By queens I meant Anasterian and Kel’thas had mothers that we have never even gotten the names of.
Wasn’t Kael’thas’ mother (I don’t think we ever got a name for her) killed by the Amani or am I confusing him with someone else.
I was not offended by your quote, I just find no value what so ever in someone who feels they have to do feminist re-tellings of fairytales and greek mythology, like I said if you want to tell that sorta of story nothing is stopping you but don’t use more popular works of fiction as a vehicle, clearly you didn’t get past the gender of the characters in order to understand the story.
Still waiting on those misogynistic quotes from misogynists.
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That is absolutely not how you came across. You sounded like you were critical of feminism itself and feminist writers.
I don’t agree with your take, Greek and Roman myth especially, was really sexist. Look at Medea, or Antigone, Cassandra, Iphigenia… the list goes on. Greek and Roman threatre especially played upon angry woman as villians.
I recently read a retelling of the Circe myth from The Odyssey it’s one of my favorite books. There is merit in feminist retelling of fairytales.
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The problem with saying that you shouldn’t change the original myths is that myths, stories, etc, are a product of those who write it, and contains their attitudes. Greek Myths contained negative potrayals of women, which reflected the creators’ atittudes.
This reminds me of the people who didn’t want black Blood Elves because it was lore-breaking. It wasn’t, because of Devi, but even if it was, it would mean the writers did not consider representation.
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You have missed the whole point. It didn’t just fly over your head, you are not even on the same continent.
Only current day feminism, as most of the rhetoric surrounding the movement today reads more like wanting women to be held to higher standard than men and/or that they hate men. I believe in equality not equity.
Most of those who I know (mainly comic book writers) because of reasons listed above.
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They didn’t though. I took Greek and Roman Lit and those were not the attitudes of the times, threatre was used to oppress women. But anyway. If we read Medea through a modern lens she was a foreigner who gave up her family to marry Jason and live in Greece with him. She was treated like an outcast and when the king offered his daughter in marriage to Jason he just left her and thier two kids, she was reasonably heartbroken and angry.
So in revenge she poisioned his new wifes wedding dress and killed herself and her kids leaving him with nothing. It’s a tragedy but Jason was never treated as anything other than the hero of the story.
I guess all Aki and I are asking people is to be mindful of ingrained biases in this media and how it negatively portrays women. Especially angry justified women.
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I was hesitant about saying that because I’m not well-versed in those cultures’ attitudes. I changed it to “creators’ attitudes.”
Does not mean you go around and accuse people of being misogynistic simply because they do not like Sylvanas.
Because THAT is what you are doing, along with Micah. Basically dismissing any actual points people have brought up about why they do not like Sylvanas and simply conclude it is because they are sexist and misogynistic. Because you think you know better and those people (including myself) are lying to ourselves about why we do not like a certain character who happens to be a female.
And for evidence of this,
I think you are the one who needs to wake up.
At the very least you could actually provide some examples from different people of this kind of behavior. So you have some evidence for this “almost” blanket statement the two of you have made up. But you can never truly prove that “most” are in this box you claim they are in.
inb4 I get accused of mansplaining.
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Oh ffs Jaina chose to sacrifice her father because he was stopping her from achieving her goals. She did not choose for MoP to happen, therefore her shift in morality regarding the horde. 1 is an example of her giving something away, that’s why that didn’t break her, the second one is someone taking something from her, that’s what broke her. And before you say “but that’s a sexist trope” no it’s not, most if not all characters who have fallen (excluding the the corrupted by power ones obv) on a dark path have had something taken away from them. Greymane had his son taken away, Gul’dan had his dignity taken away, Varian got split in two, Anduin right now does not have his own will.
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Again, you are too focused on the what that you have not considered the why. It’s not a good faith conversation anymore. You are more concerned with proving something isn’t sexist, rather than entertaining the prospects of the other side. It’s a quick way to get nowhere.
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We point out microagressions all the time and are told we are crazy. Maybe try listening instead of accusing us of over reacting. We all have varrying degrees of internalized misogyny, we live in a patriarchal society.
I thought you were an ally, Denona.
It’s a shame to see your true colours, I thought you were better than this.
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Ok why is it sexist, I trully do not understand it.
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So this justifies your viewpoint that you can go around and accuse random people of being sexist simply because they do not like a character like Sylvanas?
It is weird though that you continue to refuse to provide evidence of people hating Sylvanas simply because she is a female.
Bit rich from someone who is happy to around with their fingers in their ears and scream “MISOGYNIST” at anyone who doesn’t like Sylvanas. Completely ignoring the reasons why, like a lot of people have done in this very thread.
I just don’t like people who think they know better and start randomly accusing people of things they are not. Simply because they don’t agree with you.
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Sylvanas hate can be misogynistic, that much is true, and the playerbase does have an issue with female characters. Women characters tend to be given far less leeway than men, in terms of emotional characterization. We can look at Jaina or Tyrande for that. However, Sylvanas avoids that seemingly due to her ‘hot goth elf’ aspects, with most criticisms being fairly valid.
The misogyny in terms of Sylvanas hate takes on a different form, mostly when in relation to Arthas, and when people want Arthas involved in her punishment. In an attempt to rationalize their dislike of her they try to prop up a male character who has done even worse, which is… pretty bad.
So attributing hatred of her to misogyny is dismissive and disengenuous, though not inaccurate all the time. It’s just a different kind than what we see most of the other major women characters get hit with, which she by and large has escaped for much of her lifespan as a character.
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You are over simplifying what happened today and are missing the point entirely. It’s not about Sylvanas. This was mostly about how people downplay the importance of the NE’s being a matriarchal society.
I’m NE fan too, moron.
Maybe read the thread before you go off next time?
I think you are the one who is getting confused. The parts that I’ve quoted from are parts of this thread that were focused on Sylvanas. I mean the title explains what this thread was meant to be about.
Don’t you dare say, “we are now talking about X, so because you are talking about Y it doesn’t count”.
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The question here is it because they are women or is it because that the current players base is of the opposite faction though? Because I remember Nathanos getting a lot of flack when it was a bit more balanced faction wise in BfA and Legion.
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Maybe understand the context of the posts that I was quoting?
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