Fury is awful right now in almost all forms of content. No one should be pretending otherwise. But it’s still a good spec, that generally is pretty fun to play. A 5% buff is not enough, and it doesn’t address really anything within the identity of the spec either. So:
Buff enrage back to 25% haste.
The speed is what makes Fury what it is. There was an absolutely stupid amount of haste on the BfA borrowed power systems. Nerfing enrage on top of all that removal was far too much and it makes the spec much less fun to play.
From a systemic standpoint the gutting of haste also make Bladestorm not be fully covered by the enrage window.
Additionally the enrage window was reduced during the BfA beta to account for the large amount of haste granted by enrage. This would make the spec feel better across the board, help retain it’s identity, and improve the flow of all aspects of the rotation.
Buff Raging Blow Damage by 20-30%.
This is a great candidate to help single target more than AoE. Due to prominence of Rampage and Execute and having to use whirlwind in AoE Raging Blow will always mean less to the AoE profile.
Additionally this will provide a buff to non-venthry fury warriors, which is something that would be good as well.
Yes, the Cruelty talent would be quite good at this point, but Seethe and Frothing are ridiculously weak and boring and need buffs anyway to make that a more exciting talent row.
Buffing Raging Blow also has the side benefit of making Reckless Abandon slightly stronger which it also needs.
I think adding Ignore Pain complicated the spec a bit.
They seemed to nerf bloodthirst because they added ignore pain. But Arms got Ignore pain too (increasing the gap between the two) and Arms can use it without worrying about sacrificing Enrage uptime. Defensive stance also combines with Ignore Pain well.
There needs to be a way to stay enraged while using ignore pain (by perhaps lowering the Rage cost of it). And bloodthirst healing should be buffed a bit. As well as overall Fury damage.
Honestly I like the spec as it is. Enjoyed it in BFA too, probably a bit more I guess so I wouldn’t say no to getting sped back up again. But I just want my damage back so I can go back to griping about being underappreciated in keys.
If they were going to buff a specific ability I’d prefer Rampage personally. I liked big (er) rampages.
How well designed the spec is, right now is honestly one of things blowing my mind the most. Like it’s one of their best success stories. People freaking love it. Why would they not just put the damage where it belongs so one of their few true success stories in design isn’t a complete waste.
I mentioned this in another post, but fixing Fury dps is very simple as its just about changing the talent setup. If onslaught can be taken without sacrificing massacre the spec would be in a way better place. When i ran onslaught to test it ; it actually made the normal downtime of warrior feel not so bad, as it was a fairly consistent sourceo f extra rage that filled a some of makeshift condemn
It’s a fun spec but always felt so weird to me to have all of these abilities that do some damage and generate rage and then have that big rage dump ability do “meh” for damage.
I wouldn’t say no to 25% speed again, but I also feel that (assuming appropriate basic spec aura tuning) a lot could be improved across all specs by having Whirlwind and Revenge follow the old chain-lightning model of AoE, dealing higher ST damage and then increasingly lower damage to each target til their caps. (Revenge would still remain uncapped, but that 5th-target damage dealt to all enemies thereafter.) In this case, I really just mean that as a buff to its 1-3 target damage with the same total damage dealt as before. Arm’s Fervor of Battle and Fury’s Meat Cutter would have to be adjusted accordingly, but we’d see:
WW as a Rage-flushed option even in ST, baseline, for Arms.
A bit greater Fury low-target-count damage.
More reason to actually use Revenge in low-count situations beyond just maintaining Deep Wounds.
Additionally, I do think Ignore Pain actually came at more cost than help to Fury’s PvE kit until Mythic raiding / high keys, and even that could have been solved instead through more… thematic… allowances.
For instance, let’s say we go back to a 25% Haste from Enrage and get back a full value Bloodthirst, or even a 3% that heals for up to 200% more based on missing HP. Enrage at that point would itself be quite the healing buff. I’d have much rather had that and a baseline enlarged HP pool than Ignore Pain. Heck, if needed, give Fury alone a Berserker Rage (Rank 2) that offers it a second charge and causes it to stagger 25% of oncoming damage. It feels like the “unpruning” here was really just an excuse not to flesh out specs as much as they could, and probably should, have.
I don’t want the spec to be fixed through one and only one talent setup. I like having at least a decent illusion of choice via multiple competitive builds.
that makes no sense to me. fixing the talents is literally the BEST way to maximize your options. flat damage increases cement a meta way harder then a rework
And on a side note fury actually already has options that i swapped too all the time, sometimes i run cruelty and sometimes i run frothing. For some fights i want meat cleaver and for some i want dragons roar; some i want bladestorm. Honestly Fury has options but right now the only option they dont have is for the downtime between condemn windows. and onslaught is the perfect fit
Ah, what would we do without the Derez special on any kind of feedback post where he completely ignores any point the OP was trying to make.
Sorry bud, you can’t speak for me. And you ignored most of what I said there. But such is typical.
Since the first gcd of enrage is always the ability that triggers enrage instead of Bladestorm. No…no it isn’t though.
Thanks for the fact check, but it doesn’t change the point. But that is your specialty after all. What specialty is that?
Yes obviously you use ww the exact same in aoe and st and the damage profiles look exactly the same. Like I’m sorry but you are high on crack with this statement here.
I agree that the core idea of spending a rage bar to do meh damage and reapply enrage doesn’t feel very good. I don’t think buffing the damage wouldn’t make sense as it would just make that mechanic more dominant, but this isn’t great.
Also ignore pain should get some kind of fury specific buff. The cost of forgoing enrage to do it is extreme and feels clunky. It’s still definitely worth pressing for fury but the spec would be better if the cost/benefit of ignore pain were more like arms.
Especially in PvP, Fury having an effectively much worse ignore pain on top of no D stance leaves it far squishier than Arms. Which might be OK if Fury had some other special strength to compensate, but it doesn’t. Arms is obviously too strong in PvP right now and will get some kind of nerf, but whatever that nerf is Fury will still end up behind in every relevant PvP category.
I can speak to how it affects the specs design. Which affects feel. You also failed to answer.
No, I did not. I do not ignore portions of the post, I do not cherry pick, I respond point to point, to eliminate confusion or miscommunication. I’m trying to help people like you keep up.
Yes, it is. BS’s duration is reduced by a proportionate amount to your haste. So even at 0 haste, it will finish fully before enrage runs out of time.
It changes the entire point, what the hell are you talking about.
When your entire point is based on incorrect information, correcting that information immediately changes the point. Otherwise you’re simply denying or ignoring reality.
…what?
Tell me how the priority changes from st to aoe in any way, with the exception of more frequent ww casts.
I agree with 25% haste back on Enrage. That would be nice.
It would also be nice to have like 3 charges on Raging Blow. Maybe we wouldn’t need the damage increase, that way.
I also suggested, instead, in another topic Slam could be made to deal more damage than Whirlwind and about 5 to 6 rage, maybe even work as Furious Slash did before and increase the next Bloodthirst’s proc chance by 15% per stack. Another layer to the spec, and a single button wouldn’t cause too much bloating, in my humble opinion.
I’d like to see some Fury damage-dealing abilities off GCD. Higher average APM for the spec. That would also buff the damage profile without tuning numbers (and adds for some scary burst, depending on what gets taken off…).
That’s honestly the appeal for me. Relatively speaking, I prefer a low APM profile for Arms and a high APM profile for Fury. I think talents should serve to balance toward a mean, but as a general assumption that this is the identity differentiation for the two.
That depends on how you “fix” them. If your solution is to just make it so Onslaught is now OP by not competing with, say, synergetic talents, you’ve decreased choice.
Flat damage increases, assuming you mean a percentile aura buff and not an actual flat damage (%AP) increase to each skill, has a purely neutral effect. It doesn’t cause existing builds to dominate any more or less than they did. They don’t “cement” anything. They leave all exactly as it was.