I feel key runs run too much importance for gearing. I play casually and we run Heroic raids, and a few weeks in it becomes less exciting to advance in our Heroic run since I’m not even picking up any gear from there anymore. There might be a more optimal solution, but my initial thought is that running Heroic should give a maximum of 1 Mythic level piece every week (equal to that of 15+ key run). To keep things progressing in the same level, Normal raids should give Max. 1 item of Heroic level and LFR should give Max. 1 item of Normal (maybe after 5 kills or something one item in vault gets upped). At least then during the runs it’ll feel more worthwhile (upping importance in other parts of the game to even out the power level importance of keys)… to me it just feels that key runs are too necessary. Thoughts?
I agree. If you only raid, will you on average get 3 pieces of loot per week if you kill 10 raid bosses (2 from boss drops/1 from the weekly chest). Additionally, the loot is capped at the difficulty of raid you are doing.
In contrast, M+ is spammable content that drops upgradeable loot and your weekly chest options are upgraded to a higher ilvl than the actual dungeons you ran.
It is pretty much impossible to gear in a reasonable amount of time as a raid-only player but you could easily do it as a M+ player.
Blizz needs to do something to even the playing field. The obvious answer is to increase raid loot, but they do not seem interesting in that solution.
I absolutely think that Valor is awesome and every form of end game content should have its version.
Let us upgrade Heroic drops and let us get a currency that grants us gear as bad luck protection.
I did 13 bosses this week and only have gotten two pieces of loot. Raiding is too stingy. Forgot about the cloak.
wiggles toes
If they don’t want to nerf M+ rewards, which I don’t think they want to, then they probably need to double raid loot drops.
LOL no. Thank you for the laugh though.
M+ shouldn’t reward ANY gear at all. It should be the Seasonal competition mode for PvE for titles, mounts and cosmetics. The majority of the player base hates M+ and forcing progression gearing or weekly chores to do them feels bad creating a toxic environment in M+ for everyone.
They are doing away with Arena gear in DF I really hope that M+ follows so that way ONLY the people that want to do this activity want to. Instead of gating gear behind it ruining the game for the majority.
M+ is such a small part of this game. It was okay a few expansions ago but now it’s boring no matter what you do. Just remove the gear in there so everyone can be happy and bring back Valor gear for BiS items.
It’s kinda too late for that that’s the thing.
Blizzard is looking at their engagement with m+ and the vault and it’s too good.
That’s also why they refuse to do any changes to M+.
Hi friend
While I agree with this post
13 bosses took you what? 3-4-5-6 hours?
13 shots at M+ loot assuming you’re pugging every key is usually 45 min-1 hour (queue time/travel time inclusive) depending on the speed of LFG
So we’re talking a discrepancy of 10-9-8-7 hours to the detriment of the M+ player
So with 50% of the effort you get the same chance at gear that I do?
So I agree,
Buff Mythic+
We just making stuff up now? Maybe your friends who are raiders don’t like M+, but my friends who are M+ers don’t like raid…. So?
If they removed M+ (which they’ll never do) or made it ineffective to attain near top item level, me and alot of the people I play with would just uninstall and move onto the next thing
Play the same amount of time or each and tell me which gives you more.
Mythic is repeatable. That’s what gives it an edge, but more time spent
M+ and the Toxic Vault has caused so many people to quit though. No one wants a chore list everyweek of things they don’t want to do for RNG loot.
They need to remove the Toxic vault it’s hurting the game and bring back Valor Vendors that has BiS items. So the gear progression is clear and attainable.
M+ participation is lowest now of any expansion because the players are over it and forced chores. M+ is NOT fun it’s actually painful to do them. Sorry but what else does Blizz have because M+ isn’t it.
It would be great if we never have to do a M+ again.
That’s why they’re experimenting with a dinar system. It’s a way to get a guaranteed drop after effort.
And calling something toxic over and over again doesn’t make it true
Hate to break it to you but the majority of the player base in this game doesn’t Raid or do M+. That is why no one raided the last season either. People don’t want a weekly chore list especially for activities like M+ or Raiding they don’t enjoy.
This expansion has the lowest player metrics in every category of ANY expansion for a reason. SL is the worst gearing expansion with hardly any content and painful chores.
M+ shouldn’t reward gear it only make M+ more toxic for everyone hurting the game.
Gear progression should be at the Vendor that is clear cut. Valor and Raid vendors instead of a Toxic vault is the answer. Unless they want to keep losing ppl because of the Vault and chores. (furthermore PvE gearing should be synonymous with PvP gearing which means BiS at vendors)
Again in DF they removed Arena Rated gear since the majority of PvPers don’t want to do it. Why make PvE players suffer?
You’re literally just repeating buzzwords and phrases you’ve heard on the forums lmao
The forums will legitimately have you believing this mmorpg is filled with players who hate mmorpgs.
I don’t see how the vault is a weekly chore, you get extra (read: additional) loot for the ingame activities you’re doing anyway?
The game has chores, but the vault isn’t one of them.
This is how you decimate the population of the game
What? M+ is incredibly popular lmao
That has literally been the game since inception.
And yet here we are still going…
It’s a pretty divise and controversial feature.
I’ll say what every raider has always told me when they had undisputedly the best loot and only access to Tier before catalyst, etc: If you want the reward go do the content, no one is stopping you.
You know what’s horrible with tier set in Sepulcher. It was actually worse than before because we didn’t have master loot and loot has been reduced even further than before.
That even if you cleared the raid on normal and heroic each week, a lot of people in your raid would finish their tier set with the vault or the forge. There’s no way that you can support that tuning. And there’s no way that M+ should be as much good in time efficiency compared to raids.
The Vault is the most Toxic aspect of the game that is a lottery tied to chores you either win or lose and most people feel bad playing it. The vault is designed to waste the players time. Better design would to respect the player time which means not having Toxic forced systems you are driven into.
It’s a chore list of activities the majority of players don’t want to do. Then when you waste your time doing them and get bad loot it feels so unrewarding that you just Uninstall and quit. The vault has cause myself and many others to quit many times.
Additionally there is no catch up for the Vault creating gear disparity for people that aren’t playing which makes them not want to return. There is NO BENEFIT OF THE VAULT!!!
Especially when we can just have something that works infinitely better which is Valor/Raid vendors where people take resources and pick what they want putting value in the players time again. People are excited to log in or come back with catch up mechanics instead of doing terrible Weekly chores in a lottery system.
Can you just understand these facts thanks.
The vault is a painful mechanic that causes only suffering and heart break. It’s extremely bad design. People will keep quitting because of it.