Evergrowth, Botani, whatever. Spirit is an elemental, and it empowers all other elementals (and balances them, allegedly). Point being that elementals were on Draenor and had been for so long that Mindless Swampthing drew Aggramar’s attention long enough for him to throw magic at a mountain and make Gorons.
But the dragonflayer are the second ones, the first were the winterskorns themselv
This is just wrong. The Well of Eternity didn’t create life on Azeroth, it merely amplified the phenomenon and sped up the process. As “tainted” by the WoE as they may have been, it is nonsensical to consider Elemental-based lifeforms as “artifical” in the same fashion as Titanforged.
That’s a bit of a weird take. Being agents of Order is what makes them biased in their decision-making and in their need of “reshaping worlds” in the first place. With the current lore being that cosmic forces follow their own agenda, as shown by the Light and the Void, I struggle to see how Order could be anything else but partial
I find this questionable too : if the Keepers are any indication (and I think they are, considering that the Titans created them in their image), Titans are proud and burdened by ego. Just look at Odyn…
Saying “No titans=old god dominated world” sounds a bit off since the presence of a Titan soul is the reason why Old Gods corrupt a planet in the first place. Also, right now everything hints at the Trolls being from Elemental descent. So no, by all accounts they’re not “as much “children of the titans” as anyone else”, and they’re not even explicity stated to have emerged thanks to the WoE. In fact, if this Elemental ancestry thing is confirmed, then this passage from Chronicles 1 is quite interesting :
As Freya’s creations explored the world, they came across a number of other strange life-forms. These creatures had emerged from Azeroth’s elemental past of their own free will. When the keepers had sealed off the Elemental Plane, some stragglers had escaped banishment. The fury of these spirits had ebbed over time and they had become creatures of flesh and blood. It was from these former elementals that some forms of wildlife, such as protp-dragons came to be.
Elemental races sound as natural as a race can hope to be. They do not have the Titans to thank for their existence.
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the winterskorn never turned flesh in ancient times though. They just got infected with the curse of flesh. Those affected didn’t turn overnight, it’s stated that their metal skin started to become brittle and after they were put in hibernation and woke up in the present time they found out they had become full-on flesh.
The first titanforged we know of that was full-on fleshy beings are the dragonflayers.
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Except the Titans themselves are naturally occurring, meaning their constructs are also naturally occurring. Given that the constructs which exist on Azeroth are made from Azeroth itself, they’re no more or less naturally occurring than biological life.
The problem with your definition is that it only applies to biological organisms and ignores any other type of lifeform.
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No this is not correct, it does not mean that the creations are natural occurring if their maker is natural, they’re artificial no matter what base materials they were made out of. Are machines humans make naturally occurring on earth? Are the sentry robots of the gnomes as natural to Azeroth as proto-dragons?
The very definition of artificial is that it was created by an intelligence and did not occur naturally. Often it is used to create a copy of something natural, like artificial light, or artificial intelligence, and if we ever create biological life in the lab then it would be an artificial lifeform.
Naturally means that something arises without the intervention of an intelligence guiding it. It has not been created or caused by the intelligence.
Also, the titans that made these constructs do not originate from Azeroth either.
My definition has nothing to do with biological organisms, it just specifies that something that is not artificial in origin and native to the planet in question as natural (in the context of planet Azeroth in this case).
So elementals are natural, furbolgs are natural, trolls are natural. Titanforged are not natural despite being native to Azeroth.
The sporemound and its descendants are natural on Draenor.
Titans are natural, yes, but they’re also not native (outside Azeroth herself) to our planet.
When people speak about the natural races on Azeroth this is what they usually mean, native to Azeroth and not artificial in origin.
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The problem as pointed out already, is that the titanforged are artificial, regardless of the base materials used to create them.
Proto dragons, trolls, etc are considered natural because they evolved with little to no outside interference from other forces directly shaping them into being
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Artificial and yet native.
Still artificial. And native is debatable
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No, I’d still say the titanforged are native to Azeroth, despite being made by space aliens.
Either way, the discussion wasn’t really about the nativity, it was about how natural races were to Azeroth.
Isn’t all of this besides the point anyway, because Elves are just evolved Trolls?
Not native either.
Native implies that they were not introduced to the environment. If I go to Africa and grab a bunch of Hyenas and then let them loose in Australia, the Hyenas are not native to that region. They are natural, but not native.
None of the Titanforged races were native to Azeroth, they were artificially created and then let loose and allowed to continue existing.
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Titanforged races were never not on Azeroth.
They were literally created and let loose on the planet. They didn’t exist on it before the Titans arrived, so they’re not native to Azeroth.
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They don’t exist naturally like the proto dragons and trolls do. Both of which are elemental in nature
If there was primitive dwarves and such before the titans showed up than you might have a point
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I don’t really like this comparison since it’s not really a 1 for 1.
It’s more like if an American went to Australia, harvested the resources there to make a new monkey or something like that, and then let it loose in the environment there.
It’s a fully unnatural creature, but it’s origins as such a creature is clearly in Australia. Native does not necessarily have to mean all-natural, can just mean the place of origin. Which in this case would be a lab in Australia.
So the titanforged would be Azeroth natives but fully artificial. created by natural (not to Azeroth) non-natives.
Same case with all breakers on Draenor like the Ogres, Orcs and Gronn etc.
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native
noun
- a person born in a specified place or associated with a place by birth, whether subsequently resident there or not.
They were created on Azeroth and are thus natives.
You conflate two terms, that’s your problem.
I’m not conflating anything. You’re just getting oddly mad because the titanforged are not native. They were not born, they are literally artificial constructs
That’s your problem
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Your definition doesn’t even match up with what we’re talking about.
The original Titanforged were an introduced set of constructs, completely artificial, and they would have stayed that way were it not for the Curse of Flesh. Had the Titans never arrived on the planet, then none of those Titanforged species would exist.
Native only applies to the next generation post-curse of flesh. So the first generation of Vrykul that were born would be native. But the original Titanforged creations would not be.
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Finally. Someone who gets what I been saying
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