I’m really glad that WoW is taking on a more friendly feel between the two factions and I’m glad it is making people displeased. I’m hoping for the end of World of WARcraft. People can go and boot up DoSbox for WC2 already.
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do you remember the wc3 first quest after the three faction works together? It was not peacefully, it was passiv aggresive and a little strive could inflict the worst conflict…
Maybe this would display the right impact the entire fourth war have, and would be appropiate. The alliance simply don´t trust the horde anymore…and is passive aggresiv …and the horde this time is not but simply take it…because yeah, they aren´t in a position to argue.
I agree in part, but I think that is due to a loss of focus regarding the aims of the factions. The Alliance is not at risk of being annihilated by the Horde, and the Horde has established a homeland.
With cross faction gameplay and guilds, I personally hope Blizzard performs a soft break up of the factions, with the player character being more a mercenary/adventurer than a savior of the faction (perhaps too late). For example, rivalry between the human nations re-emerging, the elven nations having their own respective goals, etc. Something that wouldn’t require a 5th war.
Your line about Disney and Disneyfication resonated with me though. That is not to say Warcraft should be grimdark, but the world is sanitized. For example, the centaur were isolated and unchanged for 10,000, and yet are unfazed by the emergence of 2-legged aliens crawling through their land. The militarized response of the Nohkud/bad guys seems realistic, whereas the other centaur missed their exit ramp to Disney land.
Ashran didn’t really have any real story context. Also it was terrible so it doesn’t count.
And how many times should that happen before you would be satisfied?
How many times has the Alliance lost something? How many times have they cried about something the Horde did to them? And then immediately lost something again in the next expansion?
Add all that up and at least that many.
I’d hardly say this is a good example. The Nohkud were more interested in a power grab for control over the centaur clans instead of waging war against the “2-legged aliens”. They also didn’t seem to have any problem with allying with those same invaders as well as dragons if it meant they got an edge over the other tribes. And what’s this crap about disney land ramps? Did you even do the quests? We had to work with the clans, hunt and prove our strength. We weren’t frolicking through the fields and singing music numbers, we were slaying dangerous beasts. Honestly it’s nice to deal with the lesser races that doesn’t involve us exterminating them for a pair of boots and 200 xp. Blizzard has a plethora of races that just exist to be quest fodder or loot pinatas with no other purpose apart from that. It’s boring and wasteful. The centaur are an extreme case especially with some aspects of them being a racist depiction of mongolian culture.
Really if there’s anything to complain about it’s how the storyline has some similar beats to what happened in Highmountain and the tauren tribes.
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In fact, during the quest where you had to collect some meat, they will ‘mock’ you if you kill the neutral beasts. Saying that those are not worthy of your skills.
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I am only renown 6 with them so far, not sure if changes down the road, but some of the NPCs will call you Two Feet and it’s not a compliment. Or they will address you as Outsider or Stranger, to really beat home that while you are helping, most of them are wary of you.
Could someone explain to me what the appeal is supposed to be about the night elves spurning most of the alliance? I occasionally see people positive about the fact that they’re still written as angry that the others didn’t do enough for them but I don’t see what kind of positive road that’s supposed to lead to.
Makes them more independent I guess.
To be fair the are spurning both Horde and Alliance.
Alliance failed them on both protection and retaking their land and the Horde.
Well thats obvious I guess.
But spurning the Alliance is new and I doubt the Horde cares one way or another.
Unless NEs were leading Horde hunting expiditions
Well yeah, it’s obvious why they’d hate the horde, but neither side has ever really cared what the other thinks of them before so I figure that’s irrelevant.
It’s just the alliance spurning that confuses me, since it’s not like night elves will suddenly become a standalone world power to compensate for it, nor do they have a third faction to consider, even if just on paper.
I think its fine as it is, its probably a natural reaction to the Alliance failing their mandate.
It would be weirder if they were too chummy.
Its always nice to have a voice tell Andiun to shut up.
I think (at least for some people) its just recognition of an event in an ongoing story. Even if that event was poorly presented. Some night elf players also may feel that their narrative connection to the alliance robs them of a level of distinctive agency.
Personally, I feel this critique comes from the amount of mushiness or schmaltz I’ve seen in this expansion. I’d like to be clear, I’ve been having fun with Dragonflight but there’s only so much “if only my family would embrace my artistic side…” or “if they’d only just listen to ME, everything would be ok…” etc. etc. I can take before my eyes fall out.
I’m currently doing the Bronze storyline in Thaldraszus and Siaszerthel’s voice acting is particularly grating. There’s nothing wrong with it in and of itself, but why does a dragon sound like a 8-year old Disney character? (B-but what about Chromie!? Chromie is a gnome and sounds like a gnome).
At a certain point, I’d kinda just like to rip some heads off and present them to my lord for a few coppers within a more moody setting that was established years ago. The whole ‘healing generational trauma’ or ‘please solve my relationship issues’ gets old after about 2-3 quests let alone the dozen or so I’ve encountered so far. It’s also worth mentioning the overall saturated color palette of the game world contributes to this Disney-critque. I want a bit more Frank Frazetta and a bit less Kinkade.
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I think it is a fair counterpoint that the Nohkud likewise allied with invaders; however, both the Nohkud and elementalists want to overthrow the status-quo. In contrast, prior to the Nohkud offensive, I don’t think the questing experience established a strong connection or need for the player character. They take us in as though they hadn’t been isolated for 10,000 years (to them, we are 2-legged aliens). I would contrast this with the other zones, where the factions had a definitive need for you from the start. Plus, I am stuck in old ways, where vanilla and TBC factions required to you commit a half a dozen warcrimes before they would even sell you a pair of gloves or biscuits.
Insofar as “disney-esque”, I would compare the DF centaur with our prior encounters with centaur (e.g. Wacraft 3, Desolace, etc.). The DF centaur are a complete 180 and culturally harmonious, accepting, and tolerant. It’s jarring and they are just too perfect and too convenient for my liking. Granted, based on some dialogue during the dog ride, it was implied it wasn’t all singing kumbaya for 10,000, but we just don’t see it.
Returning back to the Nohkud; what you brought up makes the Nohkud more compelling in some ways. The leader talks big about overthrowing the dragons and tribal hierarchy, yet he is likewise aligning with a foreign invader to gain an advantage. He is a Saturday morning cartoon villain for sure, but I think that had more potential than the current DF centaur being morally flawless.
I’ve said it before, but I don’t really want the Horde apology tour.
For the blue side of my heart, I want to see the Horde (or an outpost) getting smacked around and then the Alliance (or a faction therein) come in to rescue them like they always do. Make this stupid “choose renewal” Koen have some practical meaning beyond an excuse for ignoring all prior experience.
For the red side of my heart, I just want a prolonged break from MORALLY GREY. Maybe even helping the Alliance out. Honestly, talking to Captain Garrick and Shuja’s mom whose name I 100% remember was exactly what I’m looking for in the short term – characters on both sides remembering the commonalities and the team-ups of the past.
I just don’t know if I have another GRIMDARK LIKE MY SOUL rodeo in me. Especially one written as slip-shoddily as BFA.
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Well, I like it because it is how the Kaldorei should be responding. In BFA they went directly to Anduin, and he refused to send any troops to aid the Kaldorei cause because he had thrown everything into reclaiming Strom and setting them up into a Stormwind protectorate. He put human interests first and did not live up to the mutual defense pacts that are supposed to be the bedrock of the Alliance. That Anduin felt real sad about it all does not fix anything there.
See, you say you’re not looking to punish Horde players, and I almost believe you, and then you turn around and say something like this…
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Unfortunately, that won’t make both sides happy, as this thread should show.