Alternatively you can learn to cope with failure; the timer is the challenge and sometimes you won’t overcome it, and that’s alright.
In other words there is no difference, raids are just larger versions of M+ dungeons and without the timer.
If you want to sit in a raid all day that’s fine. There is nothing wrong with wanting to do just raids, but why take away the option from other people who want to do Ms?
WoW was always a casual MMO. Trying to morph into some kind of hardcore e-sport is just silly. MMORPGs were about creating immersive virtual worlds and be able to share that with many other players simultaneously.
Turning the game into Diablo style dungeon grinder pretty is a waste of potential in my opinion.
2 Likes
What story? That ended with wrath, and had a brief moment in legion.
I wish there was an alternative dungeon mode that ramped up difficulty and limited the number of party wipes allowed to increase the dungeon level rather than trying to beat a timer. Wipe too often, no new key.
The only thing I hate about Mythic is the timer. It’s why I’ve never run it. I hate the gogogo meta. And while that will ALWAYS be a part of the game, the timer only makes it that much worse.
2 Likes
Most raiding guilds raid 6 hours per week. I don’t get why raiding is being used as a comparison? Your response is pretty typical of the crowd that defends M+.
1 Like
It was a lazy way to add difficulty. Honestly, the way MMO classes work, it is probably the only way you could have a system like M+. That is why it sucks for MMOs, it kind of limits what classes can do because they need to fit into the M+ meta.
M+ was supposed to be the answer to the “I want good gear but I don’t have time to raid!” complaints.
M+ is intended to be the casual way to gear. It isn’t working how it was supposed to. Hardcore players saw that they can get good and now even better rewards than raiding through what was supposed to be a more casual style of play.
The result is that M+ is full of elitists who absolutely trash the casual players it was intended for, which leads to the 48736188 posts you see about casual players again not having an outlet for gear.
M+ is a failed experiment. It is no longer the means by which casual players can progress without the time commitment of raids; it’s just an easier way for elitists to gear up than raiding, so it’s going to attract toxicity.
“Oh yeah… if we have a system where casual players can gear up without a significant time investment, then hardcore raiders totally won’t take advantage of that!”
That’s seriously what people need to think to justify a system like M+.
It sucks.
5 Likes
I hate all Mythic content. Raids were so much better before they put that garbage into the game. Blizzard remove Mythics and quit building the game for E-Sports. Go back to making the game for the players. Make 25 man and 40 man raids awesome again the way they once were the best content to do. I have always felt these things have done more harm than helped.
4 Likes
This is largely what I am talking about. The game existed for over decade as a casual MMO. I don’t understand why the developers felt a need to try to cater so much of the end game around ultra competitive players? It was probably rooted in the desire to keep players logged into the game more so they could report those precious MAU to investors.
3 Likes
Yeah… like just have the mythic level of raid be the only one available so that its always hard.
Nowadays people are just expected to be able to full clear entire normal versions of raids on the first week they are available.
The meaningful boss kills arent really the same anymore. Its just all so watered down because of theres 4 different difficulty levels, and only the last one is difficult… not to mention you need to wait like 5 months into the content to be able to even do it because for some reason raids are server locked at the mythic level (super dumb).
1 Like
exactly. its cheap.
2 Likes
Mythic+ is not Diablo. Speed runs were created by players in WoW even before Paragons were invented in Diablo.
You cant stop people from gearing up. Once they are geared up, people would speed run a dungeon whether you like it or not. Like when I did Classic last year. When we were level 25, we were careful on each group pull in level 30 scarlet monastery cathedral… cc here and there. When we reach level 30 doing the same dungeon, we speed run it. Tank was not stopping even if I have no mana. Was that retail? Nope, that’s on Classic.
Mythic+ higher key difficulty is stopping people from face rolling the dungeon. And that is good.
2 Likes
don’t quote out of context, comes out as trolling
Why compare it to raid? What is else left if they take away M+? PVP? It’s not about how much time is spent per week, it’s how much time is spent per day. Most of my M+ runs are less than the timer.
My guild, on the other hand, spends most of the evening inside the raid. Sure people are allowed to leave, but it’s a bigger dick move to leave from an active raid than it is to leave in between M+ runs. Basically everyone feels obligated to stay for hours inside.
M+ is a lot more time flexible and, in my opinion, a better system as the result.
retail is currently in the middle of a multi expansion story arch atm. you not liking it doesn’t change that. lol
Hard disagree. I wish we would get 2 dungeons per patch added to M+. They should drop that mega dungeon in 8.0.5 and M+ in 8.1
Not necessarily since the reason for the reduction of loot is BECAUSE of M+
1 Like
what changes in raid ? lol atleast in m+ i can meet new people instead of same people i start hating after the 60th mechanical failure
i’d think adrenaline junkies would much prefer PvP rather then M+.
1 Like