I’ve always been reluctant to believe that without a Lich King ‘‘controlling’’ the Undead we would have been overrun in record time.
Is it really that easy for the Scourge to simply overrun us?
I call BS or PIS, but still… Any thoughts?
3 Likes
There must always be a Lich King, because otherwise Sylvanas would have had too many potential Forsaken recruits. Granted, the story of the Forsaken should have involved Sylvanas poaching and freeing recruits from Bolvar rather than raising new ones with Val’kyr.
2 Likes
At this point, the Forsaken would be less of a threat to the planet if they were Scourge.
Sylvanas is more interested in killing and raising people than Bolvar.
12 Likes
LOL.
That reminds me, what difference there is between a Ghoul or Skeleton warrior and a Forsaken? Considering the first 2 lost contrl from the Lich King
Level of intelligence maybe? I don’t really know, but the Forsaken playable race has always only been a portion of the Forsaken community. The Forsaken could easily have included other forms of unplayable undead groups that Sylvanas takes from Bolvar. That would have made for a better even if a less controversial storyline. It still has the potential controversy of Sylvanas and the Forsaken being in direct conflict with the Scourge and thus making the entire Horde a potential target of Bolvar, but that’s more heroic than killing and raising.
4 Likes
I’m still just pissed Bolvar and the Death Knights never did an assault on the Burning Legion how they did the Scarlet Crusade during the DK starting questline that takes place back in Wotlk. It would’ve been a truly epic way to end the Order hall campaign… Acherus suddenly warps over the Tomb of Sargeras with tons of Ziggurats and Frost Wyrms and Darion Mograine screaming how the Legion is going to be destroyed while standing on that dias and the four new Horseman leading legions of ghouls and abominations onto the Broken Shore
2 Likes
This.
I theorize it could be because there are troops he still can’t control. But like, you can spare (if you can call spare) dead to attack the Paladin Order Hall and the Scarlet Crusade, but not the Tomb of Sargeras?
I want to know why when the Lich King was losing power during WC3, the Forsaken broke off and became independent with the LK being unable to reclaim them, but when he was killed, meaning total control was lost, all the undead just waited around for him to take control again.
2 Likes
The Lich King’s power was amplified by the Frozen Throne (I’m talking about the block of Ice from the Nether, not the chair itself, where Bolvar now sits).
Despite this, it was always a prison to the Lich King, and a host body was the only option for escape. I’m assuming there was always going to be a trade-off at some point.
Without the amplification of the Frozen Throne (and he was contending with Ner’zhul, as well as what was left of Arthas’ soul, inside his own head) the Lich King didn’t have the energy to extend his will across oceans anymore (but those on Northrend were fair game). Instead relying on the loyalty of those like Kel’thuzad.
Also worth noting that not all undead are created equal (See: Rotbrain Undead)
Yes they would over run us due to the simple fact that the higher ranking undead would continually resurrect every corpse they could find the scourge was already massive and icecrown was a corpse farm at that point. To kill an undead and prevent it’s resurrection you have to burn the body and that’s a bit of a problem considering few races practice cremation.
There’s more to the scourge than mindless throngs of zombies.
There are some that possess a higher intellect who could possibly exert some control over the lesser undead, and while it wouldn’t be a LK level threat they’d still pose a risk if this overlord led an undead crusade.
The way they described it a mindless swarm of Undead really would be that much of a threat. Frankly I think it sounds ridiculous that the races of Azeroth couldn’t handle a zerg rush of 0 tactic mindless zombies. It’s called fire, or holy magic in this case. Or both.
I believe if they got rid of the army of undead early then there wouldn’t be another future expansion based on the Scourge.
“There most always be a profit”
Also, it’s a good idea to have back up plan if the Legion or the Old Gods take over.
I don’t buy it anymore. With the number of cataclysmic and apocalyptic scenarios we’ve handled by now, I’m sure we could mop up the remaining Scourge, and take out Bolvar. (Plus, the meta reason: we’re the protagonists.)
That, or it could be Calia’s pet project to go around freeing them all in the name of the Light, or something.
Duh. Bolvar was only interested in containing the Scourge, not using them until Legion.
Have you seen the Eastern and Western Plaguelands? Have you read the novels? Arthas, if not stopped and given time could’ve easily wiped out Azeroth.
The lich king narrative is somewhat befuddling. Bolvar’s line “there must always be a lich king” would suggest that there always has been a lich king.
In this sense undeath is a form of punishment where a soul is not free to leave its dead body, and the lich king becomes the Jailor of the damned.
Even when Arthas set out to find the runeblade, there was an implication that frostmourne was a long forgotten artifact.
However, The lich king has only been around 30 or so years in the game, from the time ner’zhul was imprisoned to when Arthas put on the helm of domination.
As such the scourge and the lich king are but a momentary blight, so it stands to reason that after Arthas was defeated, that it would be better to simply purge the remaining undead forces that plagued Azeroth.
Unless there has always been a lich king since the olden days of Azeroth, and the legion removed the previous lich king, so that nerzhul could take his place
2 Likes
Talk about the blast to the past.
Let me let you in on something. Back with ICC was current and the ending to the raid was revealed for everyone, no one thought that “There must always be a Lich King” was mindblowing. It comes off now as it came off back then, a cheap tool for a future repeat of the Scourge plot. Kind of like how Sargeras and Illidan (and the Titans to a lesser degree) were “locked way” to be used again in the future.
3 Likes
What they said back in Wrath is that the Scourge would indeed be too much for Azeroth to hold back if it was let off the leash. They went on to add that for some reason neither of the former Lich Kings ever did but we never found out why. In truth, the only reason we beat the Lich King at all was literal divine intervention by the Light.
The entire of Wrath he basically played us and his own Scourge in one giant survival of the fittest war to select the strongest potential champions for his armies. He literally goes “Yeah that will do, you will work” and one shots the entire raid to raise them back as undead.
Exactly this. This is why I hated the entire premise of how we ended Wrath.
Once we put Bolvar in that seat, he should have started marching them all into giant pits filled with lamp oil. We toss a match and repeat over and over until no more Scourge left. Done deal. No Scourge, Bolvar is free.
Instead he has to be the “Jailer of the Damned” and the Scourge remains intact… because reasons.
“But the Scourge would have spread mindlessly and overrun everyone!”
Then why the heck didnt Arthas just do that? His goal was world-domination. He didnt send Scourge to Orgrimmar and Stormwind to sell freaking vacuums.
Left field theory that would make this not as stupid:
Its a ruse. Arthas realized he was going to lose and played us like fiddles.
Bolvar is no more, Arthas has taken over. Notice how he called us “his” Death Knights in Legion. And his definitely darker tone and no longer seeming to be much of a “jailer” of the Scourge… Either Bolvar is corrupted, or Arthas tricked us and used the Helm to dominate Bolvar’s mind. (and probably laughed when Sylvanas flung herself over the edge…)