The State of Dungeons - Bring Back Badges and Difficulty

[Varsnax-emerald-dream]

The state of Texas.

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Yellöwböze-trollbane

but the idea that BC dungeons were really tough is kind of weak. Everyone said the same thing about classic dungeons, but have you been on classic? Every dungeon run is just “AOE it down”.

TBC dungeons were already AoE it down back in TBC. Everyone who ran with a Prot Paladin knows this.

[Thequixote-staghelm (Thequixote)]

@Thasar-proudmoore

CC required instead of mind-numbing AOE pulls with people hitting their faces against the keyboard and making the healer’s life miserable if they can’t heal a tank not using proper mitigation against 15 mobs hitting them at once and DPS that don’t know what a dispell or interrupt is

They moved away from this because of what a serious PITA it was to form groups.

Instead of just waiting to find a tank and/or healer you had to find specific CC abilities. Which meant there weren’t a lot of spots for DPS without hard 30 second CC.

I miss those times too, but they weren’t perfect.

[Raiimir-stormrage]

@Hokonoso-illidan

What the OP wants is tough puggable content with a system where pugs can still get good gear without haveing to “get guud” as the saying goes.

Can’t get gear if you can’t get gud.

[Zeraph-hellscream]

Eh, we tried that in cata. Everyone hated it.

My personal take, slightly increase the difficulty of heroics and then have “h+” dungeons.

Oh, and remove the timer from m+ dungeons.

If a group wants to spend 6 hours in one waiting for bloodlust on every pull, just let them. If you complete the dungeon you scale up the key. Simple as that.

[Aresnoth-area-52]

Blizzard should honestly just do opposite of what forum people say… Always the vocal minority that is active on Forums. Mythic + is a great compromise. And overall is a massive success, that paired with the new “weekly chest” system in shadowlands lends itself to a good experience.

[Orctang-area-52 (Orctang)]

@Thasar-proudmoore

M+ feels bad. Regardless what anyone else says.

No, it doesn’t feel bad.

@Thasar-proudmoore

The GOGOGO aspect of it and the toxicity it creates completely destroys what an MMORPG should be about.

This existed before M+ did.

[Rogmarr-kelthuzad]

This is what seem to remember too. Certain classes had a really hard time joining pugs do to their lack of CC. I actually went tank in Cata because no one wanted DK dps at the time

[Imbillymayz-thrall]

They have those dungeons today and they are called M+. When you don’t outgear it, a couple of wipes can be enough to fail the key easily even on low keys.

[George-blood-furnace]

So make heroic dungeons more like mythic dungeons.

Make heroic dungeons as difficult as mythic +10. Give 1 piece of loot for the entire group but keep the ilvl at 78 as it is now. Why exactly would people run these?

[Elisiana-emerald-dream]

@Zarikas-ysera

hard CC as a ghetto interrupt

Lol, I do that with Repentance. Thank you for the chuckle. I’ll never see it the same way again.

[Gabitha-nagrand (Gabitha)]

@Thasar-proudmoore

I do not think that is why people disliked cata, but we can agree to disagree.

It was freely discussed and complained about on the forums that normal and heroic was to difficult for the average player. And people left because of it. They toned it down and later few xpac later they created the whole mythic dungeons with the mindset that not only could they be made more difficult but groups was formed manually, thus bringing back the feel of pre-wrath dungeons in mythic. And leaving Heroic and lower to being auto queue dungeons and toned down mechanics that everyone could easly pass through if you had enough gear to face roll everything.

[George-blood-furnace]

@Failadin-arathor

They shouldn’t have cratered then. It was a misdiagnosis of why people were leaving, but the bads we’re the loudest. M+ is a good solve all things considered.

The idea that if they stick to their guns on bad decisions that loads of people are leaving over the issue will fix itself is what is bringing us full circle. Shadowlands will be the expansion where every bad idea that failed in the past will be tried again.

[Lyeffion-uther (Lyeffion)]

@Sooterdey-kelthuzad

Cata is when I first started healing. My experience contradicts your experience heavily. Sorry to be the person who says it, but in the vacuum we are in are you sure there wasn’t some aspect to yourself causing the kicks?

Dont get me wrong, I’m not saying no one was ever kicked, but it was no worse than wrath in my own experience. The worst aspect I personally remember was folks not CCing, resulting in more frequent mana breaks.

To each their own I suppose, but I didn’t have any worse issues with toxicity than was in Wrath. I’d say overall the game has ‘calmed down’ a lot in toxicity outside trade chats. Toxcity seems more tied to the times and gamming community in general than expansion in my view.

This is a circular argument, somewhat, when applied to the OP of this post. I see people claiming toxicity in M+ content these days, and I rarely see it. The only time I’ve experienced toxicity in M+ content has been in low keys at the end of the xpacs, when some people are wanting speed runs and get in groups with others who are trying to gear alts. Back when the content is fresh and everyone is struggling with gear level, I can’t remember the last time I encountered toxicity.

But that wasn’t my experience in Cata. Healers got murdered in Cata. I saw it as DPS and as a healer, too. A lot of people who could have developed into good healers left the role back then because no one was expecting a struggle and yet they got one. So they had to take out their frustration somewhere and they took it out on the healers usually. Bastion of Twilight on heroic difficulty was some of my worst times in the game and I wasn’t even the healer most of the time.

The problem with threads like this are that each are nothing more than anecdotal to the person making them, and then I have to wonder how much of the toxicity is caused by the poster himself/herself.

[Nippyss-barthilas (Nippyss)]

I can still remember cata pretty well but I have no idea why people thought the dungeons were so hard

I’m drawing blank on that xpac being rough as far as dungeons going

I think the only thing people are only removing it’s getting blown up by that dude in stone core or what ever; the rest of it was pretty bleh

Considering we just came from wrath where everyone said it was too easy on dungeons yet the Loken killed more players than any monster ever until later on in the games life span

[Humaniter-area-52]

@Humaniter-area-52

Just another thread where LFr heroes complain about the game being too easy.

These threads tilt tf out of me. How do you people have the audacity to call the game easy when you haven’t even played it.

15s ( before pre patch ) were the standard. 15s were the heroic difficulty of old. If you weren’t timing 25s consistently then sit tf down.

Go kill Mythic nzoth

Go time 30s right now

Get gladiator when New pvp season starts.

Go do the freaking content before you call the game easy.

JFC

this tbh x10

[Tactics-illidan]

@Aresnoth-area-52

Blizzard should honestly just do opposite of what forum people say… Always the vocal minority that is active on Forums. Mythic + is a great compromise. And overall is a massive success, that paired with the new “weekly chest” system in shadowlands lends itself to a good experience.

Yeah, I really don’t know what people are complaining about. I got two different DPS toons to 475+ ilvl without having any friends who play the game, and without ever stepping foot into a mythic raid. M+ is great for people(like me) who don’t have the time to devote 3-4 hours a night 2-3 days a week to raid.

You can literally log on for an hour once a week, do a 15, and get your 475 gear if that’s all you have time for. Pefecto, IMO.

[Daark-cenarius]

@Thasar-proudmoore

Imagine they had left heroics difficult. Where CC, interrupts, and dispels were required to do all of them. I bet we would have a higher baseline quality of player at this very moment. Instead of key board licking AOE spammers.

Is this real? Have you attempted anything higher than a 10 key?

@Humaniter-area-52

this tbh x10

Seconded.

[Deathsoul-fairbanks]

Too bad the New Blizzard doesn’t care about this post =( It’s 100 % spot on.

[Zarikas-ysera]

Only 46 keys have had a 30+ time on them. This person is talking our of their butt.