This is the grossest thing I’ve ever read.
1 Like
Correct.
Affliction would be the dot spec. Warlocks choose if they want to specialize in dots, pets, or nukes. Which is generally what most people think the talent trees for a Necromancer would do if we ever got one.
We will have to wait to see how balance numbers land and what is viable. But it looks like Unholy will have choice to talent for dots or pets more. But, even full dot talents Unholy wont match Affliction. And full pet talents Unholy wont match Demo. We will have both (plus melee), but at lesser capacity regardless of our focus.
3 Likes
You just described Affliction, Demonology or Destruction (all 3 respectively) in the most accurate way possible.
No sarcasm. That’s pretty funny.
1 Like
My biggest gripe with the rework is why menacing magus still only affects the shadow bolts and not the frost bolts??? Why an aoe talent would only make it work for half the time? And they are casted randomly, ive seen times the magus died without casting a single shadow bolt volley.
1 Like
Yeah if the talent turns it into a volley just make it all the same? Have the magus then convert to a Shadowfrost blot volley.
1 Like
Fair enough ahahahah
1 Like
I mean mostly his campaign in the Eastern Kingdoms before he became the LK
It sounds like you are suggesting he used diseases in his Eastern Kingdom campaign. I am not sure where you are getting that. The EK campaign was in the Warcraft 3 RTS. And…
Warcraft 3 DK abilites:
Deathcoil
Dark Pact
Unholy Aura
Animate Dead
No diseases. Arthas was not even the one spreading the plague of undeath, that was done by cultists.
It sounds like you are suggesting he used diseases in his Eastern Kingdom campaign. I am not sure where you are getting that. The EK campaign was in the Warcraft 3 RTS. And…
Warcraft 3 DK abilites:
Deathcoil
Dark Pact
Unholy Aura
Animate Dead
No diseases. Arthas was not even the one spreading the plague of undeath, that was done by cultists.
What I mean is mostly that Arthas used a lot of defiles. Being literally disease or not, I mean that he is a corruptor. He defiled the land, people, he corrupted everything. Diseases are only a kind of corruption.
Not in his campaign in the Eastern Kingdoms. DKs did not have that ability in the RTS.
First, it is quite the stretch to call defile a disease in any way. Corruption or not.
But, for the sake of argument, let’s lump it in. He still summoned FAR more minions than he cast ‘corrupt spells.’
Even his goal was just to kill everyone and raise them as his servants.
Arthas is was far more about raising undead than any disease/corruption ability.
1 Like
Since this subject keeps coming up
Arthas does not have a spec. Arthas is NOT an Unholy or Frost or Blood DK. An Unholy dk is not closer to Arthas than a Frost DK or vise-versa. Arthas was created long before blizzard even came up with the idea to break DK’s down into Frost, Unholy and Blood.
A great first party example is Heroes of the Storm. Arthas has abilities taken mostly from frost and unholy combined, while having talents themed around blood, frost and unholy. You can build Arthas to be more frost, more unholy or more blood in a specific game, but his kit supports all three. Similar to how Varian Wrynn is a Warrior, and has talents that push him more towards Arms, Fury, or Prot. Varian Wrynn is not a Prot warrior, a Fury warrior or an Arms warrior, Varien Wrynn is simply a Warrior.
Arthas is not an Unholy Death Knight
Arthas is not a Frost Death Knight
Arthas is not a Blood Death Knight
Arthas is just a Death Knight
Not to mention the three abilities we’ve stolen from his ICC boss fight: Defile, Necrotic Plague and Soul Reaper, were all available to all three specs during their first implementations in WoD and MoP.
1 Like
Think of it like Druid vs Monk/Paladin healers, when they say ranged, they blanket in Druids who have 2 ranged 2 melee specs, but because Druid is a Ranged healer who gets ranged mechanics you are blanketed in with Ranged… Monks and Paladins are Melee Healers despite Druids having a whole Hero talent tree that puts them into melee despite STILL being classified as a ranged.
This would be how DKs should be thought of if a ranged unholy int spec existed.
the core premise is that 90% of their rotation can be done at ranged and requires you to go in and use one ability every 8seconds to generate ghouls which you then interact with at any range for the next 8 seconds. That is their only reason to be in melee.
Once every 8seconds is not “key part” and if changed to be ranged, would not impact any other part of the rotation/play style.
Lesser Ghouls are Generated from Festering Strike, this is the ONLY ability that is melee related and is spammable, so 2seconds in melee range generates you 8 ghouls, which you can then use at 30yard range to detonate for the next 15seconds (there is actually abilities that generate them at 30yards aswell)
So by changing your beloved Festering Strike to being a 30yard range you start to create a whole new player base. Do i think it should be str related, no… Str is a physical damage booster, at this point the only “physical” thing you do is Festering strike. Just make it Ranged and make them INT and it would make more sense for the spec in general.
There is talent trees already that directly interact with talents based on your spec. There is a whole bunch more in Midnight, Monks dont get Stagger unless they are brewmaster in which case it replaces the Rising Sun kick Talent and makes it Stagger.
There is nothing stopping turning Runic Attenuation into a non Auto Attack and Ghoul hit or Your new primary plague dot just generates more runic source over X number of seconds.
Currently it is looking like half of the “tools” like Hungering Strike are unused in Raid and successfully keeping up with not being used in M+… Hungering Strike has one Use atm, which i hope they have addressed or are atleast addressing in the future, Fel Scarred Procs. If you pick the Fel Scarred Talent tree the ONLY way to proc it is with Hungering Strike and The Hunt.
With how Hungering Strike is played and interacts with the rest of the rotation, its not a spam on CD ability, it has a roughly 20second CD to its bursty mechanic and the only way you can fix the problem is to make it so Consume and Void Ray Proc it at ranged, which instantly means you need to remove Hungering strike or the hunt (probably the hunt since its always been jank)… only THEN would the melee build be viable to be a stand alone situational Talent set up, Until then everything Ranged does, is just better in all situations and more unique.
Nothing Unholy has today outside of Festering Strike implies it MUST be in Melee. Your “objectively unholy design” is out dated.
And this is the problem, If you create a situation where you are forcing people into being in melee, but have changed every skill to be ranged but 1, whats the point in the changes?
Replacing Festering Strike with a 30yard equivalent would literally not change how the class is played for you, but would create a whole new class for others. You would just have a cast timer which you would quickly see would work in your favor. + you want to be melee with the current 1-2 skill melee situation, just play frost or a Ret Pally, Thematically they done align with anything but edge lord feels, but play basically the same coming midnight (something you havnt tested btw)
And now we get to the quote that made me want to dismantle your entire post.
The Hybrid option for Devourer is basically there for PVP and PVP alone, The jump in mechanic has no real benefit outside of Fel Scarred, and has no actual interaction with the OTHER hero talent that they are creating for this spec.
Yet if you look at classes like, oh, i dunno, Death knight… Riders of the Apocalypse has a clear interaction with the undead and zombie aspect (especially after the Legion order hall raised 4 zombies to be their riders).
While zombies are being lesser in Midnight, and they are literally a mobile Festering pip system, Their importance to the spec is based off their existence…
Army of the dead can be cast at any ranged (abomb and gargoyle are your choice nodes and require 40yard range and a target) the ghouls themself have a leap mechanic at 30yards. Meaning your major CD for the class has no actual Range requirement past 30-35yards minimum.
There is no doubt that you could make any class be 40yards, its just how the game is built… BUT with saying that no class outside of Paladin Ret is currently as close to being a ranged when its currently melee, or Melee when its currently ranged as the Unholy is.
Paladin has two abilities that require it to be in ranged, Crusader Strike/Crusading Strikes, and Divine storm… Divine storm throws its self forward atm, which is great but thematically would just be you throwing hammers at people, which would become the entire classes identity…
Tweaking small things like “festering strike is now 30yards” would create a situation where there is no reason to be in melee, you have your ghouls doing it for you… It would add to the zoo class aspect that this game currently has only 2 representations of, BM and Demo.
And changing it to Int and using only Staffs would put it into the unique catagory again of, we have all these unique amazing items dropping, but nobody takes them because a crafted item week 2 is better incase you get that Mythic offhand. Staves themself are useless in 99% of the content if you want to min max, and by having them on the loot table it is just letting people be annoyed something better didnt drop… Yes the item will always be rolled on, yes, it shouldnt be a staff it should be a scythe and be Unholy/Dev DH/Affliction Warlock only, and yes it should be int only. But there is a small situation where you have basically none of the items in the game that look like scythes are considered a staff, they are all pole arms (remix addresses this and makes scythes staves with the purchase via bronze)
Do you think Loot people are not excited for but have amazing looking models for should exist and not be enjoyed. or do you think 1handed/offhand should be how we should be going forward?
There is a clear solution to this and thats making it so Weapon Embelishments are not Weapon restricted any more. It would add more value to 2handed weapons if you could have those embelishments on Rings instead. But by doing that, it lowers the value of a crafted weapon greatly, For int users its strictly their main source of Int on their gear, For Agi/Str, not so much.
red Mage is a caster… its Dive and finisher combo is a source of its damage, but its not the only source of its damage… Devourer DH currently has a Hero talent and small aoe aspect attached to its dive with a stipulation to cause said damage, its not a constant thing, its not long enough in the rotation CD wise like Red Mage is to have any major impact and is only there to use the nuke ability and then jump back out…
If you use Hungering Strike and Fel Scarred, you will be aiming to use Hungering Strike and the Hunt on CD as often as possible, which neglects other things like Void Ray and Annilation bomb what ever its called. Those are your two biggest damage dealers, but Fel Scarred in its current implication would imply that the only way you are going to be doing high damage is if you directly hit the target with those two abilities. Its always been the strength of Fel Scarred over Aldrachi. On CD all the time, Fast game play vs specific rotation causes damage.
Red mage would never have such a priority list just a set rotation, But to say that its Melee combo is 'unnecessary" is the largest misinformation in this post to date.
It is the largest non CD damage you can do as a red mage lol.
Festering Strike comparing it to Red Mage and saying that melee is just an absolute joke to me lol
Except, there is only 1 skill keeping it in melee, so by removing said skills range from melee to ranged would create a situation where the entire spec is ranged based… Would it not?
You do know they changed every other ability right? Just Festering Strike being melee is keeping you in melee, making it ranged would make it ranged. How hard is it to see that lol
Define what a necromancer would be in your eyes… Try to keep it on point.
Because the way i see it is Controller of Death, Undead minions, Plagues, Pestilence spreading. Summoning the 4horsemen of the apocolypse level stuff for a hero talent. Its what it would fall into for Lore wise in any game in any catagory, and if you want to include Sanlayn hero talents. thats just a Blood Necro, something blizzard has had in its other franchises for almost 20years now.
In the current Creation yes, in a world where Ranged mechanics are strictly a thing, there is never a reason to be in melee, if 99% of your skills are saying be in melee, you are a melee, if 1 of your skills is saying be in melee and the other 6-8 are ranged options, you are not a melee, you are a hybrid, and that falls into the situation of, why? Whats the point? Why not just double down now, Let the Melee purists cry about their Spec turning into a ranged and then just watch them fold like they did with Survival hunter once it became a better spec then what it use to be.
EVOLUTION!
Yet here you are. Thank you for your bump.
you dont want to bring up old specs if you are not willing to accept Survivals situation and how it has created this whole thesis of Unholy being a ranged spec next expansion.
Demonology was considered a Melee Spec because of Demon Form, all of Demon forms abilities were melee related, it could still cast things like immolate but for what, 6 expansions it could be a Demon form that was in melee, and even in certain situations tanked a boss, in melee, Lich King Council and that one ogre in Gruuls lair for example. Was it a tank, no, why did it do it, Because it was ultra strong and could hold aggro. Armor increases and if i recall, a taunt.
Fast forward to Survival, Survival for 6 expansions was a ranged spec, It had things like Raptor strike which was used early on, Talent trees tried to push them into mid-Melee range but things like Bow Restrictions on range created a situation where abilities like black arrow and Explosive shot required you to be 15yards from the target, once that left in Lich kings later patches (i actually think it was prepatch for cata, feel free to correct me but it doesnt matter) the class became more ranged based, but still kept Raptor strike until Legion when it finally got the push towards Melee it was always destined for. Ranged became a thing of the past and instead your “ranged” skills were a Trap you could throw on the ground, You couldnt even equip a bow any more.
fast forward 4 expansions and it finally started to fall into place mid to late dragon flight with talent trees and tier sets pushing them into Melee heavy gameplay (they were already melee but just stopped rewarding bomb spam) and now you Have Hero talents, which are, Sentinel which has a 0 ranged approach since it spawns in the target from your grenade every 30seconds (not even Grenades CD so you can spam grenades) and one where kill command, a skill that doesnt require you being in melee but your pet spawns other pets. It has come full circle and has ZERO ranged requirements, but it keeps things like Disengage and thrown Traps for CC.
Now take this premise and apply it to Festering Strike… Unholy has been Melee, for what, 8 expansions, it has been in the good and bad boats for multiple expansions each. Some times a pointless spec to play (usually the start of an expansion) and some times being completely broken (abberus) to the point you have to nerf them into the ground. Same with survival in its existence. Making 99% of your abilities have a 30yard range creates a situation where you have to question why are you still in melee outside of Festering Strike if Multiple Classes in the past have had their play styles adjusted, and why is my playstyle being adjusted to have 30yard ranged.
The answer is, they are prepping you for a ranged spec, and those who have witnessed the entirety of wows life cycle can see it coming. Demo isnt a demon any more, Survival isnt a ranged any more, Unholy is being prepped for Ranged.
If you cant see that you are either holding onto Nostalgia or just not interested in ranged, which is fine, but when it happens dont complain.
In history not all Knights were Melee, Most actually specialized in Ranged combat like throwing axes and Cross bows. The term Knight was only a rank not an armor type.
1 Like
That is not true. No raid leader is including Feral or Guardian when they say ranged. When they say ‘range group up at X’ feral is not included.
IF ranged unholy existed than people would call it a ranged. But it doesn’t exist. What something might be in an alternate universe has no relevance.
If your damage tanks as a result it is.
Again, you go with “IF changed.” You do realize that is effectively you acknowledging that Unholy is not ranged, right? If you argument is based on ‘well they could change it,’ then you are acknowledging that it is not the current design.
Again, you are suggesting changing the class. You are acknowledging that it is not the current design.
Also, you would still be missing the damage from auto attacks. AND the procs from the runeforge.
I have not kept up on balance numbers for DH, partially because it is alpha where numbers largely do not reflect anything close to what they will be.
But, for the sake of argument: IF diving into melee does not generate enough dps then people will simply not spec into the hybrid melee talents and will just play it as a mid range. Which is something you CANNOT do with a DK.
Auto attack, Death strike, blinding sleet, Death grip.
All abilities that require or trigger melee range.
Unholy is designed to be melee.
Fun fact: They haven’t changed every skill to be ranged. They moved one popular talent to baseline.
No it isn’t. No idea where you got that idea, but it is not backed up with any evidence.
Those are not comparable. One set of talents are just some choices in the tree and the other is the hero talent tree.
Jumping in with a DH for melee damage is a small change in the rotation. And the spec changes are a small talent difference.
So you are acknowledging that Unholy is currently melee.
That is not all you would need. As has been pointed out, you also have auto attacks that are melee and the DKs current utility is mostly melee.
Not to mention you are showing a distinct lack of understanding of some of the other nuances of melee vs range.
Range classes have to be weak to melee. This is partly because of PvP and partly because of encounter mechanics. So, you would have to reduce Unholy’s mitigation. But that also means you would have to give Unholy a gap opener, rather than a closer. So, death grip would have to be reversed. Death strike would have to be completely changed. You would need some ranged defensives added. Etc., etc.
Despite what you seem to think that ‘just make all the abilities ranged’ wouldn’t work. Lots of other balances would have to be made. It is not as simple as you think.
And why? It doesn’t reflect anything from the class fantasy. It is a drastic change to the spec. And why? There is not point in it.
That is a balance issue, not a call to make a new class or spec. And certainly not a call to delete a spec in order to make a new one (which is essentially what you are asking for).
And let’s be really clear here. Yes, BiS tends to favor 1-hand/off hand. But that doesn’t mean staves are useless. Just like you can’t say any gear piece is useless if it is not the BiS.
Factually not true. As has been stated.
Even if we ignore the utility and defensives, we still have auto attack, which is a fair amount of damage itself AND is a significant source of runeforge procs.
So, you acknowledge it is a melee class. Cool, we done?
1 Like
not at all what i said lol I said Druids get kitty form, Resto Healers use kitty form as a dps and hot sustain method, but they still get ranged mechanics lol. PLZ
Exactly, and in the current universe you live in, 99% of your skills and roughly 1minute of your rotation can be done at 30 yard range, no festering strikes… Your major CD makes it so you dont need to Festering strike because outside of applying the dot, army of the dead and all of its choice nodes summon 4 ghouls (6 with out choice nodes picked) and 1 ghoul every 3seconds for 15seconds… thats 4x spamming explodo-ghoul, weaving Scourging Strikes in between which is 30yard range, and then ramping with death coils on gargoyle or having your Abomb just absolutely wreck things.
Do you know what Festering Strike does?.. it does very low damage, but it summons 3-4 Ghouls, You can have a max of 4 active ghouls at a time. Army of the dead replaces those ghouls with fresh ones, if you Festering Strike DURING army of the dead, you are just replacing the ghouls you have already summoned giving them zero value, instead you should be spamming scourging strike which spreads your plague, and then deals damage and Putrify which detonates ghouls, allowing you to summon more ghouls and not over ride the ones you have.
So no, Being in melee every 8seconds is not a dps increase, it is an ability that could easily be ranged and stop the whole MELEE run in. Its going to feel really bad during raid mechanics that force you to be at a range and you cant generate Festering strikes for 6seconds because you want to keep your ego and melee skills.
Quick Reminder, the equivalent is Ret Pally who can generate Holy Power Charges with Judgement… You cant Generate ghouls with out being in melee at the current time or popping army of the dead, your major CD.
Seem like its working as intended?
Even Warriors get throw weapon LOL
again, the point of this post is to point out that there is 1 ability that is stopping Unholy being ranged, there is no “it has to be ranged pushes glasses up” moments in here, there is how ever a “BUT MY MELEE” screaming going on constantly.
IF YOU CHANGE ONE ABILITY, THE ENTIRE SPEC IS RANGED… There is your statement, now use that statement and try to change it IF Unholy was ranged already… You cant, it has to change 6 abilities… IF IT WAS MELEE IT WOULD HAVE MELEE RANGE lmfao… NO
Again, Suggesting a change to a spec is not “CHANGING A CLASS”… the class is still there, the class is still going to play the same, just at ranged. You assume because i say Make it int and make it ranged you wont be casting the same abilities you currently do… it will be the same class, just having a ranged option for a purely melee class. A thematic Change for a Purely Melee class, and literally a sane change for a purely Melee Class which now has ranged abilities dominating its rotation.
Just think about it for a second, for the point of sanity, Should you be forced into Melee to generate power for your ranged abilities?.. Should mages get a melee ability to generate Arcane charges? Should Warlocks ? No… and the NEW unholy is essentially a caster spec, disguised as a Melee by forcing you to be in Melee for ONE ability.
Would love to see your reasoning why you should be in melee over Ranged outside of “thats how it is”. Its a poor Arguing Point and honestly a joke at this point.
Go on, give a real answer that isnt related to your feelings or nostalgia.
Numbers aside, The numbers are there as a balance thing, BUT Hungering Strikes currently got zero use in pve which could change, but it isnt going to stop the caster heavy DH spec from shining better. Stack haste, spam Consume, Generate more demon souls to stay in meta longer, that .5 of a second animation to dive in to deal damage is nothing compared to a single Reap AoE. You can try to stack damage ontop of Hungering Strike, but then that makes Devourers Annilator Hero talents pointless, since Havoc wont be taking it over Aldrachi in its current form. Yes Metas do shift, and yes they could make Aldrachi absolute garbage, but what they wont do is make aldrachi valid for Tanks, Fel Scarred will always be better, which leaves either Aldrachi with no spec picking it, or annilator with no spec picking it, or both specs pick their related Hero talents.
What i WANT is Fel Scarred and Annilator to be two different play styles, but i dont want them to try to force you into melee with it simply because the Hero talent doesnt interact with anything you dont take in the talent tree while ranged. Its like playing a Frost DK with out picking up Frostwyrm in Midnight, its strictly your major CD and mandatory for all Frost DK playstyles.
Lets break these down and how they would work in a ranged Unholy World so you understand more.
Death Strike being 30 yards is your heal, problem solved.
blinding Sleet is a Utility and CC ability, and there is plenty of reasons to revisit CC on a DK before the unholy changes. Blinding Sleet being 30 yards range or being directly around the target is not at all out of the question.
Death Grip, Ultimate utility, and keeping it how it works now is what would be the best cause simply because it makes you think about your positioning vs just clicking a target and hitting the button, you can run into melee to use it, you can also just stop people running off to pull others when low health, there is so much utility and changes that can be done, Hell you wanna go crazy you can use it as a triple interrupt option on a caster you dislike.
Auto Attack, absolutely nothing says you have to Auto attack outside of Rune Generation, Damage can be baked into spells to counter it. remember, Numbers dont matter in an alpha (your words not mine).
You say it is designed to be melee, says who?
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, its a duck isnt it?
If it casts like a caster, Acts like a caster, its a caster isnt it?
FUN FACT: Scourging Strike and now Putrify is now a ranged ability. Making your primary spender a ranged ability and then adding new ones does not mean that they didnt make it a purely ranged class outside of your one lil festering strike you gotta hit every 8ish seconds in aoe situations.
I want to be very clear on what Festering Strike and what Scourging Strike does so there is no confusion here.
Festering Strike. 2 Runes, Melee Range, Instant. Slash the enemy for (200% attack power) physical damage and corrupt your weapon with blight, causing your next 2-3scourge Strikes to summon a Lesser Ghoul.
Scouring Strike, 1 Rune, 30yard range, An unholy Strike that deals (100% Attack power) Shadow Damage and causing your plagues on the target to Erupt, dealign their damage an additional time at 35% effectivenesss, Spreads virulent Plague on the target to a nearby Enemy.
So not only is it a once every 8second ability, Festering Strike being melee has ZERO reasoning behind actually not being ranged, Its damage can be adjusted (your words not mine since its an alpha), and Festering Strikes only interaction with the actual Game atm is to force you into melee. while EVERY ability is encouraging you to use your abilities at range, there is no benefit in being in Melee outside of hitting that one ability every 6-8seconds (depending on procs)… You can technically go much longer if you are weaving Putrefys inbetween scourging strike. 12-15seconds at that point. So why force people to be in melee at that point?
By Blending in Outbreak and Festering Strike into a single use ability at ranged, you are going to find that you have more time on your hands to do things like mechanics and Positioning.
You yourself said you havnt been keeping up with Alpha, and thats understandable, you are probably grumpy about ranged DK being a thing let alone Ranged DH.
Hungering Strike is a gap closer, Caster DH has no gap closer. Essentially Hungering Strike is a Felblade of War Within that throws you at the target. Except they are making it so when used in a certian order, you do AoE damage.
Diving on targets in melee not only manages Line of Sight issues, but also allows you to use things like Void Nova (their aoe stun) aswell as doing a little bit of damage (more with fel scarred which would be the go to pvp spec since being on them just nukes them)
What i am getting out of this, you are salty that all of your skills are now ranged, and you have zero input on how to fix the problem, When you accept the ranged spec changes that are clearly coming if history repeats, which it has in the past and will again in the future, come back to this conversation and actually complain then, until then the conversation being had in this chat is regarding Ranged Unholy and how close they are to the changes. If you dont like it, you dont have to comment, but when it happens as it is hinting it will, dont be salty because you had nothing constructive to put in outside of “its meleeeeeee, dont take my melee away, it was designed to be a meleee” when its clearly a Hybrid/ranged spec now. Enjoy Ranged DK 
1 Like
Resto druids are ranged.
Think this through just a little bit. When will a resto druid ever use cat form? They don’t heal (which is their role) with cat form. They will only ever use cat form when they cannot or do not need to be actively fulfilling their actual role. Anytime they are fulfilling their role they will be casting, ranged.
If you want to compare that to Unholy. Unholy’s role is melee. The only time they will ever be at range is when they cannot be in melee. In other words, when they are unable to actively fulfill their role.
No it cannot. You are forgetting auto attacks and utility/defensive abilities.
We are not capped at 4 ghouls.
I do, I don’t think you do.
It is more than one ability. Other things like the utility and auto attacks have repeatedly been pointed out to you.
Strawman
Not true. Other changes would be required.
You are showing at massive lack of understanding about how ranged and melee work.
I have. Repeatedly. Stop trying to strawman all the reasons into “nostalgia.”
A LOT of changes would have to be made to the spec to make it work as a ranged spec. Ones that would fundamentally alter it’s playstyle.
And what would the point be? To have a spec forced to use staffs? Just because you want a new ranged caster? There just isn’t justification for overhauling a spec to make it ranged.
It might change with numbers. Whether or not it is used in PvE will all depend on if it has viable numbers. (Which is also true in PvP.)
So change another melee strike to ranged.
So, make another melee ability ranged.
Proves you don’t understand how range vs melee balance works. Ranged classes have to be weak in melee, meaning a ranged Unholy would need a gap opener, not a closer.
Damage, runeforge procs.
So, you want to redesign those as well?
Blizzard.
Class mechanics still require Unholy to be in melee range to be effective.
Encounter mechanics that target melee still target Unholy.
Encounter mechanics that target ranged still do not target Unholy.
Scourge strike has always had a ranged talent, a popular one at that. So the only change was making the talent baseline, something that is done a lot.
Putrefy did not exist, so not a change.
Except that Unholy is meant to be melee. And clearly Blizzard still sees it that way.
Nothing is encouraging you to use them at range.
No, I said I have not been keeping up with Demon Hunter on Alpha.
I can’t be grumpy about something that isn’t happening.
Not remotely. I like having some ranged options. Want to know why? Because as I watch Warriors charge past me to the target, druids and rogues sprint past me, monks roll past me, etc. I don’t feel completely wasted since I can do some damage while running in. Funny how having some ranged damage helps offset the reduced movement. Funny how the other slow melee (ret paly) also has decent ranged abilities.
There is no history to repeat. Unholy is not becoming ranged.
At this point you cannot possibly be that ignorant. It has to be intentionally trying to strawman the argument. I have explained, in detail, why Unholy still requires melee. You trying to strawman it down to ‘not wanting it changed’ is dishonest. And you know it.
1 Like
This is the only one im going to comment on, because you are just repeating the same talking points outside of this one. And honestly its getting rather boring with you specifically. You dont want something because it hurts your feelings, and i aint here to hold your hand through these rough times.
Resto druids in the Wildstalker Hero talent gain a 3% increased Healing for being in cat form. While Treant symbiotic bloom exists, the tier set encourages you to use Wild Stalker as your Hero talent in a raid and M+ scenario.
It is clear you are just trying to be argumentative and have no actual facts to back up your discussions.
1 Like
Well, you apparently did not read them because you kept trying to strawman it.
I can see how you repeating the same idiotic strawman over and over would bore you.
Case in point:
You say that despite very clear facts being presented to you. That you blatantly ignore and repeatedly try to strawman to avoid confronting.
I get that you want a ranged caster necromancer. Maybe that desire has blinded you. Or maybe it is simpler, you had an idea you didn’t think through and your pride wont let you back down. Regardless, repeating the same idiotic strawman wont change the facts disproving your claim.
Guess what 3% couldn’t do. Replace actual healing casts. Cat form options for druids are there for when there are pauses, moments that they do not need to be casting heals.
It is part of a unique to druids fantasy Blizzard tries to give of shifting around forms as needed. Druids have always had this ‘off role’ utility option. There was a time there was even a row of talents specifically for druids to pick an off-role function.
But it is never a replacement for their actual role. And, as has always been the case, any druid doing an off role is just adding an extra utility to the group. This has always been true when a non-resto off heals, or a non-guardian pops bear form to tank, or when a resto goes cat or moonkin. They stop doing their primary role for a short period to fill another. But their primary role does not change.
1 Like
Festering Strike is melee range. The one that applies your wounds.
Yes, you have other ways to apply wounds like the new reworked DND replacement spell and your ghoul has a 30% chance when it uses it’s primary attacking skill. But you need more than 3 wounds on the target in order to deal damage. You still need to use Festering Strike.
very aware, you should read the entire topic first, especially the first post before posting
1 Like