the real stupid thing about warcrimes was how it included crimes from before garrosh was even on azeroth.
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Treng: āThe Horde are the victims in BFA!ā
Also Treng: āShares a video about RPing an evil character.ā
???
Orc logic.
The important part was where it was timecut.
āA lot of people want to talk about actual evil in the real world. ā¦ People canāt transmit information if they donāt have some common ground for communication and I would like to think that we can agree that there is a difference in reality and fiction.ā
Adolf Hitler did not have a writer dictating what he would do against his will. The Horde does.
(Also, Iām not an orc? Iām a people. Orcs arenāt real, Akiyass.)
Glad I could hold your hand and guide you to this very basic understanding of the difference between reality and fiction.
You see, I am actually a big fan of Matt Colville. I DM multiple games currents, and his advice helps me quite a bit for World Building and developing plots and settings.
So I have seen this video before, several times, in fact. I am currently playing an evil character in a D&D game. But you see, I donāt think you are really getting his point.
There is a difference between the player and the character. I can judge the character as much as I want. I can compare the Horde to Hitler if I feel their actions are comparable in one way or another.
What mat is saying isā¦ Well, the Golden Rule of RPā¦ Separate IC from OOC. The player is not evil for playing an evil character, the character is still, in fact, evil though. Ele wasnāt comparing you to Hitler, she was comparing the Horde to Hitler. That is not what Matt Colville is talking about in that video.
You canāt hide from me, Greenie.
Even though the entire point flew past your head, probably because you donāt have the attention span to watch more than 2 mins of Mattās 30 min long video.
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Akiyass.
Thatās my entire point.
But that point has nothing to do with what Ele saidā¦
The HORDE, Treng. THE HORDE. Not you, not any other player. THE HORDE AS AN IN-WORLD INSTITUTION.
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Do you know why Dreadmoore became my main?
Because I got tired of Blizzard penalizing the Horde playerbase for things they had no control over.
The Horde is a team. I wave its flag. I play it in the game. And I am constantly told I am wrong for playing it not only by the players of the opposite team, but the NPCs ON MY TEAM.
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I can see how that sucks, but itās also how the Horde has been written, by your own admission.
Blizzard has written the Horde as genocidal aggressors. Some of us can interpret that as evil. We can say THE HORDE IS EVIL because they have been WRITTEN THAT WAY, or we are interpreting such at least.
Saying āThe Horde is Evilā is not the same as saying āThe Horde Playerbase is evil.ā
Itās hilarious that you constantly share Matt Colvilleās video about separating IC and OOC, and YOU CANT SEPERATE IC FROM OOC!
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Well the new horde wasnāt supposed to be evil, thrall was supposed to lead them into a more peaceful coexistence then he left and things went very downhill.
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But you have repeatedly, in repeated threads said that I was okay with taking land from natives in real life because Iāve stated that Ashenvale is orc land.
Because YOU said thatā¦ your CHARACTER didnāt say that. Again, separate IC from OOC.
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ASHENVALE ISNāT REAL, AKIYASS.
OOC discussions can be had about the fictional world. I can say orcs encroaching on Kaldorei land is reminiscent of encroaching European settlers in the Americas. I can make that comparison. I can have a moral opinion about the happenings in a fictional world. Villains exist in storiesā¦ Villains are villains because they violate our real-world sense of morality.
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The fictional world is not indicative of the real world. This is a game built on a war game. If Blizzard removed Night Elves from the entire game tomorrow and officially named all night elf zones, jointly, orc land I would shrug and order a pizza.
This isnāt remotely comparable to what my great grandpa went through in WW2. Oneās a video game with made up places. The other was real life.
The problem with dwarves is that they donāt get the main spotlight as a whole. At most Brann and Magni get prominent roles and maybe one of the Wildhammers or Moira will get a line or two here and there.
Thatās honestly probably a good thing though, seeing the treatment of most of the Horde and Night Elves.
Read it again. Slower this time.
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Why? Youāre being deliberately obtuse to extend the argument. Ashenvale isnāt real. Night elves arenāt real. Players are real. How blizzard treats players, who pay them a monthly subscription, is what I take issue with.
I donāt pay them 15 dollars a month to make my faction lose every conflict in the entirety of the expansion, kill its hero characters, remove its hero characters, and pomp the enemy factionās hero characters.
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No I am notā¦ I am trying to explain to you the difference between IC and OOC. If you do not know, those stand of āIn Characterā and āOut Of Characterā
Let me give you an example:
If I say: āFLAY THE ORCS AND HANG THEM FROM THE TREES! JUSTICE FOR TELDRASSIL!ā
That is an IC statement. I am speaking from the perspective of someone within the world. The best way to know this is, it would be difficult for me to flay orcs when they donāt exist. So you can infer that I am playing a character and playing into the established narrative.
Now, if I say: āHonestly, the Alliance is morally justified to genocide the orcs.ā
And I -actually- believed that. Thatās an OOC statement that you could challenge with a real world reference. Because I, a person who exists in reality, is saying it is okay for one people to slaughter another people. The key difference here is, in one statement, I am playing a character, in the other statement, I am stating something I actually believe. Does that make sense?
This is a completely separate discussion. Something we can probably find some common ground on. However, itās unrelated to Matt Colvilleās video, and you repeatedly using it to prove a point that Matt himself is not trying to prove.
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The Horde doesnāt exist in reality, Treng. It is an in-game institution. When you say The Horde, you might mean the player base but people infer that you are talking about the faction as it exists in the narrative. You need to be more specific that you are talking about Horde players.
If you said āHorde Players are the victims of BfAā then I am inclined to agree with you, only I would say Horde and Kaldorei players are the Victims of BfA.
Again, comparisons to Hitler were made under the pretense that we were having a narrative discussion, not a discussion about players.
And you are not making the distinctions of those differences.
Again, under the pretense that we are having a narrative discussion, not a discussion about players.
Basically apply that to everything else you quoted.
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