The Shattering Line Is Dead

Classes Death Knight
1
Old post

I bring dire news, tipped off by a poster who goes by “Ben”, who shared an odd Riders build in Acherus today.

It is a DPS loss to talent Shattering Blade in any situation. You should drop Shattering Blade and Avalanche if you are a dual-wield Frost build. If you don’t want to play Breath of Sindragosa, redirect your points to Inexorable Assault, Horn of Winter, Chill Streak, or Enduring Chill. Even Runic Command. Just take the point out of Shattering Blade.

Riders? Yep https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ebSeMRknADaD6rmsSRyVJt
AoE Riders? Yep https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/bXDM4U6CRC9Gv5ryvQyfpZ
Deathbringer? Also yep https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/u3LWGQXrPB8fqfiLaq9EDM

How did this happen?
Fundamentally, this happens because too much damage is lost from other abilities hitting without full Razorice stacks, and empowered Frost Strikes are not compensating enough.

Razorice, with Unholy Bond, gives 3.6% Frost damage per stack for a total bonus of 18% at max stacks. Stoneskin Gargoyle, with Unholy Bond, gives 6% Strength.

When I compare the builds in the results, the bonus damage to Frost Strike cannot overcome this large bonus in free damage. Although Razorice stacks rapidly, most of the time in single-target is spent below five stacks (5 stacks has an uptime of about 40%). If SSG were unavailable, we would still want to talent into the Shattering line as expected.

A key reason why empowered Frost Strikes cannot bridge the gap comes from a long-standing bug that plagues this talent. Currently, Razorice is consumed before the empowered Frost Strike hits. This means that Shattering Blade is cannibalizing its own damage and isn’t reaching its full potential.

Example from a log https://i.imgur.com/FKrTURR.png

Is there a quick fix?
I think there is at least one simple solution. Buff Shattering Blade back up to 125%, and fix how the talent consumes Razorice.

I tweaked the Frost Strike implementation in SimulationCraft to explore what would happen if Razorice expired after the main hand Frost Strike hit instead of before. I also overrode the spell data to return Shattering Blade to 125% bonus damage.

Bingo https://i.imgur.com/ighUeJM.png

Shattering Blade is now slightly better than dropping the talent to play an easier, more passive option. I’m unsure if this is the best solution, as I do not know what it would take to affect the order of consuming Razorice. However, it does illustrate that this can be fixed with targeted tuning for the talent without buffing or nerfing every build in the spec.

This weeks hotfix to count the Razorice bonus for empowered Frost Strikes restores the intuitive DW Obliteration build. Thank you Blizzard devs!

25 Likes
2

Interesting…does not taking Shattering Blade close the gap between 2H and DW?

3

It does, yes. 2h doesn’t quite have the stats needed to shine yet, but the Rider build proposed is one of the most weapon-type agnostic builds in the spec.

1 Like
4

so update shattering blade to not consume razorice…

5

Huge L, shattering was so fun in M+

2 Likes
6

Still beta testing lmao… the amount of bugs going into s1 is just insane

1 Like
7

It does not, because not taking SB is a large buff to DW. 2H cannot hope to close to gap now, and we can see why when we look at the advantages for DW.

  • Attacks faster, netting more natural Killing Machine procs and Icy Death Torrent procs
  • More free Glacial Advances from getting more Killing Machines
  • Free 6% Strength from getting the benefit of a third Runeforge in Stoneskin Gargoyle

The best case for 2H is still AoE, where it can fully capitalize on the +30% Obliteration damage. But even there, it still lags DW.

2 Likes
8

Simple solution imo is shattering should apply a slightly more effective Razorice for ~x seconds when the base version is consumed, to encourage getting as many shatter procs as possible for enhanced frost damage. That way it doesn’t eat itself and the minigame has a real reward.

1 Like
9

third enchant? What are we running on MH/OH now?

I thought we were doing RI mh and FC oh? do you mean let glacial advance apply RI and put something else on mh?

10

If you’re not running shattering RI is fairly useless so yes SSG+FC would be the play (just as it is currently for breath).

1 Like
11

I’ve been playing this build since launch if anyone wants to see it from this last weeks raid

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/character/us/sargeras/Nerfd

12

Another idea to just rework these two talents to something that doesn’t consume our damage buff.

Shattering Blade replaced with Cryoblade - at max razorice stack your auto attacks do frost damage.

Shattered Ice replaced with Tundra Stalker - At max razorice stacks Frost strike and Glacial advance have a chance to make your next Frost Strike or Glacial Advance free and do x% more damage. Just let GA be our AOE spender stop forcing our single target abilities to cleave so they can be buffed for single target. RIP frost scythe.

Also buff avalanche damage. It and inexorable assault have fallen so far behind.

1 Like
13

That just seems entirely wrong… time your dmg with the stacks and its all solved…

Like what are we even complaining about?

14

How do you like the gameplay? Do you find it smoother to play than DB?

15

Looks more like there is a bug that isnt providing the full 115% instead of the 18% increase not happening.

Didn’t actually look at the baseline damage of Frost Strike which I should do. Something sounds off though because over halfing Frost Strike damage on what should be every Frost Strike doesn’t sound right. They probably should take RI out of the talents and if you want RI to be applied you have to take the Runeforge like it was intended. We shouldn’t have 3 runeforges without having that runeforge.

It’s akin to having an enchant proc when there is no source for it. It all started because of 2h nonsense and people saying “GA says it applies RI but it doesn’t!” When it did when you had the runeforge.

16

Has this bug been reported to Blizzard IF in fact is correct?

17

Bug or no bug, consuming RI stacks to buff a single attack is doodoo design. No reason SB needs to consume stacks at all.

1 Like
18

I always thought that the Shattering talents were not good for the spec. It’s a pimple mechanic that is counterintuitive to Frost because of how Razorice functions. Not only that, we already have a problem with Obliterate double functioning both in single target and in AoE - having Frost Strike be put under the same mercy of tuning knobs is not helping the spec either. Strip the Shattering line and put more focus on Frostscythe in it’s place.

3 Likes
19

Ben? You mean former world first Ben? I think Ben use to be GL of a World First guild some years ago. Now King of PoE Ben? Lightly7 Ben? World First Lilith Ben?

Would be something if Ben came back to play WoW, pretty sure him and Imexil use to be in the same world first guild. Would be funny if it’s the same Ben, and if it is PoE Ben the guy knows exactly what he’s talking about.

20

this is a shame.