… Wait, it’s really been a year since this started? Seriously?
C’mon Blizzard. This is absolutely ridiculous and unacceptable- we need better communication. What’s been done since you asked us for itemized, more specific feedback? When can we expect some kind of answer as to when this will be fixed? It really needs to not be an ‘if’, because this entire thread is a testament to the damage this change has caused guild leaders and members alike. Whether it was an unintended change or not doesn’t really matter at this point- you surely have more than enough feedback to make the changes.
I’d say after a year it’s time to hurry up and listen, but it may be to late.
Perhaps this is what Blizz has hoped for all along. ie: To drag this mess out and dishearten us.
Perhaps they are just to preoccupied perfecting Classic.
Perhaps they simply don’t care.
In any event if the following hasn’t happened yet :
It looks like it may soon.
I myself did cancel one of my several Wow accounts as a direct result of this guild permissions fiasco, and I will be also cancelling another Wow sub this month.
As I have stated previously here, it is my guild’s intention to set up shop, (or at least a branch office) on Classic in August.
Although I am an altoholic to the extreme, I will not need multiple accounts on Classic as it takes much much longer to level, and each toon requires much more time investment than does modern Wow.
Does that count as “unsubbing?”
Does moving to Pandora?
For the record Blizzard, while I still have an active account, it’s only because Classic is on the horizon.
I am no longer actively playing BfA. I am merely waiting for Classic and keeping an eye on whats left of our guild. (Caretaking I suppose)
Although I have to admit I am looking forward to Classic, as another poster (the oft quoted Kesnal) stated, all this saddens me.
Greatly.
This game has been my home away from home for a lot of years. It’s like being forced to uproot and having to start over somewhere new.
Something I have had to do in my real life far to many times, let alone my fantasy life where things should not (I feel) be stressful, saddening, etc…
Does all this mean I am giving up on fixed guild permissions?
No.
I am too stubborn for that.
Besides, a year or so ago when this thread was young, fresh, angry, yet hopeful, I promised Blizzard I would not go away.
Not only is the guild UI and permissions controls still broken, the Communities that they implemented which broke the Guild controls are malfunctioning due to the mobile-always-online bug. If you logged in on the mobile Bnet app once, unless you log out manually from that app or set yourself as Invisible (which affects your setting on the computer as well) you will always show as online in Bnet and Bnet Communities.
This has massively increased the difficulty in using a Community as a cross-realm supplement to our guild list. I’ve still had to Btag friend everyone to be able to tell who is actually online.
Here is a post I made back in Nov '18 about something that could be in Guild Halls:
I have to say, the last line specifies what I want above all else: choice and customization. We want the choice to customize our guild permissions to suit our individual guilds. We are NOT cookies cut out to be the same size and shape.
I use /groster in game, and I’ve noticed that requests to join my guild are bugged. I’ll see a request, and the request will remain even after they join my guild or someone else’s. This is not encouraging.
Here’s another idea about guild halls from back in November:
It’s almost depressing how many good ideas have been presented in this thread when Blizzard can’t even seem to set up basic guild functions properly anymore.
One year… no fixes… yeah, if anyone needed proof that Blizz was using the “ignore them till they stop complaining” method of addressing this issue… a year with no activity from blizz should do the trick…
My guildies are still ticked off that our ranking system and perks for their ranks are gone. I lost some people from this game because guild permissions are now crap and it was a last straw for them. They went to other games that actually allow ranks to have different types of permissions for different things, instead of grouping them all together.
There is now, (for us) no way to confidently replace lost members and officers even if we chose to use the worthless “is officer” nonsense and attempt to carry on.
Trust is earned, not just handed out.
I think it was during BC that had at a chance to observe what happens when you just hand out guild-power to anyone and everyone.
It was back then during BC that I first started experimenting with creating alts on new realms. (The early signs of my years long alt addiction) During that time, I joined several guilds.
One of the guilds I joined was a brand spanking new one, having just recently been formed by a group of “friends” Their ranking system was “unique” to my Wow experience at that time.
When I read their guild info and discovered how they had set up their guild rank structure. I shook my head in disbelief that anyone could seem so foolish.
Their way was to make the highest levels officers, and the lower levels mere peons.
Their rank structure was pretty basic if I remember correctly. There were the “Founders” (the group of then friends who started the guild together) “Officers” (anyone who joined and was level 60 plus was immediately made an officer with all privileges attached) and anyone below level 60 was a simple peon.
It was my impression that they were all trying to be “The Leader” (as in “Founder” and “Co-founder” or Gm and Co-Gm, etc…)
I suppose in theory this could work.
If not for human nature.
They were brand new as I said, and I could tell from reading guild chat that not a one of their “leaders” had a single clue how to run a successful guild.
I knew how, but I was relegated to the lowest rank as I was on a newly created low level alt.
Wanting to help some, I whispered one of the “Founders” and explained this, thinking maybe they might want my advice since I had some experience running a successful guild.
I got a sort of “thanks, we’ll let you know” response.
(I never heard from them again)
In my short time there, I watched the new guild slowly crumble.
In-fighting started. From what I remember, the fighting seemed to be mostly about each individual wanting to run the guild their own way.
Also.
As I said, they made high levels officers as soon as they joined. Not after a probationary period to see what that high level might be like.
The ninjas landed.
The guild bank was robbed multiple times by high level “officer” ninjas.
Officers battled officers, Founders battled Founders, Founders battled officers. Some tried ordering the lower levels (and even one another) around, and that led to many of the lower levels leaving, which led to more fights and then to many of the officers leaving, and there was more fighting, and more ninjas, and…
It was total chaos.
I left too after a short time. The fighting was so toxic by then that Chernobyl looked downright pleasant.
Some time later I remember seeing a few of the toons around I knew to be the founders (the guys who could not figure out that you can NOT make every Tom, Dick, and Sally who happens to have a high level toon an officer).
They were all in different (and separate) guilds. I imagine the guild they formed quickly imploded as likely did their relationships with each other.
In my opinion, this is what can and does happen when there are only “is officers” and “not-is officers”
Those guys must have made out ok in the long run though. It would seem that the founders of that long-gone guild have all gone on to be advisers to Blizzard’s guild structure devs…
Here is another suggestion for a nice guild perk made back in Nov '18:
We’ve been told that our problem with the permissions is understood. Why, then, has it not been fixed? Are we truly unreasonable in our expectations? Is WoW such a poor income generator that Blizzard cannot spare the resources to fix a “minor” issue on a “dying” game?
I personally have little interest in Classic, but I definitely understand the attraction for those who remember a time when Blizzard seemed to actually care about the game.
being understood, does not mean that changes need to be made.
Even if changes are going to be made, changes don’t happen instantly.
That’s just not how it works.
not sure i understand the point in this?
we’ve already got anytime, anywhere guild bank access… which can be used in places where mounts can’t be used.
if the game is “dying”, there’s not much point devoting resources to your demands.
The vast majority of guilds have carried on without any hiccups, so why is there any urgency to your issue?
…perhaps it’s time to consider that your expectations are indeed, unreasonable?
Well, Ion said they were aware of the problem and that changes were being made. Then he asked for specific feedback about what we’d like to see for guilds and our priorities for the changes. So, since we’ve heard nothing else, we’ve been giving feedback and mentioning our priority is to have the permissions broken up again.
Citation needed.
Truth is, we don’t know how many guilds have collapsed from this change, how many have adapted–with hiccups–and how many have been unaffected.
My guild? Completely unaffected because it died several expansions ago. Fumel’s guild? Unaffected in that it’s not a real guild, but affected in that I have zero interest in making it a real guild now.
There have been numerous excellent posts describing why having all permissions lumped together is bad policy, so I don’t feel there’s any real need to explain that. However, I’m not going to roll over and say I’m okay with the permissions as they are. Until Blizzard fixes the problem or closes the thread, I’ll keep posting.
You claimed “without hiccups”. Guilds have adapted–players always adapt or quit. But you can’t know how many guilds fell apart from this change or how many players decided it was the last straw. The lack of “traffic” in this thread could be explained by massive departures from WoW just as easily as it can be explained by people adapting.
I’m only guilding with myself and alts until at -least- the forced persistent chat is rescinded or made optional. I see the utility of it, but it should be optional. Yeah I’m only one player, but the guild changes with BfA fundamentally altered the way I approach the game. Being in a guild was one of the best parts of WoW, and now I can’t bring myself to join one because of these changes.
Guild chat used to feel like a decent place to get to know people. I try to be careful with anything I say over electronic medium, but in general I could roughly assume that the only people seeing what I was saying in guild chat were the people currently online. It made it more personable.
Now? Any and all future members of the guild will be able to scroll back and read what you said. That’s fine if everyone is nice and would never use something you said in the past in a harmful way, but is everyone nice?
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