I don’t read garbage.
Well sorry you are salty but at least you know now that Community Managers are not game developers. Have a good one!
Community Managers are like Yes men. They will ignore feedback and just say 'well it isn’t a problem for me" instead of acknowledging feedback and passing it along. Either way, nothing changes.
I’m salty? yeah I am actually. I don’t like seeing a game I played for 15 years rot and die because of these people.
Call me, Mr Salty, the person who has long since had enough. ![:wink:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/wink.png?v=6" ":wink:")
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Why shouldn’t i blame them when they come in the group and screw everything over? Why is it all of the sudden not their fault if they make everyone else leave my mythic key because they screwed the timer over? why do you feel like you need to defend this system? is it because you like getting gear handed to you for simple world quests and warfonts which you can COMPLETELY AFK? i dont see why you even replied because what you said makes no sense. And yea people joined who didn’t know the fights back then too but it happened way less because it was easier to know based on ilvl alone if they did or didn’t do the content. and yea it is relatively new because they didn’t hand out LOADS of Raid quality Welfare epics till LAST expac. Atleast with badges you had to go and do content. Now you can just sit here till blizzard gears your toon for you instead of actually raiding or doing dungeons. Take your main for example deacked out in normal quality raid azerite gear from warfronts/wq’s i see now why you’d have an issue if all these easy ways to gear left the game because then you wouldn’t be able to do anything lmao.
No they’re not. Bornakk, for example, just offered his personal experience. And all of his posts were effectively neutral. “I like the feeling when I get a good Titanforge.” He said nothing on Blizzard’s behalf.
Plus, if you actually read them, you can very clearly see he’s asking A LOT of questions related to collecting feedback.
You make no sense.
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I’d prefer they delete all stats on gear than having to play with titanforged. Make it everything just tmog, it’s not like anybody cares anymore about gear with titanforged.
That’s why people use things like raider.io , that pvpers use ratings and that raiders use logs to compare themselves.
This game is now mainly about cosmetics, mounts, pets, achievements, etc.
I don’t think they’ll remove titanforge so I won’t care about it, it just remove all my interest toward gear.
I feel like Bornakk is the only one who likes WF/TF who is actually reading the posts and trying to understand the viewpoint of the opposing side in this entire thread tbh. Even if I don’t agree with him, I at least appreciate that he didn’t attempt to distill every argument down to “meanie neckbeard elitists want to look down on me”.
I’ve had private conversations (in person) with him on this topic. The guy is genuine in that regard. So long as both sides understand that WF/TF has good and bad aspects to it, it feels like a productive discussion.
Nothing is wrong with people who like TF. I feel like there can be a compromise where you can still feel excited about loot without ruining gear progression.
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The feedback has been coming in since Warforging was first implemented many years ago. Don’t pretend they care.
Right. I’ve sworn off LFR for several expansions now because the casual raider is just so irritating to play with.
But I’m not playing the game as much as I could, and it does hurt the raid. My damage could be higher. My item level could be higher. Thankfully, I’m not in a guild that’s going to kick me for it, but I could be doing more.
And that sucks. Organized group content — even if it’s M+ — should always cap out at a higher item level than pig or solo content.
How about all that feedback in Beta about Azerite Armor being completely dismissed and ignored?
Anyways, I agree OP. I think it Titanforging and Warforging should be entirely removed from the game. But it won’t be, as Ion in the Q&As always says, despite the players not liking the system, the developers like it because it makes it smoother for them, so, it won’t ever change.
A feature the playerbase did like, Reforging stats, was a nightmare for blizzard to keep up developing. Even though the players didn’t want it gone, for the developers, it was easier to remove so it wasn’t difficult for them.
Many examples of WoWs development since Ghostcrawler stepped down is “how the developers” want the game to be, instead of the players.
I feel like there’s too much to do in this game right now. I have 1 120. I have I think another 5 110s. But in the past, no, I’ve never felt like there was “nothing to do.” I have felt that I was temporarily “done” on a character.
That’s when I would roll an alt.
Goes hand in hand with people asking for “reasons to log on everyday” or “reasons to keep doing WQ or dailies”.
A lot of people don’t like being done.
Even mythic+ in sense was to address people who didn’t like leaving dungeons behind and wanted a reason to do them all expansion. Along with alternate (and significantly too lucrative) gearing.
I just think people don’t give enough attention to the arguement against WF/TF that is essentially it’s a great system but it’s run a little too wild. Without limitations, it’s having a sprawling negative effect on a lot of aspects of the game.
The thing I hate the most about WF/TF has nothing to do with earning it or not but rather it diminishes the longevity of contents life pretty substantially.
We’re only 3 weeks into the Mythic raid tier and already my guild is pushing toward an average ilvl of 410. This has a cascading effect on multiple fronts -
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It condenses the “season” to a few weeks as not many people will fully pursuit content in the hopes of upgrading to their “ancient legendary” versions of their BIS. If you get a 415 or higher of a slot, the majority of people won’t put active effort into upgrading that slot further like they would if it were still only 400.
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Raid encounters and M+ dungeons have no gradient - all bosses are either a joke (See BoD) or they are too hard. Gear changes the difficulty of a fight radically. Since we spend virtually no time at sub-optimal ilvls, we don’t experience difficulty from encounters that are mitigated by gear upgrades. M+ keys under lvl X aren’t worth the time either, especially when higher keys are more lucrative.
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Content Droughts - We finished Uldir and continued to farm so we could be prepared for the next raid. Little did we know that the catch up mechanics would wholly invalidate that effort with WF/TF paired with them. We had no more prepared than someone who killed Mythic G’huun and then logged off until the day Normal BOD opened. This creates an “end of expac” content drought at the end of every tier and now with Azerite not playing any role whatsoever in the next patch, there will truly be no reason whatsoever outside of farming Jaina for her mount. This is ravaging the mythic raiding community, who can only function off a stable and social roster of members.
Everyone gets entangled in the entitlement side of the argument. I think WF/TF is a great system. There just needs to be limitations. Sockets and 20+ TFs need to be reigned in. The meme “Why do mythics?” is becoming a real thing and it’s tragic.
I think, in the very least, WF should be the only proc you can get until the Mythic instances go X-realm and TF should be introduced at that time as a catch up mechanic and something to keep the mythic raiders playing who have cleared the content.
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It never has and it never will! Why you may ask? Because the only thing that will ever equal experience is ( pause for dramatic effect ) experience! That’s it, and nothing will ever change that.
It’s just like when I played pick up games of hoops in the park when I was younger. If you didn’t bring enough players with you to cover a 5 man squad you had to pick from those waiting to play. And if you never saw them play before, you didn’t know if they even knew how to play. If they were good, bad, played hard, had skills, you knew nothing. And losing means you could be waiting to play again for hours. But that’s how pugs work! So you can bring enough to cover a 5 man or pug it out. And with random people you will always get random results.
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With the way the game is designed anymore its not hard to compare yourself to other and how you stack up. Raiderio, Wowprogress, there a plenty of sites that give you an idea of how you play this game versus everyone else, let alone achievements and such. Its to very difficult to compare yourself to your piers.
It is not possible and never will be.
I think the amount of joy I get from finally getting a TF/WF piece is very seldom a thing I get to experience in this game. 90% of the time its mostly disappointment, 5% of the time it is followed with having to sim my gear to see if it is any actual upgrade and when its not I feel like I wasted my one luck shot on a piece of gear I won’t use. The final 5% of the time sure you can use the word joy, but it just feels empty because I really don’t feel like I earned the item I got it just luck.
When you say you don’t think much of the other person’s gear its pretty hard not to when in a competitive raiding guild or pvp situation. The minor edge it gives to not so competitive players I don’t think is that large, but when everyone around you is having 415+ items, and they get lucky on 2-3 pieces in very valued slots like trinkets, it doesn’t feel good specially since you’ve been doing the same progression as them, yet you don’t receive the same reward or have the chance to receive the same reward based outside of luck. That is the part that upsets me, a part of this game that was something you could quantify and depend on no longer is there, and it bums me out more and more.
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I agree here. Sockets are far too rng, and jewelcrafters need sockets on gear in order to have their profession be useful. They should bring back guarenteed sockets on some items. Remove it from the rng list entirely. This will mean a more stable position for jewelcrafters for a start.
Also limit warforging and titanforging… warforging can remain at 5 ilevels and have titanforging at 10 ilevels. That way they are both still an upgrade but they don’t invalidate getting gear from the next level of difficulty. I mean I’ve had stupidly titanforged items before now from normal… which invalidates any gear for that slot from heroic and mythic levels of raiding. That should never be the case. You should never be overgeared from a lower level of difficulty.
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