility if played correctly. I am not saying we don’t need a buff but I can see an argument that our damage should be slightly lower than other than ret.
Rogues should be glass cannons, we should not be doing rogue burst.
I’ve consistently seen Arms warriors scoring high on killing blows in BGs. Kefta actually knows what he’s talking about if you’ve watched his videos.
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That’s not surprising. They have so many dps specs available for warrior from a PVE standpoint right now, that it would be a lot of time and effort to try supporting an additional one on top of that.
No one is playing Holy Priest but you don’t see anyone demanding there be revamps there. 2H enhancement got a tiny bit of support but is still pretty dead. Arcane is relegated to healing for mages now and gets no DPS support, and it took until this patch for frost to get dps support. This is just how a seasonal server is going to go with as wide as they have stretched themselves on design with their team.
IMO fix the existing specs before adding melee hunters. Arms is iconic. It’s the highest skillcap spec for warrior pvp. They should give arms some love.
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a rogue can chain stun you. Rogues and hunters, despite wearing leather and mail, are way harder to kill than you. They avoid far more attacks. They dont have to worry about 10% more dmg in zerker stance. Armor is less useful against any class with magic.
Dude, BOOMKINS have more armor than you. Literally more armor than plate. And they can barkskin for even more mitigation on top of the armor and not slow down dps either.
The problem with your argument is 1) holy priest as a spec functions for healing 2) warrior has only fury to play. 1h or 2h and the main difference is just the leg rune making 2h attack faster to compete with no offhand. The playstyle is almost exactly the same outside of overpowering off of a proc or off of a dodge. Meanwhile hunter has ranged hunter, 1h melee, 2h melee, and ways to make it work with basically all three talent trees, mostly marks and survival, but even BM does way more damage than arms. Rogue can play all three talent trees in PVP and PVE… and it can tank!
Arms is an iconic talent tree among many. Mage is PUMPING as frost mage… and can play fire, and can heal as arcane. Like why is Arms just entirely forgotten? Its the only spec too. They took care of every single class and added many new playstyles without forgetting the old ones, with the exception of warrior. They spent the least amount of time on warrior by a huge margin.
And this isnt a hard fix. Literally just add damage to a few abilities and Arms is now fun. Not optimal, but playable. Make mortal strike work like scourge strike and do X% more weapon damage as a bleed. Make Rend tic on application and do real damage, not 3% of your overall even runed. Make overpower gush a target with your MS applied for X% weapon damage. Make sweeping strikes do X% weapon damage as a bleed to your primary target. Tune it to do around Ret DPS after the initial wave of changes and WABAM, you can play arms in SoD.
I’d say keep it under fury and make fury the ramping pumping raid spec, but the problem here is fury also the last few weeks has basically been in last place (outside of arms) for DPS sooooo, it’s not really a good dps metric to benchmark to be weaker than lol.
ideally we’d see fury towards the top of raid dps as that’s literally all its for, scaling with world buffs and raid buffs and ramping up DPS on raid fights, and Arms as the more general use spec for dungeons, pvp, open-world, but the team doesnt own calculators so achieving anything complicated is off the table for them.
Nothing you said after my argument is a problem with my argument. It’s just things you don’t like, and also some false equivalence and just incorrect statements.
All talent trees are iconic by this logic. Just because you like arms doesn’t make it special.
youre wrong, youre asserting that because smite priest isnt a new and manufactured playstyle and that holy for priests is still a healing tree, that an entire existing talent tree in another class can be useless for all game activities. This is obviously nonsense.
A more equal comparison would be if holy priest’s healing output was 1/4th of what it should be, it got next to no updates for sod, and it was entirely useless by an extreme to degree for all game activities and roles.
See, even the “worst” talent tree for a lot of classes still doebles arms dps, or more. Its a massive outlier and the only one in SoD that reaches this degree. Frost mage, sub rogue, ret paladin, boomkin, shadowpriest, etc all blow Arms away.
No I am saying that holy priest both smite and healing didn’t get anything special, and so no one plays holy they all play disc because there is nothing special for going holy. Which is the same situation that Arms is in.
I also reject your assertion that arms is useless for all content. There are plenty arms warriors doing exceptionally well in PVP. It’s not great for PVE. No one said it had to be. This is why you’re wrong about my stance.
Incorrect. That’s not how specs or classes work. You’re working off made up nonsense from the start, meaning it’s impossible to have a real conversation with you.
And? This is not an argument. This is just you being unhappy that arms isn’t playable in PVE dps. Ok. Say that. It doesn’t merit some inherent or divine right just because you want it to.
But youre wrong. Holy is still playable, and the gap from it to the top is no where near as big as the gap from Arms to other playable specs. There are some specs in the game that aren’t S++ tier but they’re at least PLAYABLE. Enhancement shaman is among the weakest DPS specs in the game right now but it still almost doubles Arms DPS. Not 10%, not 20%, not 50%, but 80%. And the top specs do over 120% more damage. More than doubles. This also shows you the range that every other class sits in, and how much less arms does than everyone else. It’s literally obsolete, below tanks and healers.
Arms is absolutely useless for all content, including PVP. None do exceptionally well. Under all circumstances, you do far less DPS than any other class. Also in PVP you have no way to quick apply sunders, so while a boomkin doubles your raid DPS, in PVP everyone has a ton of armor. A boomkin has 55% armor. So you are now doing 1/4th its damage. If your team wants to carry a stamina based warrior for a MS debuff because your rogue, which does massively more damage than the warrior, doesnt want to run wound poison you can get some use out of it but its generally just no worth it. And as the warrior its miserable. Mortal strike often does less damage than a moonfire dot tic, even with BiS gear on.
Can you smash a fresh 60 in the wrong spec with the wrong runes on still? Probably, but apples to apples youre half a player as a warrior right now.
This is exactly how they work. Holy can still heal. It doesnt heal for 1/4th of all the other specs of classes, and you can play it and not be useless. You just wont be as optimal or powerful as a difference spec or class. But Arms is extreme, You arent a rogue playing the wrong spec, or a weaker class. Youre half of the next worst class. These arent 5% or even 50% deltas. Its over 100% in many cases.
If frost and sub rogue are pumping, and great in raid AND great in PVP, your argument evaporates. There is 0 logical reason to leave arms dead and useless. Give it the frost mage or rogue treatment and its playable.
Druid starfall and magic damage will shred through me despite having shieldwall up.
Yet arms warrior has to hit for less than a starfall tick or druid dot tick.
This is done by blizzard deliberately, no way people working there are soo incompetent to not see an issue here.
Wish i had the power to make the people responsible for this state of the warrior class, play nothing but warrior for a month straight in pvp and watch them grow gray hairs and grind their teeth.
By what metric? You’re making an arbitrary statement. If holy priest is playable SO is arms. You just don’t like how arms is performing.
No it doesn’t. You’re just a whiney child that doesn’t listen. My argument isn’t that PVP viable specs shouldn’t be good in PVE. My argument is that Arms doesn’t need special treatment just because you want it to have it, and it works fine and often well in PVP.
Go troll somewhere else. Also ty for the bump