You lie.
Opinion discarded.
About what? You have no rating in any bracket.
A black-and-white fallacy, also known as a false dilemma or false dichotomy, occurs when a situation is presented as having only two opposing options, ignoring any possible alternatives. This type of thinking oversimplifies complex issues and can lead to misleading conclusions.
I probably pvp more than you do, given that you only consider rated play as pvp, andâŚ
World pvp and unrated pvp is a valid type of pvp.
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Not when the entire purpose of the discussion at this point is the impact unrated/world conquest has had on rated queue times. If you donât queue rated, you have no skin in the game. If you have no skin in the game, your opinion has no value.
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So get rid of the conquest grind and let fresh pvp alts be on same playing field as other characters.
Cause people rn arenât queueing up for that reason.
Wouldnât you rather fresh toons be able to queue up right away with their best gear possible?
Instead of all these hours that people are pouring into their alts via war crates just to stand a chance at the sweats in full purples in S tier comps at 0 rating.
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This claim flies in the face of 15+ years of evidence to the contrary. At best youâre wrong, at worst youâre lying.
If you get your way queue times will hit 2 hours.
If you look at from the perspective that only rated matters then yes my opinion has no value. However I am looking at this from the perspective of someone who likes world pvp and doesnât like arenas. Although I think medium sized bgs are fun. I also think that gear should be easily accessible while some cosmetic rewards are there for rated players.
And in regards to the long que times. I could also argue that with people in rated there is less people outdoors world pvping.
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Rated can be fixed without having any significant negative effect on randoms/wpvp
If conquest was rewarded from rated-only, but you could build full itemized sets of warmonger (veteran track) from crates/unrated/etc, the rated players get their time respected again and the casuals lose next to nothing.
This kind of reminds me about the complaints some people had about vault giving heroic track gear, turbo boost and delves.
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One of the people in this thread I politely called out that they very obviously werenât having a good time in rated and it appeared that they blamed it all on gear.
Thst same person hasnât done a single match since yet continues the campaign against crate groups. My only thought is they canât admit theyâre wrong and itâs miles easier to blame something in their control that they simply donât want to do.
A couple weeks ago, I was chatting with a PvE healer friend and asked if she had ever geared for or played PvP. Her answer:
âI donât like PvP. Iâve tried some battlegrounds and got some honor gear before, but I die instantly. Iâm not good at PvP, and PvP in WoW isnât fun.â
So I convinced her to fly around with me while we listened to some tunes. I organized a crate raid on one of my alts. We got her toon fully geared, did a BG together, crafted her jewelry slots, and I showed her the precognition gem. By the end, she was off to the races in PvP BiS for that week, aside from remaining gem slots.
I didnât get to play with her much after that, but today I got a message:
âIâm going to teach all my friends to PvP. PvP IS SO FUN!â
Thatâs at least +1 PvP healer in the queues.
This is how you grow PvP. This is what happens when thereâs an accessible path to conquest like crate raids.
The old system of grind-heavy PvP gearing is demoralizing and has not grown PVP. Weeks of slogging through BGs or arena facing enemies with better gear and more PVP experience burns players out before they ever really get to enjoy it. Easy access = more players actually enjoying PvP.
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I mostly like to do world pvp and medium sized battlegrounds casually. Crate groups are fast quick and reliable ways to gear and respect your time. However if you had to do instanced pvp to get gear then it would be miserable. It would take a lot longer, be far less alt friendly and there is no guarantee you would even get conquest since you donât get any if you loose. Plus you would have to deal with being farmed before you can reasonably compete.
I think the gear thing should be something thats very accessible so you can then focus on improving your skills and less worried about grinding gear. Gear should either be very powerful, but easy to get or not very powerful, but not matter much. But in both cases it shouldnât force people into content they donât like.
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In addition to being loads of fun, being able to easily gear alts has made me exponentially better at PVP.
Being able to learn what other specs are capable of, what their weaknesses are, what their cds timers feel like, what their goals/win conditions are first-hand is just such a worthwhile experience.
Buff Crate Raids!
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I remember someone tried saying that to me. I had responded to them but they never replied to me after that.
Makes me think itâs easier for them to do a drive by attack on a strawman than have a real discussion. You are still free to reply to me on the other thread, if you are the same person. Or you can attempt to derail this thread.
So first, thatâs awesome to hear!
Second, donât you think it would have been better if you could have skipped the boring crate raid and instead jumped right into PvP with her?
Also. There is already rewards that required rated. Transmogs, mounts, titles etc. Even without gear gatekept behind rated, there is incentive to do rated.
No. I think bringing her into a BG wouldâve had the opposite effect and that she wouldâve confirmed in her head that PVP is bad. She basically said as much when I first asked her about PvP.
Before the gates open in a bg, I check Battleground Enemies for health values of my opponents. If I see a healer with no stamina, i.e. no pvp gear, I immediately tell my entire team to focus and kill them first. If I brought her into a bg, she likely wouldâve been hard-focused and died swiftly multiple times.
If that were me, I wouldnât be having fun. Iâd want to go back to PvE.
By gearing up first, she went into pvp feeling how strong and impactful she can be with a full set of conquest/bloody token gear rather than just getting farmed and quitting.
Well I didnât say âbattlegroundsâ I said PvP.
There has to be a better way to onboard players into PvP than having them do what is essentially a non-PvP activity.
Like I said literally no one I know would be willing to sit through something like crate raids before even trying PvP. Blizzard can make those changes (and it sounds like in Midnight they might be)
If you are talking about future or alternative systems, I could see PvP Training Grounds being a solid addition, if the conquest gains were meaningful. But for me, Comp Stomp has felt more repetitive and boring than crate raids. If you have another system that would work for new players and alts in mind, though, I would be curious to hear it.
I actually view crate raids as World PvP. When I put groups together, my goal (besides gearing my alt) is to wipe other raids. From my experience, the Warmode sharding system tends to funnel raid groups into the same shards whenever possible, which is how I prefer it.
That said, it is not nonstop combat. Sometimes players want a swift, cozy experience of mostly racing around to loot boxes until they get to the gear level that is acceptable to them for pvp.
I didnât reply back to you because your argument was non-sensical and you didnât even bother acknowledging what I said about your MMR and match history.
Itâs the same reason I didnât name you here but you knew exactly who I was talking about.
Thereâs also no derailment in the conversation as this thread is a bunch of people pontificating at this point and I was replying to an individual, not the thread itself.
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