Is overly convoluted and unnecessary. We already have valour points. Why over-complicate?
Though i guess it’s only a matter of time until we can purchase a battle pass for only $19.95 that gives you a whole bunch of crests…
32 Likes
It’s really not.
You Get Flightstones from Everything
You get Crests from Everything, the quality of crest depends on difficulty of content.
You want to upgrade your gear? Spend flightstones.
You want to upgrade Heroic quality gear? Spend Flightstones and a Heroic Quality crest.
Valor Didn’t cover gear from World Content, Raid Content, or anything other than Mythic Plus.
So It was an upgrade system that only certain players could / would use.
I love Mythic Plus, It’s the Endgame I do the most of.
What is this Hyperbole. Has WoW Ever sold its players gear for IRL Currency?
14 Likes
I was giving Blizzard the benefit of the doubt back when the system was first announced, but now I am eating my words. Different names for different tiers of upgrade paths, all of which overlap one or more paths in item levels, and this is not only for Season 2 Mythic+ gear but also crafted and possible raid gear? Stick an arrow in my knee, because I don’t want to be an “adventurer” if this is how complicated it is to just obtain gear. The item level inflation problem exploded with Dragonflight and Blizzard shows no sign of containing it…
7 Likes
It’s coming, this new system sets it up perfectly. I mean Diablo Immortal already uses the crest system…
You get free Mythic ilvl gear for failing to time a dungeon - quite a lot of people love it.
Remember when gear just dropped? Remember when you could just buy items, deterministically, with badges? Remember when you didn’t have to continually regrind the same content to upgrade your items 3ilvls at a time?
8 Likes
I sincerely doubt WoW is going to start offering players the ability to pay to skip progression, considering progression is 90% of the way they keep players logging in every week.
This didn’t change. You can still get upgradable Mythic + Gear from going over-time on a Keystone
Gear Does still just drop. I’ve never understood this complaint.
If you want a piece of gear from the raid, you can run the raid until it drops.
But if you wind up getting the Normal raid quality piece, and you really want the Heroic quality version, you can upgrade to it. Though you do have to grind for it.
In what world is that something to complain about? If you wanted to, you could just run the Heroic version of the raid until your desired gear “Just Drops” but now you have the Option to upgrade your normal piece instead.
1 Like
You could, but unfortunately the combination of
a) Very poor drop rate in raids
b) The fact M+ is far easier and awards better gear, including gear for failing to even time a dungeon
means that I’ll, once again, be decked out in higher level M+ gear before getting much if anything from the heroic raid.
3 Likes
because they have to give their artists something to do and make useless junk to fill up our bags seems to be it.
5 Likes
Now This is an argument I can support.
Since the inclusion of Mythic + into the game, gearing from running the current raid tier just isn’t as consistent as Mythic +. I agree with that.
Raid Item Drop rates have always been scuffed in WoW, but one could argue that’s an intentional part of traditional MMO Design. I could see raids possibly bringing back badges or some form of deterministic gearing to make gearing from raids more competitive with Mythic +.
However I am happy now that Mythic + gear and Raid gear are both upgradable now using the same currency.
3 Likes
Crests are not the equivalent of Valor points. They are more akin to the M+ Score breakpoints for being able to upgrade to a certain ilvl. Valor points are replaced by Flightstones–both are a currency in your currency tab of the character sheet.
M+ Score worked like this to limit how high you could upgrade…
| Rating | S1 |
|---|---|
| 600 | 395 |
| 1000 | 398 |
| 1400 | 402 |
| 1700 | 408 |
| 2000 | 411 |
| 2400 | 415 |
How is M+ Score going to be applied to Raid? Crests solve that problem…
| Crest | S2 | Keystone | Raid |
|---|---|---|---|
| Whelpling | 402-411 | 1-5 | LFR |
| Drake | 415-424 | 6-10 | Normal |
| Wyrm | 428-437 | 11-15 | Heroic |
| Aspect | 441 | >15 | Mythic |
3 Likes
I mean Valor could have just dropped from raid bosses and world content has before. Also raids are tiered now so upgrades could have just been handled by raid progress or M+ score.
The thing I personally hate this new upgrade system for is I can no longer get all my tier xmog colors. Old system I use catalyst on 386 boots get LFR appearance then upgrade it to 392 get normal 402 for heroic and 415 for mythic. You can no longer do this because of the dumb caps on gear and the season is not long enough to catalyst every item 4 times.
1 Like
It could have but m+ would still be more efficient and how would you justify being able to upgrade a piece from normal to mythic raid ilvl farming +2 and upgrading in that fashion would have just required running the raid a single time.
I give you that is convoluted, at least initially… Disagree on the “unnecessary” part though, it feels like a major upgrade over Valor that incorporates all the PvE content in the game instead of just the M+ one.
I think what feels complicated is that we just got a new bunch of “keywords” with all the upgrade paths and all the different types of crests and then understanding what’s used to upgrade what… But I think that will settle with time, and I mean it’s a bit early to judge and I’m sure the system will have its pain points but, but I think it’s worth it given all of the benefits that it provides.
In general the TLDR is that you can mostly ignore flightstones (you’ll get enough) and then for Crests just go do the content you like doing and you’ll be getting the right crest to be able to upgrade your gear appropriately. I guess understanding what the “breakpoints” are is also important (like M+16, might be +17 I need to double check).
1 Like
If you think this is convoluted, then yikes.
2 Likes
You’ll just need a single +16 per piece you want to upgrade at its max level, which is 441 (Hero 5/5). I do hope the crests are usable for lower tiered item though, I would hate having to do +11-15 just in order to upgrade my pieces to Hero 4/5, instead of just sticking to +16 or higher. (I say that but thinking back, the m+ probably rewards fragments to slow it down)
Do crests give you a free mythic ilvl raid item for failing to clear the heroic raid for the week?
Until they do, it’ll still not be as easy to gear as M+.
Of course WoW sells gear for IRL money. They just do it in the shadiest most plausibly deniable way. The game systems are tuned to create funnel services so the fanboys can point to degenerate player behavior as the cause. If they didn’t want to sell gear for cash, they would have game systems that encouraged self farming. Most people despise the content loot exclusively comes from. Most end game players have paid slots in their groups because that’s the only way to continue to get loot after reaching personal ilvl goals. It is intentional.
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Currencies are their sorry excuse for content. They bloat us up with this trash every expansion.
2 Likes
You are confusing “timing” a dungeon with “clearing” a dungeon. You get loot for “clearing” a dungeon (end-of-run) or a raid (each boss killed). You get M+ Score for timing a dungeon, which has nothing to do with loot but everything to do with score and whether your personal key is now higher or lower than when you started (if it was your key that was used).
Maybe your issue is with the Great Vault for M+ vs Raid and not end-of-run? You still had to clear the dungeon to qualify for GV +20 vault slot, so still comparable to raid. If you can’t clear a +20 you don’t get +20 GV same as if you don’t kill N bosses in mythic raid you don’t get mythic raid GV slots.
I will agree with you that gearing in raid has some big issues. I hear many guilds still pushing for master-loot, but I’m not sure that would solve the problem. A currency with deterministic gearing would likely be better, especially given how mythic raid lockouts work.
Wow there’s some real tin-foil hat theory!
You can have a makeshift masterloot already if you’re motivated enough. You decide who gets the piece, only that guy rolls need.
I edited your statement to be closer to the situation as I see it.
I think the guild leaders pushing for master-loot don’t want the chance that some player is willing to roll need and /gquit. True master-loot prevented that.
It also discouraged PUGs from joining raids using master-loot. I’m all for giving it to those that want it, as long as the group is 100% from the same guild… add one non-guild member and master-loot is disabled and reverts to Personal Loot. If the last non-guildie leaves group it’s re-enabled.
I also think they should remove Group Loot and restore Personal Loot as it psychologically felt better (I know many say it’s mathematically the same, but I have doubts because its the entire loot table vs a personalized loot table for your spec, and I know it feels bad to me regardless of the probabilities being the same or different). Definitely for LFR they should use Personal Loot like the other queued content for dungeons.
1 Like