So, from what I am reading we are getting a flat hit point boost with damage reduction increased via tattoos? Also, seems shear as an ability will now generate 2 soul fragment same as being talented into fracture? What this means to me we can now talent into feed the demon for more up-time on demon spikes while pushing out 2 fragments using shear? Also, the change to meta seems nice thus far. Increased passive hit points while generating more resources and 1 additional soul fragment. I feel perhaps all we need is maybe 1 more active mitigation ability or just keep buffing them slightly more as we near the release of 8.2 and we’ll be right up there with other tanks. I feel they need to reduce meta maybe to 3 minutes also I’d like to have the talent baked in that has a chance to proc meta when you consume a soul fragment for 5 seconds. Consume 5 fragments via soul bomb you have a pretty high change on morphing. Any thoughts?
We are getting a baseline mitigation increase (no HP increase), Soul Cleave will do 20% more damage, and Meta was buffed to increase health and cause our abilities to generate more fragments. That’s it.
Meta is already a 3 minute cooldown.
There’s a lot of discussion about all these things in this subforum and the “Items and Classes” subforum - encourage you to check it all out.
These changes indicate to us that we are on Bliz’s radar, however without additional changes, we will likely still be at the bottom of all the tanks.
We need another tank cooldown, baseline. I think the DH would be better developed if more of the utility abilities were shared across the specs. So for instance add blue for another defensive cooldown for Vengeance, and add darkness as a raid utility tool for Vengeance. I keep suggesting darkness, as I think it would be an easy addition that fits our theme. Same with blur.
- still drop dead when DS is down and on cooldown
- still forced into spirit bomb gameplay
- still feel bad using soul cleave at max pain when you have soul fragments
VDH was sturdy in legion outside of DS and cooldowns because it had insane self-healing (not as good as legion blood DK but close enough), that was gutted in BFA with no compensation
If they would just revert gluttony back to baseline and bump meta back up a little bit I would be happy.
I have not been on the PTR to test these changes in the sort of content I enjoy running, but I am cautiously optimistic. Partly this will be due to the buffs, which are slight but substantial, and partly because I’m working to retrain my gameplay away from rotational Spirit Bomb to maximizing survival when it’s called for in the Spirit Bomb paradigm.
My suspicion is that part of the reason we aren’t seeing more buffs is that we’re kind of playing the spec incorrectly. It makes sense (in a world without prot warriors at least) that there would be a defensive trade off for maximizing DPS. Going to see if I can eke out more healing.
Regardless, we have to make an earnest effort to test these changes if we’re ever going to prove that we need more. Denigrating the devs and saying things like “it wouldn’t be hard, they just have to…” without any substantiation is not going to fly.
Agreed!
Would the 2 souls per shear be overwhelming for the player? That’s as much souls as fracture, and it’s on a charge system.
Our would this be one step forward into turning shear into Fracture? Which tbh, would be wonderful.
I still firmly believe that Legion traits (that are completely missing from live) need to be rolled into baseline abilities (eg: Erupting Souls into Soul Cleave’s base functions).
*Demonic Wards damage reduction increased to 15% (was 10%).
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Demonic Wards armor bonus increased to 100% (was 80%).
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Demon Spikes armor reduced to 60% of Agility (was 85%).
-Metamorphosis
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Health bonus 50% (from 30%)
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Now causes Shear to generate 20 additional Pain and 1 additional Lesser Soul Fragment (was: generates 7 Pain per second).
*Soul cleave damage increased by 20%. (not healing).
still utter garbage compared to prot pals and prot wars tho.
lol these buffs barely help. feels bad =(
Warriors finally get a buff… Vdhs everywhere complain. Great job.
“Utter garbage”
:Jennifer Lawrence “oh okay” gif:
Paladins are cool, but they seem on par to me. They have neither the mitigation of warriors nor the self-healing of vengeance. They are slow, and they don’t have the AoE pressure we do. They don’t have an AoE silence or horrify, and they have to talent into single target long CC that will still enter combat with proximity.
They are really solid, don’t get me wrong, but they aren’t leaps and bounds better.
Hyperbole is tiresome, and will not help us get what we want.
How would you even know.
The power of paladin is the utility (BoP, bubble, BoS, that crap) and stupid group healing (see, p3 Jaina pre-nerfs) and constant magic damage.
Less tanky than monk or warrior raw, not as good at bleeds or self sustain as dk, but good for what it’s good for. That’s why most of the top 4 tanks are all rated similarly. They can all do something the others can, while still being strong enough to hold their own.
I certainly don’t think bear or vdh are utter garbage that are miles beneath them but they are a tier below, aye. 8.2 waiting room at this point.
my 385 prot pal gets invited to mythic 10s.
my 407 veng dh never gets invited.
nobody wants a veng DH
So the acts of pugs, who don’t know anything beyond “this spec is bad” and “this spec is good” is your basis?
Yes. Paladin is a stronger tank than dh. And a group that would invite a 380 anything over a 400 anything does not know better.
thank you very much
I didn’t do you any favors.
you have enlightened me. shown me the way.
Even if a non-Bomb build could eke out more healing, sacrificing 20%+ of our DPS for a bit more survivability is a pretty poor trade-off, especially given that we’re not exactly stellar DPS contributors as is. Like, maybe if they’d balanced our DPS with the baseline rotation in mind, rather than balancing us against the abomination that is Spirit Bomb, that might be valid, but as it stands, even if a non-Bomb build has competitive survivability (and I’m a long way from convinced of that), that still means you can either do competitive DPS or have competitive survivability, but not both. And that’s a crap place to be in.
Lucid Dreams + Vision of Perfection is a lot better for a non-Bomb build at least. Which isn’t saying much but still. It’ll be interesting to see how essences turn out but the only ones that look remotely interesting otherwise right now are the Honor reward and Aegis of the Deep.
If we had any talent or trait that synergized at all with Meta being up, Vision would begin to seem worth considering. For DPS though, I’m not seeing yet (though I haven’t looked super-hard) any better option than Anima.