Doesn’t make either situation ok. One side getting shafted doesn’t mean it is fine for the other side to. I hold blizzard to a better standard than that and frankly that is why I don’t agree with the current scenario getting flipped at any stage and the Alliance getting the horde treatment.
You keep making this argument and seem blind to the fact that it is something many Horde players haven’t been great fans of. The Horde shouldn’t be written how you want it to be at the expense of people actually playing that faction. The Horde doesn’t exist to be a set piece for the Alliance just as the Alliance shouldn’t exist to be a set piece for the Horde.
I might point out, you keep going “oh the horde is always the villians/antagonist, it is just what they are” and yet you always avoid commenting when I point out that if that is the case, neutral content is only being written with Alliance players in mind as it is tonally universally heroic and noble, which apparently according to you, the Horde isn’t.
And don’t say it is but it isn’t. That is a load of bullocks.
How many times are we going to have to say ‘no, that scenario isn’t ok with us’ before you finally get it.
You can say the same thing over and over again a thousand and one times and we aren’t all going to suddenly change our minds.
It is not ok. The Horde your suggesting is one none of us want to play or be a part of and the setting would poison any interactions with the Alliance we were forced to be part of. What your suggesting is in no way better than the horde being destroyed and all horde players being forced to reroll as Alliance.
Also, just for the record, there were a fair number of horde players rather bothered by the lack of Horde representation during Legion. It wasn’t something that went unnoticed.
I said this as sort of a pseudo-joke before, but lets be real about this. There is every possibility that both factions will (for the first time in WoW) “lose” in BfA.
Our conflict with one another will result in allowing the return of the Black Empire and multiple (if not all) of the Old Gods. This would shatter both factions (and while not gone) would render them far too weak to ever exert authority over the other; and create such a massive crisis situation that they’d be forced to get over past issues just to barely survive in a warping, twisting, void infested warzone (as the Old Gods show us what a REAL “Battle for Azeroth” looks like).
The only question is how Blizz intends to “share” (and dilute) responsibility for that crisis before it occurs; as ATM far too much of it is placed on the Horde’s shoulders. My guess would be that it will likely have to do with the massive betrayal that the Alliance is due for (according to Varimathras) and at least ONE of the Il’gynoth and Ogmot prophecies. I have my theories on who and what that will be, but until we see more … they’re mostly just a gut feeling.
C’mon, you’ve been through this sub-discussion often enough to know where it ends. Yes, some of those characters are not explicitly Alliance. But their stories are more directly tied to the Alliance’s than the Horde’s. And there were multiple Alliance racial leaders actively doing things in Legion, even if they weren’t doing them “For the Alliance!”–while the only Horde racial leader who got any screentime was Sylvanas, and we all know how that went.
It still boils down to Horde players, even those who basically enjoyed Legion, getting a greater sense of alienation from that expansion’s story than Alliance players.
I think Surma thinks we deserve a little unhappiness as players because she, as a player, was made unhappy by what happened to Teldrassil.
Ayup, Shaw. I understand why Nathanos is everywhere this expansion (Blizz is stumbling over themselves to make him developed enough to take over for Sylvie as the Forsaken faction representative); I do not understand why the Master of Spies and the Master of Assassins is not just everywhere, but sloppily everywhere and out in the open so much. There is a story purpose for his heavy presence specifically; because if Blizz really just needed a big military name at the forefront, this would have been a good time to develop Wyrmbane some more.
While this path was briefly tread upon in Legion (and it would be a bit of a rehash), there were no real consequences for it (and most people didn’t even know about it unless you played a rogue); and I cannot think of a single organization within the Alliance that would be more disastrous or destructive for the ENTIRE Faction if it was compromised then SI:7. The organization (or their information) strangely has also been a consistent source of Alliance mistakes or escalation in this war so far (despite Anduin’s desires and clear attempts to find ways for de-escalation).
I have exactly the opposite opinion to the OP. I think for the story to evolve and progress the Alliance has to lose this war. It is the only way to disrupt the relatively monolithic ideology of the Alliance and actually get some interesting Alliance story. The Alliance can lose, and Loa-Voljin can prevent Sylvannas from destroying the Alliance. Alliance hard-liners can blame Anduin’s kid glove strategy for the Alliance’s loss. People can question his fitness to be High King or perhaps even the position of High King itself.
The issue with this is that BFA has been enough of a curb-stomping to the Alliance that making the players suffer defeat after everything that has happened is just going to cement it was the worst possible experience Alliance players could ever have from an expansion storyline.
At this point, the Alliance winning is the consolation prize.
“Hey guys, we know the Night Elves are more or less extinct and that Lordaeron is so blighted no one can use it, but hey, you won!”
To lose the war and survive due to the mercy of the Horde, who started this war, is a bad idea and it’s going to tick off a lot of players who are already ticked off.
The issue is, the opposite is roughly as true because the Horde’s story has also sucked during this expansion.
The only satisfying end is a Stalemate where the two cannot continue the war any longer, or, as Droite said, both sides losing as the Black Empire resurfaces.
To what end, though? We already know from Son of the Wolf that the High King position still exists, and Anduin is still in it, some sixty-ish years in the future.
Let’s be real: neither side is going to win this war. We all know it. Neither side winning is going to create a play experience that the other side will want to play. And Blizzard isn’t stupid enough to drive away the playerbase like this.
Even that’s not going to be particularly satisfying because there will still be endless finger-pointing about who started it. But it’s probably the least bad option.
You don’t need the alliance losing to question the “high king” because we have been doing that since the moment he was named into that position
WoT and lordaeron being a failure is all his fault to the point that he had to be saved by jaina/deux ex machimas.
not even speaking of the “healing the horde” part.
Let’s be honest, we know who started the war. It’s like a bad game of Clue.
Sylvanas Windrunner.
At Darkshore.
With Fire.
People can say, “B-but Stormheim,” all they want, but that doesn’t change the fact the war was started by Sylvanas choosing to start it because the Alliance, ‘might,’ attack the Horde in 10 or 20 years or something.
Our position right now isn’t much better. Being reactionary punching bags to attacks where we’re told to spare the perpetrators got old the first time. You really don’t want that.
Funny, I think you couldn’t be more wrong. The Horde has become so detestable that it kind of needs to win, since there’s no sane reason for the Alliance not to get rid of it this time should it lose.
No need for a sane reason when we’ve got Anduin. Sanity doesn’t factor into it. Listening to him, we’re fighting this war as much for the Horde as for ourselves.
I especially love how, after sacrificing battalions of Night Elves, Void Elves, Dark Irons, Worgen, Humans, and Dwarves to secure a victory over the Zandalari he decides to… not secure victory over the Zandalari.