Marksman was fine. If the serpenstalker triggering WS was a bug, fix the bug and make up for the damn near 10% damage loss. Now there is no reason to have any hunter class in any mythic or raid. All 3 specs are at the bottom of the list. Welp im not rerolling, im giving up. I am sick of watching blizzard make wild class changes like this for no reason it is beyond frustrating. But hey the two classes at the top are fine so maybe they will keep the mage and druid subscribers, as for me im sick of the nonsense and i am unsubbing.
47 Likes
it’s time to implement the bug as a feature, the only thing that made MM hunters decent. I feel like I lost 20ilvls worth of burst damage in those 18 secs of wild spirits.
13 Likes
It’s astonishing how a PURE DPS CLASS is at the bottom of the barrel in both pvp and pve content. Meanwhile hybrids like paladins, shamans and druid are rocking the charts and are easily the best picks.
25 Likes
Let’s not forget the Paladin Patch from long ago.
1 Like
Marks is literally 6th from the bottom now lmao. Bm and suv are like 5th and 3rd. But please lets buff the top 4 classes some. Like tf is the class design team doing
21 Likes
Did some m+, this nerf was atrocious…
What the FU are they thinking.
Seriously, it feels like i went back 20+ ilvls indeed.
13 Likes
I have an mm alt at 200, am kyrian, and crafted the surging shots leggo. But my AoE burst damage is still insane. Does it get outclassed by a ton of other specs at the +15 range now or something?
Surging shot got buffed, so in a way so did Kyrian hunter in M+. The nerf only affects Night Fae hunter’s covenant ability.
3 Likes
Yes the nerf only affects the pve top dps covenant and the onr that most people play kreezhunt , that is an astute observation. The game is balanced around pve, so naturally I will not be discussing the effects of changes on pvp. To take away 8% of a DECENT pve , m+ , raid class is essentially destroying it. Switching to kyrian and surging shots will not make up for this loss, nor will it retain the aoe burst niche that this class was good for prior to this nerf. This was a change that didnt need to happen, it really qas a well balanced class, that could have even used a buff on pure single target. They have to know where all the classes stand as far as dps output, so with that said how are they looming at the numbers and saying hmm MM hunter needs to lose some damage. Fire mage has ridiculous uncapped aoe as well as balance druid but they nerf marksman. The problem is they do not understand their player base, they don’t listen, and they make really idiotic choices all too often. For example, the “meaningful choice” of youe covenant, effectively making it so a hunter who picks night fae for pve, can really never be competitive in pvp. It seems they do not listen at all, and its really really getting old.
7 Likes
So i see this argument a lot and maybe some context could help?
Based off the warcraft logs site, the gap in average performance from 1-10 is greater than the gap at 10-20.
Additionally, the gap from 3-18, where marksman is, is smaller than the 1-10 gap.
I don’t raid but i like data. This is also the aggregate across all parses. Likely if you are in the worlds cutting edge guild, you might end up in 18th. More likely is that if you play your class well, you will end up a good bit higher in the rankings for your guild.
Another thing to note, is the maximum category shows that MM can outperform at least 10 other classes ahead of them on those rankings.
Think of it this way. If MM were a sprinter, it would likely come in the back of the heat if they were racing olympic sprinters. They are probably leading the pack though against average joe runners.
Not to say there isn’t issue with some of the things they changed, just that your personal experience as a MM hunter is likely not going to reflect what that ranking shows.
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/statistics/26
That same website also shows that MM is still performing quite well in M+ category. That has to count for something right?
2 Likes
So tl;dr: As long as the people you play with are worse players than you, you wont be at the bottom, gotcha.
Also, looking at max ranking isnt really helpful, there is too much weird stuff going on there.
And i dont know at what level you would put your average joe in the dps ranking, but if he is in the middle of the pack then MM would definetly not be leading them. He would still be behind them, but might be a bit faster than the couch potatoe sweating and hyperventilating in the back.
6 Likes
not entirely, but yes that does matter. If you run a 10 second 100 meter dash against olympic sprinters, you will finish last. that same 10 second sprint against average racers will net you a much better outcome.
The gaps between positions are more telling of performance ,than the overall ranking is my point.
If you have a fire mage and balance druid who don’t play the class very well, but you play yours well, that is more likely to affect the rankings at the end. If someone plays their class to average acceptable level, but you are playing yours well, that is more likely the differentiating factor. Not always, but likely.
People want to play to their maximum potential. And that was and still is Night Fae and SST for anything PvE related. They don’t care that something less optimal is now slightly less behind.
Had we had any other option to switch to to alleviate the loss, it wouldn’t have felt anywhere as bad. But they purposely made the changes with the intent of “not changing the meta”. They even nuked the legendary that could have became the alternative (granted that would have introduced a somewhat degenerate play style).
1 Like
M+ statistics in warcraft logs is their version of Rio… it just shows which specs are pushing high keys and how popular they are. Doesn’t show how well a spec is doing.
2 Likes
So, you are saying it’s okie dokey, 'cause if you are a Mythic Progression skill level player, playing in a average joe heroic raiding guild, you will be competitive?
So… what if you are a Mythic player in a Mythic guild, or a average player in a standard AOTC guild? Join a lower level guild?
2 Likes
Here is me acknowledging that there are concerns to be looked at for hunters.
you are trying to skew my words to discount my position because you don’t like what I said.
Objectively if I were looking at just a ranking from 1-24, yes hunter appears to have a larger problem. looking past the initial layer of information, you find that the story isn’t quite as clear. There can’t be a 24 way tie in dps rankings.
What do you think developers look at? opinions on their forums, or statistical data they can use to establish relative power balance across the totality of 24 dps specs?
At least now BM players don’t need to feel pressured to go MM 
13 Likes
Posts a damage analysis from mythic + that shows the hit marksman took, and how poorly it is performing compared to other classes, and says its doing well. Im sorry that you don’t raid guy, but if you did you would have felt what I did this week, which was an immediate loss of dps, and realistically if you are playing with other skilled players, a loss of competitiveness.
1 Like
I was playing BM in 2v2 arenas and while they weren’t the best class, I thought they were doing really good. Could actually beat warrior healer teams most of the time. Excited about the RSPF legendary buff and thought I’d really go somewhere. I don’t know what happened but my damage just went through the floor. Feels like I’m hitting everything with a plastic butter knife now.
Time to unsub, no meaningful new content out anyway.
6 Likes