It’s hard to keep faith we’ll ever have the permissions separated out again despite Ion saying they were working on it. I can understand why a lot of players feel Blizzard has given up on WoW and is just milking it for as long as possible. But that kind of thinking doesn’t make much sense to me. Why even bother keeping it up if you’re just going to run it into the ground? Why spend any money on development?
I really want to believe Ion. I want to believe they have a fix in the works, but more pressing issues have pushed it back for a later date. I don’t want to think that no one at Blizzard gives a poop anymore.
One trend I’ve seen is, like the guild leader community I started on our server, is that players are migrating to rather large communities. One community I have been a member of has exploded from just barely over 100 to over 700 members!
As we stated a long time ago on this thread, the push is to have us have guilds (Yes, believe it or not) AND be a part of a larger community where we can engage in activities.
Are there more permissions on communities? No. Is there more intimacy, in terms of friendships and maintaining them? No. It’s simply more…more people. There is the benefit of cross server activity, though.
My overall opinion has been and is still: they are not going back. They are done with all the fixes for guilds. The road forward has proved too appealing to too many players, and the option to join huge communities has pretty much made guilds exist at the expense of communities. If you’re guild is NOT in a community or affiliated with a large one…it should be. If you’re interested in preserving the relationships you have made over the years; make it happen, in my humble opinion.
I’m not criticizing anyone here. I’m not here telling anyone what to do. I’m putting out an opinion, based on my own experience. I love having my friends in guild. I also love having a viable, active guild that gets AotC every xpac. To do that, I’ve had to make some changes, compromises, and learn to live with the tools I’m given. Overall, I have to admit that I’m glad I was able to adapt and keep our guild and friends happy. It’s a real pleasure to make new friends too! Please guys, I know if you are this committed, you can do it too! Be well
Only 700 though? I’m in a guild on Feathermoon that has nearly a thousand members. It doesn’t seem that communities are required in order to have a lot of people.
Just checking in to remind Blizzard that I have not forgotten that they promised (via Ion) to fix the granular guild permission that they broke.
Blizz, if you have the spare time to rework some old BC armor plate- kini pants to show less derrière, you certainly must have a bit o’time to fix up guild permissions.
Because guilds must be more important than how much pixilated cartoon butt-cheek is showing right?
It does seem that way. But I’m going to continue to hope Blizzard hasn’t 100% thrown guilds away. Communities and guilds are NOT interchangeable.
Not all guilds want, or need, to be large. There are many different types of guilds, with many different reasons for existing. Those of us who have been persisting in this thread are doing so because we don’t like the “one-size-fits-all” approach.
One of the great things about WoW used to be that it was open to all different types of players and play-styles. More and more, that freedom is being restrained, and more and more, players are finding other things to do with their time.
I know it’s pointless to post here and expect anything useful to come of it. But, as I’ve said before, I’m not going to just let this drop. Yes, some GM’s (like Che) have learned to work around the changes and are doing okay. Others have moved their guilds to Classic, disbanded their guilds, or quit the game altogether. Some, like me, have simply given up growing their guilds.
Fixing the broken permissions should never have been something we needed to beg for. It certainly shouldn’t be something that hasn’t been taken care of yet. I feel like this issue is a perfect example of Blizzard not caring about WoW any more.
But I’m going to keep posting here until the permissions are fixed or the thread is shut down. (Or I stop playing WoW.)
I believe that a strong officer-core and an even stronger GM is the main thing that holds a guild together and steers it through the storm to make sure it succeeds. I don’t mean this in a derogatory manner, but are you really sure your guild had a strong officer-core and GM if you have given up on your guild over so check boxes? Are you really sure that you wanted the responsibility of GM if you’ve so easily given it up?
Are you joking or just doing your usual Blizzard brown-nosing? Of course, I understand this thread is too long for you to go back and read the posts where I actually described Fumel’s guild. It was a brand-new guild, so I didn’t have a chance to get to know if any of the members would be trustworthy as officers. If I could have spread out the responsibilities, I could have seen which members could handle being officers and which were unreliable.
It doesn’t matter now. I’ve turned the guild into an alt guild, where members can park their alts without worry of being kicked because they don’t play them much. The time I would have spent managing and building my guild I’ve put to better use practicing my instruments and working on my real-life professions.
At this point, the lack of permission flexibility doesn’t affect me directly. That doesn’t mean Blizzard shouldn’t be held accountable for a change Ion said was unintentional, with a fix being worked on. If they’ve changed their minds, fine. Tell us so. Otherwise, I’m going to continue to hope Ion wasn’t lying, and they really are going to fix it sometime. Until they do, I’m going to keep reminding them that I haven’t forgotten.
Edit: In case you’re confused, Fumel is my alt—something I’ve never tried to hide.
I’m curious how you’ve handled the all-in-one permissions. How have you “steered through the storm?” I’m not being sarcastic. We’ve asked Che to divulge how his guild handles things, but he just goes on about his community of GM’s, not how he manages the day to day running of his guild.
Of course, if you’re in a long-established guild, you already know the officers well enough that you can probably trust them with all the permissions. Any ideas on how to gauge if a stranger can be trusted with all the permissions available under “is officer?”
A lot of the GM’s in this thread used to use the permissions as rewards. As members proved themselves, they were given access to more responsibilities through permissions. Any suggestions on alternatives?
I’m not asking this so much for myself as for the other GM’s that pop up in this thread. Some of them may still be trying to make things work. I’m sure they’d be happy to learn of other ways they might manage things.
More than happy to share on how I handle and have handled officer permissions since I started our guild over 6 years ago.
It’s pretty simple for me, in terms of management. I ask officers to manage things that directly impact guildies such as events, class guidance, and anything else game related. I manage everything else.
Officers are not allowed to remove guildies. Officers are allowed to demote or mute guildies if they deem it necessary. I have laid out my expectations for when a guildie needs to be muted to all officers. We use the “new guildie” status (Wednesday) rank as our mute rank. I do not ask officers to manage any guildie concerns. I do ask our officers to be my “eyes and ears” and keep me posted on any issues they see or hear about or believe to exist in guild.
Our rules state plainly that our expectation is that if there is a disagreement among guildies, we expect them to not gossip, cool off, then come back and handle it 1:1 with the other person. I am the only officer allowed to arbitrate things should the 1:1 method fail. And of course, I will be highly disappointed in the guildies for failing to be able to handle their disagreement like adults. Disregarding this expectation can lead to immediate removal from guild.
Officers have full gbank access but only I can withdraw gold.
Officers are all the same rank, Sunday. There’s no incentive plan, no bonus plan, no special perks for being an officer in Weekenders. You’re an officer because I asked you and you agreed to everything I laid out above and have other things to do than deal with drama (like the things I’ve asked you to do, such as grinding mats, creating and hosting events, and taking time out to help guildies with their class/spec or questions about Mythic+/PVP/Raiding).
That’s pretty much it. I’m willing to take some questions on this, but please trust I’m doing this because I was asked. I’m not going to engage in banter or other nonsense. I do it this way because it works. I’m hoping that’s explanation enough.
It’s a very good explanation. I like how you’ve managed things and made your expectations clear. That works very well for a guild like yours that is seriously pushing content like Blizzard expects. I assume most (if not all) of your members work hard and want to take part in the guild’s progression.
The fact that your guild has been around a while also helps a great deal. You probably don’t really need any of the permissions separated out because you have long-time members you know and trust, as well as a proven method of breaking in new members. You’ve done a very good job, and you should feel a lot of satisfaction about it.
Unfortunately, not all guilds have the same goals or reason for being as yours. This is why flexibility in the permissions is so necessary. Every guild is different, and has different management needs. The sad thing (to me) is that the developers actually understand this, since the change was unintentional. However, it seems fixing the problem is more work than they deem it’s worth, and so we’re here, talking to ourselves in this thread.
I do appreciate you sharing your methods. It may well help some of the GM’s that sometimes come here, especially if they have a progression guild like yours.
Just popping in to remind the folks at ActiBlizz that we’re still waiting on some kind of resolution. If you’re not going to fix this or don’t care about your playerbase, please just say so. While the actions (and inactions) have spoken as much, you may as well rip the bandaid off so your community can go elsewhere to games and companies that actually value them.
Or you can make good on what you’d said, and take action to fix the guild permissions your new feature (that nobody asked for) broke. It’s one thing in a long list of many broken aspects of this game, but even baby steps are better than no steps.
As long as they say nothing, I’m going to assume they’re doing what Ion claimed: working on a fix. And it really doesn’t look good when you’ve been “working” on something for over two years and still can’t get it done.
Oh! Hello there! Fancy meeting you here in this practically-a-zombie thread. Yeah, it’s not dead (yet), it just smells that way. The odor is actually from the (stuff) Ion told us about how they’re “working on a fix” for the all-in-one permissions.
We’ve explained multiple times in multiple ways how the current permissions don’t work for all guilds, but we’ve been ignored and relegated to occasionally airing out this thread so we can be ignored some more. So, it’s fine if you aren’t interested in this Quixotic mission. I’ll keep tilting at the windmill until my Impossible Dream comes true (or Blizzard shuts the thread down, whichever comes first).
