IMO just make heroic gear up-gradable. Kill 20 heroic bosses and you can upgrade a piece one tick, to the max of whatever mythic ilevel the item would have
Something that dilutes the skill gap between mythic and heroic raids is the gear level. A mythic raid would be more of an accomplishment to clear if we had to use the same gear as everybody else
There’s literally 700,000 players above ksm (if 15s give top ilvl vault there’s no reason for someone who hates m+ to go higher) in season 3
700,000+
Go look on raider io s3 stats, hint you’ll have to go to all ranking and go to page 27,000 
Yup pre-catalyst was cringe. Loot in the game is cringe, S4 is an amazing step in the right direction. Semi-trolling aside, IDK why they don’t make Heroic Raid spammable and eligible for valor though.
This is true…and also why there are about is a HUGE difference between the number of raiders and M+ players. At this point, raiding is a lost cause and they might as well scrap it and focus on M+ dungeons.
You’d have to count how many of those are alts and how many players have quit over the feature.
Raid lockouts were made so you don’t go full degenerate playstyle, something that M+ encourage. It’s no wonder lot of people hate it.
I’m not reading any of that drivel lmao
Your personal thoughts and experiences aren’t fact
Calling something toxic over and over is actually embarrassing
Making stuff up like this is why nobody, devs included, pays any attention to the GD forums.
And how would one ascertain that information
M+ is an extremely popular game mode
That 700,000 figure is probably incorrect anyway. That assumes those who did it purely for the vault coincidentally did 1 of each dungeon on both affixes
So in reality you could probably double or triple that number of M+ enjoyers
Just because you don’t like the vault or M+ doesn’t mean no one else does.
M+ is the only reason I play, and the vault is a nice bit of bonus gear at higher ilvl.
What degen about getting loot. It’s a silly means to an end.
It’s also loaded with rewards. How much of it is only loot? I’m sure warfronts were popular.
It’s about time spent in the game. Raids have lockout so you didn’t feel like spending all your time in the game in pursuit of gear. Something which M+ changed for the worse for a lot of people as mmos should be more than just about gear.
I just literally gave you the numbers from s3
700,000 characters guaranteed
Due to how score is allocated and those only doing it for vault are unlikely to have near 2500 and above
You could reasonably bump that number up to 1,000,000+
But that’s just an assumption
The fact is, 700,000 players 100% like M+ enough to exceed 2500io in s3, there’s no other reason to do that other than fun
How many subs do we even have in s3, and 700,000 play one game mode for enjoyment but you think it’s not popular
S3 had a reason to get 3k io for conduits.
So I still ask. How much of it was for loot?
And warfronts were still popular, being popular when being an easier access to loot is kinda obvious.
You think people that dislike M+ are grinding to 3k for minor performance increase of 278 conduits? You could get 265(?) from the runs anyway.
Trying to pretend M+ isn’t popular (it’s probably the most popular) game mode is actual lunacy
I agree and just increase loot drops from raid as well, but in turn, allow mythic plus to get up to mythic level item from valor.
Yes when the season has been very easy with tier sets.
Doing a +20 in s3 is easier than a +12 in s1.
And, getting 3k was actually a joke with the amount of dungeons of S3
Trying to pretend like popularity is relevant when M+ is the easiest access to gear. Like Warfronts were.
I said M+ shouldn’t offer gearing and should strictly be a challenge mode from day 1. The problem with that is that you have to be a raider to be a dungeoneer, which I agree is just awful. The compromise was having M+ be spamable, but only offer a couple of pieces a run making gearing horrible, but still doable. There’s also a far larger loot table w/ M+ gearing and more instances and bosses to get loot from, making the loot you want much harder to get than in raiding. So in a way the system right now is sort of fair.
What really should happen, is that raiding being weekly, should drop a bit more loot per boss.
This is a very weird argument. Of course M+s popularity is relevant because it is the content that players are actually engaging in.
Over the last week players completed 3 x more mythic +s than the number of raiders. (and that’s with everyone trying to get the new mount)
This disparity in “popularity” should drive Blizzard to either fix raiding or get rid of it.
So are world quests and warfronts back then when they make them give really good loot for easy content or mandatory for power.
I don’t get what’s weird about saying that people doing content doesn’t make content good.
Are you gonna tell me that Zereth Mortis is the pinnacle of design because every players got to revered and did the questline for the legendary?
What does the current Heroic raid take for competent players to clear? 3-5 hours?
That’s 10 shots at loot in at best 3 hours, at worse 5-6? Does that sound fair? @291-298ilvl
To have 10 shots at M+ look with pugs you’re looking at easy 8-10 hours (LFG grouping and travel inclusive) and @ best of 288ilvl
(And we’re assuming all 10 of those key runs are completed)
So m+ players get less chances in the same time frame @ lower item level?
I don’t get why people dislike a certain things (m+ in this case) and feel the need to preach their 
opinions to others about how they think it is. You do you, play how you want to play and let others do the same.