The tank problem

Community General Discussion
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To be fair, the moment to moment gameplay of DPS is simply more engaging due to fun rotations and simultaneously less stressful due to less responsability, so even though I got KSM as a tank this season, I can’t really blame them, playing tank kinda burned me out.

It’s just that it feels like, on M+ you have to do everything that DPS has, on top of assuming leadership of the group, therefore having to know routes, which packs to hit and which to avoid, get ready to adapt to any mistakes your team might make etc.

Meanwhile, in Raids, Tanks have barely any mechanics to deal with, leading to some pretty boring gameplay unless it’s specifically a tank fight(which are usually 1 fight per raid, 2 at most) in which case it’s just a target dummy for DPS while tanks do one more mechanic than usual.

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What do you mean by “engaging”. Tanks are engaged just as much with tracking DPS CDs, mechanic timers, our own rotation and defensive maintenance, ect.

Shouldn’t this make it more engaging? or, to you, too engaging?

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Some people enjoy these aspects of tanking and play the role because of it.

I would disagree with any suggestions that would change this because it is why I like tanking.

I do agree that raid tanking is far less interesting.

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Good DPS have to do all of this too

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DPS in dungeon feel like a game : you get to see big numbers pop up all the time and when you make mistake nothing really happens.

Tanking in dungeon feel like a job: you don’t do big damage, you are responsible for everything, and if you make a mistake you die, which mean the group die, which mean the key is over. You also get to hear the constant whining of DPS about how everything in the dungeon didn’t magically fit their cooldown/ specific class requirement EVEN if the only reason you won’t time your +12 is if the tank die. DPS don’t matter.

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167

you can have 1/3 DPS sleeping at the entrance, doing nothing for all the dungeon, and still time ( maybe 2-chest) your +12.

if we’re talking lower keys, KSM-level keys… the tank is pretty much the only role that actually matter. you could have 3 monkeys randomly hitting their keyboard for DPS, if the tank is good you’ll time the dungeon. because DPS just don’t have responsabilities in low key.

this is how little DPS actually have to do.

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Youre missing a key word in there. No one “has” to do anything. But not learning the dungeon, regardless of your role, is what separates good players from the bad

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try that as a tank and see how the key go.

But not learning the dungeon

bro. most DPS in 15s have no clue what half the mobs do and have never opened MDT in their life.

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About as well as none of the DPS using interrupts/stops

Why would you need to open MDT? Youve run the dungeons since level 70 and know where the mobs are

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that’s your average 10s pug. who time keys.

Why would you need to open MDT?

Thanks for the example.

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But you said:

So why moving goal posts to 10s?

Go run a 15 and dont let your DPS use interrupts or stuns. Lemme know how it goes.

Talk about not being flexible or able to learn without something holding your hand lol

You must have a lot of interesting conversations with yourself in that head of yours with how much you contradict yourself.

“ermahgerdz dps don’t have to do anything and you can time a 33 key”
“OMG EVERYONE SYNC UP ON MDT BECAUSE ITS MANDATORY FOR THIS +5!!!”

lol

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pick wathever level you like. the higher you go the more crucial tank is. but the DPS requirement at anything but the absolute bleeding edge are laughable.

Go run a 15 and dont let your DPS use interrupts or stuns. Lemme know how it goes.

feel free to check my RIO. already done.

Talk about not being flexible or able to learn without something holding your hand lol

you don’t even realize MDT give you the full path of roaming mob, their count or allow you to make WA for important cast. Because you are a DPS doing low keys that don’t have to worry about anything. you don’t even know what responsabilities in dungeon are.

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Well, if you imagine engagement as an spectrum, between bored, engaged and stressed, I find tank closer to the latter with a much less interesting rotation to perform, not that this is a bad thing, because as I’ve said, lots of things to keep track of, so the simple rotation is necessary as to not overload the player, but the combination of all the baggage tanks carry in M+ makes it stressful for me, while the lack of an engaging rotation and the many exemptions to mechanics, makes raiding boring to me as well.

So, even though I enjoy tanking in pretty much any other game that gives me the option, even those outside of the MMORPG genre, I don’t find WoW, more specifically retail WoW, tanking to be fun.

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DPS still need to use stops and interrupts otherwise you’re not making it.

You’ve done like two 15s, and i highly doubt that the DPS took interrupts and stuns off their bars.

I’m aware of what it does. But it’s not needed. By the time you get to 10s you know what mobs give what % and abilities they have and what you can pull together and what’s a no no

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nah, you’ll get away with the tank having more interrupt than the rest of the group combined. But what do you know, the highest you’ve done is a 10.

You’ve done like two 15s, and i highly doubt that the DPS took interrupts and stuns off their bars.

  1. and multiple time. and they were done in november or so, before other game out that took my attention away?
    you can doubt all you want, but only one of us did those keys.

I’m aware of what it does. But it’s not needed

it’s not needed for YOU, because you don’t do high keys and you are a DPS who don’t have to worry about anything.

That’s the problem with DPS in low keys, they don’t even know what they don’t know… so they think they have as much on their plate as tank and healers because they are completely clueless about soo much of the dungeon.

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That’s absolutely fine, I am not advocating change, I was just mentioning that I can’t blame the majority of the population for maining DPS, because I imagine it’s the preferred style of moment to moment gameplay for the majority of the playerbase.

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Again you keep moving goal posts. First it’s they don’t have to do anything. Now it’s they just have to have less than the tank. Those internal conversations must be popping off like crazy

I don’t doubt that you did them, I can clearly see they were done. I’m calling BS that they were done under the conditions you claim they can be done in.

Ah this is a “the tank is the only one who has to do anything in a dungeon” post. Got it. Yeah it’s not the DPS helping with interrupts or stops or pushing through so you don’t run out of defensives on every pull. It’s all 100% you. The DPS just:

I’m going to repeat something that you’re missing, and it’s also why you need MDT to hold your hand from leveling in the normal dungeons:

Good players learn and adapt. They don’t have to open MDT every dungeon and look at each mob to see what abilities they do. They already know. They know which ones are priorities, which spells to interrupt and which ones to let go through. They know when to use a defensive and when to save it.

YOU need it because YOU don’t even know the things you don’t know.

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and all of them are valid. you havent been able to refute even one of them.

I don’t doubt that you did them, I can clearly see they were done. I’m calling BS that they were done under the conditions you claim they can be done in.

and again, what would you know? the highest you’ve done is a 10. you are completely clueless when it come to keys.

Ah this is a “the tank is the only one who has to do anything in a dungeon” post

You just figured that one out? I tough that was clear from when we pointed out you can have 1 DPS sleep at the entrance and still time the key.

I’m going to repeat something that you’re missing, and it’s also why you need MDT to hold your hand from leveling in the normal dungeons:

aah yes. using powerful tool is holding your hand… first against multiclasser, now against using tools, and stuck on +10s. Wonder if there’s a link there.

[date=2025-01-24 time=10:42:47 timezone=“America/Toronto”]Good players learn and adapt

which is NOT you. because you cant even get your 10s done at the end of the season when those dungeons can be 4-manned if not 3-manned.

you don’t even know what you don’t know.

YOU need it because YOU don’t even know the things you don’t know.

yet, one of us is doing 15s, the one struggle with 10s.

want to try that one again?

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Hard to refute something that’s constantly moving. Every time i make a point, you add a different stipulation (moving goal posts).

Logs exist lol. And again, none of them match up to what you claim can be done. Weird how that works. Makes BS claim, gets called on claim, tries to revert to level shaming. And still does that improperly lol.

Okay, go 4 man a 15 key and let me know it turns out
Or show me any of the other claims. I wanna see a 15 key timed without a DPS using a single interrupt or stun/stop, and not pressing any defensives. Because you know, that’s not required. Just the tank has to take care of that.

When you have to open it for every dungeon to see what mobs are dangerous and what % they give you even though you’ve run the dungeon a hundred times…yeah.

Having to use a calculator every time for 2+2 is definitely a crutch.

Nailed it! You’re so good!

Yeah, you need a crutch for things you should already know.

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it’s even harder when you cannot refute any of it. because you are wrong.

you add a different stipulation (moving goal posts).

that would make it even easier for you to refute it, if you had an actual leg to stand on.

Logs exist lol. And again, none of them match up to what you claim can be done

oh really? go ahead, link some. I really want to see the guy who can’t use MDT start to dig through M+ logs. I’m sure you’ll have a really good idea of what’s happening in runs that aren’t yours ( because you are stuck at 9s/10s) on logs.

Okay, go 4 man a 15 key and let me know it turns out

what do you think the extra 14/15s were for? I’m selling carries. Get on the collective discord and my Btag is there under the legendary rank.

Or show me any of the other claims. I wanna see a 15 key timed without a DPS using a single interrupt or stun/stop, and not pressing any defensives. Because you know, that’s not required. Just the tank has to take care of that.

Feel free to go do 15s, you’ll see how little it take from the DPS… or actually you won’t, because you have no idea what’s going on in a dungeon.

When you have to open it for every dungeon to see what mobs are dangerous and what % they give you even though you’ve run the dungeon a hundred times…yeah.

You know, I tried to be gentle about it.

but when you are a scrub who can’t do easy content at the end of a season, you should listen to people who are better than you.

there’s a reason why every high-end player is filled to the brim with add-ons and WA, while the scrub struggling to do 10s are on a crusade against any 3rd party tool, thinking they don’t need anything because it doesn’t do anything useful…

Nailed it! You’re so good!

I know!

Yeah, you need a crutch for things you should already know.

boy, you do enjoy being stuck in the bronze league, huh?