Come on, it’s 2024.
We chew Swiftthistle pouches now.
Tea is for those drunk bears.
Maybe we should change the name?
Swiftthistle Snacks
It even evokes the level 15 herb by name.
(This post paid for by Zyn.)
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The DF “rework” didn’t address the main reason why Assassination got nerfed the second a raid tier released (or 2nd week at worst), which is it’s idiotic damage profile which makes it a great target for PI and other such abilities causing Assa to bloat out in dps.
This, for most specs that suffer from this, was mostly ironed out already, the big d burst windows either aren’t that crazy or the profile is flattened.
It also didn’t address the horrid energy economy Assassination has or numerous other silly issues. It tried to address that you cannot AoE without restealthing somehow, but failed at that too.
You can do respectable aoe dps but without Indiscriminate Carnage you have to try and plop garrotes on targets manually. With a cooldown. While losing energy and dps.
Without IC you will NEVER be able to fuel the aoe because your energy regen cannot keep up, ever.
The rework overall didn’t fix anything. The entire class is still years behind and there’s little hope it’ll change anytime soon.
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For Assassination the energy budget is tight because Blizzard’s response to “Assassination needs to do damage” is buffing Envenom with various effects out the ahole, with it completely dominating your damage sources.
I am well aware that if they uncorked energy and made it an actually pleasant to use resource 3mil+ Envenoms will be gone.
But it beats doing nothing half the time.
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True. Envenoms hit really right now especially if timed with Thistle and Shiv. My Eviscerates on my Sub wish they were hitting as hard.
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Guess I’m having fun wrong.
¯_(ツ)_/¯
I don’t think you’re having fun wrong. I too main Assassination Rogue for dps. I too like applying poisons and bleeds. To some degree you the spec is gonna be “slow” given such a focus. I don’t think we need crazy energy or APM. But having some other energy regen won’t make us bad or ruin that gameplay. I think a refund on Finishers such as Relentless is pretty peak for this.
You still need the initial energy to spend but you get some back allowing you to back into building. It prevents you from getting into a low energy rut that requires you sit idle. It won’t be enough to to ensure you’re always topped off or that you have enough for a burst window energy dump. You’d still have to manage yourself to be ready for those windows. And Tea would probably still be a good pick because it could get you topped off for a big window.
Honesty I think Assassination spec is near perfect otherwise.
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auto attack damage and talents about it must go. its 2024. we are spamming skills every second more than 10 years. after years they return with white damage …
its maybe acceptable in pve. but there is no reason of white damage in pvp while every class have mobility and slows and bursting tons of damage in seconds.
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Marked for Death was removed because it was deemed as too many CP generations for Rogues now compared to past.
But if we look at it honestly that isn’t true for all the specs. Sub always was capable of fast CP generation. Even extreme versions of it like Honor Among Thieves builds.
Outlaw is feast or famine based on RNG though. Dreadblades is no longer part of the spec so Outlaw and Assassination lack consistent fast combo point generation.
So what is the excuse to throttle energy, low builder and finisher damage for most specs?
Why is auto attack damage so high?
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this is horrifying, as are the rest of your findings. thank you for testing.
for a bleed spec, having auto attacks and by extension uptime on target accounting for 27% of total damage is pure insanity
i get the crowd that says uptime on target is an expression of skill, and that it’s a source of min maxing, but that would also be true if this “passive” damage was around 15% for uptime specs like sub and outlaw, and around 10% for dot heavy specs like assa
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It’s worth noting a lot of the damage in that 27% comes from sources like Deadly and Amp poison, Mutilated Flesh, Flensing Knives, Hunt them Down, Deadly poison DoT.
The reason I counted them in that calculation is because they are not inherent to builders or spenders. My calculations for the other classes used the same criteria. So I took all the damage sources that were fiddly add-ons to things and rolled them in.
What this kind of shows is that Rogues have a lot of fiddly little damage sources that they themselves might not even be aware of?
For instance how many of you are aware of Flensing Knives? Does that ability sound familiar? Because I had no idea what it was until I looked at my damage meter and saw it accounting for around 5% (nearly equal to melee attacks) of my damage on a 5 min fight. Turns out it’s an ability that causes Mutilate to deal bonus Plague damage while Slice and Dice is active.
I suspect it is a Deathstalker passive but I can’t be sure because it’s not listed in my spellbook ANYWHERE. It’s not even on my Mutilate or SnD tool tip. And it’s nowhere in the Deathstalker hero talent tree.
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white damage is vanilla thing. every xpac they are trying to bring it back harder.
next xpac make 10 seconds cooldown to evis 3 seconds cd to backstab so we do only auto attack.
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I’m not sure why Blizzard can’t just simply make it a choice node. One where it auto applies at 30% energy, and one where it… doesn’t?
There should be no debate rather or not Thistle Tea should be automated. It’s a simple fix. Choice node…
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Flensing Knives was supposed to be removed, but it’s currently bugged and you get access to it when you pick the Ethereal Cloak choice node.
Mutilated Flesh is the name for the 20% Bleed damage the Doomblade talent gives your Mutilate.
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Flensing Knives being a bug is concerning given how much damage it accounts for.
I was aware of Mutilated Flesh being from Doomblade talent.
Thanks for the info because I couldn’t find anything on Flensing knives.
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Id rather have it deleted outrightly
“Hey rogues your 3 capstones are gonna be some resource gen, the shadowlands talent you hated most and mf Shadow Dance (we are taking that one away 2 years from now)” -Blizz 10.0 beta
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which is fine with me if blade flurry is a toggle instead of degenerately hinging every aspect of outlaw to restless blades
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I don’t like this change, at all… why can’t rogues control this themselves? My Pally is never ever out of mana, but I feel my rogue always is out of energy. I would prefer controlling when I activate thistle tea!
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here is my view on it. thistle tea change is trash for M+ because when you are coming up to a boss and have 0 charges because you used em automatically on trash leading up your dps will starve on the boss. even with 3 charges on my sin rogue after about 2-3 min into a boss fight my dps plummets because of the lack of energy reserve and thistle tea.
main issue is the energy regen is not there.
This.
This is how they intend you to play. Keep energy high enough to get free bleed damage. If you’re spamming it’s because
- Mechanic requirement
- Not pooling energy properly
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Dont understand why some of you act like pooling is this central part of the spec. Its probably for the same reason that you defend Blizzards dumb design decisions. Nothing about Thistle Tea is intuitive and the Sin “pooling” aspect is outdated.
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