I leveled as a mage so I’d sometimes be queued into dungeons while questing. So mostly questing! I only really had to do one zone per expansion to get through it.
20-60 Silverpine, Hillsbrad, Arathi
60-80 Borean Tundra and Icecrown
80-85 Like one zone of Vash’jir
85-90 Half of Jade Forest
90-100 Bonus objectives in Draenor and treasures
100-110 Stormheim and part of Azsuna, plus a Legion invasion
Not bad!
Out of curiousity, what retconning do you believe would be required to make Alliance High Elves playable?
They don’t need a huge population to be a playable race. We know there are Alliance High Elves because we see them all over the game. Even if there are only a thousand left what’s to stop one from being a heroic PC?
If we go by Lore the Blood Elf population should be limited per server instead of being 50% of the Horde. Gameplay and what’s fun always trumps everything else.
Apologies, I meant retconning from more of an OOC standpoint. Going back on their original plan about High Elves being too few to be a playable race.
Just because Blizzard was alright with it for one race doesn’t mean that they have to be alright with it for every race.
But it kind of does.
You can’t hold one race to one standard and every other race to another. There has to be parity. Why should one race be restricted by a rule that other races get to ignore? If there’s a rule regarding racial population and eligibility to be an allied race, then that rule needs to be applied equally.
In a video game setting, where physical representation with figurines is vague and symbolic?
Yes, you can. What the storyteller wants to portray is more important than what we literally interpret in the game.
In an attempt to explain how rules aren’t always across the board, allow me a metaphor. If Timmy gets to go out late with his friends but Jimmy doesn’t, as much as Jimmy says it’s unfair it’s probably because Mom has told us that Jimmy is 8 and Timmy is 16. Even if Jimmy looks older to some, his Mom has told us that he’s 8 and them’s the rules.
I’ve been through this argument several times in this thread and, not to be rude, I don’t feel like explaining it again beyond this.
Well blizzard isn’t our parents. In fact the relationship is the opposite. They should be doing what we want within reason. It can be argued that blizzard deciding they don’t want to listen to the playerbase is one of the issues that game has declined over the years in quality and playerbase.
While in game representation isn’t indicative of actual numbers, you can’t seriously think its ok that a handful of Void Elves is fine for an allied race but thousands of High Elves aren’t.
Your metaphor is also not really applicable to the situation. Holding High Elves to an arbitrary standard no other allied race is held to is emphatically unfair.
In this case, the metaphor would be more like: Timmy gets to go out late with his friends but Jimmy isn’t allowed to go out even though both of them are 16 and well behaved. Mom just decided on a whim that its ok for Timmy but not for Jimmy.
That’s not fair, not logical, and not justifiable. Blizzard may be the parents in the situation but even parents can be wrong.
I’m assuming that Blizzard knows all, and they do. If Blizzard tells us that High Elves are different from Void Elves, I’ll choose to believe them since it’s silly to think they’re just picking on High Elves.
If Mom tells us there’s a reason one son can’t go out late, I believe her.
Even if the reason is provably false?
But they’re not trying to hoodwink you. That’s what’s so odd to me.
In the Void Elf instance, we don’t have explicit confirmation that more can be transformed but there are implications that it could happen, largely because there’s nothing explicit that says we can’t.
High Elves, however, have been painted as a rare and near extinct people in lore and on an OOC level it’s been said that’s why they’re not adding them.
The point is that we’ve had an explicit “no, and here’s why”. There are other playable races that were nearly extinct that have been added, but we never recieved a “no, and here’s why”.
The only thing you can actually prove is that for Void Elves, their initial population isn’t a concern to Blizzard. And for races that were once on the edge of extinction, it wasn’t a concern. For High Elves, the only thing we have is that it’s a concern.
It can’t be false. Whatever blizzard says is canon is canon. They are no strangers to ret-conning. If their present writing contradicts past writing then they’ve thrown out past iterations.
It’s impossible to “prove” Blizzard wrong. How do you prove someone wrong who has control for the direction of the story? Not everyone has to like where they take something. (see Sylvanas/Saurfang/Baine for current shenanigans i don’t agree with but it is infact the story)
If they made High Elves playable tomorrow am i just supposed to say well they are wrong and i refuse to recognize it? That’s completely mad.
I don’t think Blizzard is trying to “hoodwink” me. I believe they latched on to the population thing as an excuse, when the real reasons are likely related to:
a) visual distinction from Blood Elves
b) player population concerns
c) they thought void elves were “cooler” and expected them to placate those asking for High Elves.
But it IS false. And not only that, it’s provably so.
Why? Because we aren’t talking about canon lore. We’re talking about the reasons why one race can’t be an allied race and another can.
Blizzard can’t use the High Elf population numbers as an excuse why they can’t be an allied race and then say its ok for Void Elves to be an allied race even though there’s only like 12 of them and still thousands of High Elves.
That’s proof that population numbers are not a limiting factor to what can or cannot be an allied race. I can’t believe I have to explain that in such detail when it’s quite obvious.
And you or I can very well challenge any decision the devs make. They may not agree and choose to stick to their guns, but they can also change their minds (and have in some cases in the past). As Ion said in the same interview he gave us the “the horde is waiting for you” meme, “Anything is possible”.
Again, its like arguing with God. Whatever they say go’s. You can tell them they are wrong till the cows come home but at the end of the day you still don’t have High Elves. Blizzard so far obviously see its one way and you fellas another. The one thats right is the one who develops the game. Bottom line, and arguing any different is madness.
I mean yeah anything is possible, i could become a billionaire tomorrow who knows?
This is precisely what I’m saying.
It’s irrelevant to point at what other races get because we don’t know what’ll happen tomorrow. For all we know, High Elves will collectively Legion Artifact themselves and Void Elves have a way to transform new ones already. We won’t know until they tell us, but I’m going by what they’ve already told us.
If they add High Elves, they’re going back on things they’ve previously added which isn’t unusual for them, but I still rarely agree with the choice to ret-con.
It isn’t false. They can’t release a statement in that manner and it be false. You can say that it doesn’t make sense, or that you’d like to point out that you think it doesn’t match what’s shown in-game, or that you think it’s unfair because of this or that.
By your ahem ‘logic’, since we Belfs were nearly wiped out as a whole, courtesy of Arthas, we shouldn’t be in this game either: especially in the numbers that we have.
Flips hair
It’s not my logic. It’s what Blizzard has decided.
We’ll just have to agree to disagree then.
Holding one race from allied race access because of a reason that is then ignored for another IS emphatically unfair and it proves that the reason isn’t actually a valid reason and thus false.