And you are still wrong that it is not marie sue, you do not know his masculine, or are you going to come with your hypocrisy of the supposed social construction that trash the new youth?
…Dude I barely understand you.
A character can be a mary sue and actually good still. That’s why I referenced him.
He still learned ridiculously fast how to use the force. Going from a farmer to blowing up the death star with the force in one movie.
That does not mean he’s badly written or a bad character.
Also I havent’ seen the new star wars movies so whatever
Exactly the point SHE made mistakes, SHE messed up. SHE HAS FAULTS, A Mary sue does not have faults. thus, Jaina is not a Mary Sue. You are reinforcing my point that you don’t udnerstand the term and are misusing it.
No it was not a valid excuse, again, she let her emotions cloud her judgment, and she royally messed it up. Her inability to see an obvious reasning lead to her loss of position. Compleatly self inflicted because she HAS FLAWS.
So because she can’t solve all our problems you call her a Mary Sue? Or is it because she was leading one part of a war and ordered her soldiers around that you think she’s a Mary sue?
I disagree, and again FLAWS.
I get it you don’t like Jaina, and thats fine, you don’t have to like her, not everyone does. She’s made some really bad choices and messed up because she handled her greif badly. That makes her human, not a Mary sue.
Can you please write out the definition of Mary Sue for me?
Yes, Sylvanas is too stupid and too much of an idiot to be a mary sue.
She’s literally only alive because blizzard plot armor, and mysterious backend-pulling magical bull-
She really just needs to die off.
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It depends, one thing that we like, but another thing that is only for a single audience that does not care about its plot, and in fact the rest hate it, bore it, and abhor it.
First of all, if you wanted to compare Luke as Marie sue, it’s wrong.
Female = Marie sue
Male = Gary Stu
And that did not include his physical condition as everyone blames in the case of Arnold Schwarzenegger, but the thing that as he solves it or in the case of the phrase I am Batman.
And it’s not even a reason for envy, because I accept heroes like the bride in Kill Bill or Sarah Connor in Terminator 2 that if they are true female heroes, but when they wanted to do this chemistry they really failed.
and in case of WoW I don’t know what Blizzard thought, it’s fine as it is loved and hated at the same time, but they changed their chemistry that was seen in Warcraft 3 and early WoW.
This plot of perfect characters is fine, but you have to be very careful when mentioning them, and Jaina and Sylvanas did not give that emotion that it should be.
Yes, yes she it’s I repeat again.
No one from the Kirin’tor council told her of her flaws, only she refused to work with the horde in the middle of a great invasion, is what she did.
for what? If not, we can not face it to define without cheating, rather take this wikipedia and leave me peace
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Sue
In any case, I already knew it, otherwise I would not be here answering the reason why Jaina and Sylvanas are Marie Sue and at the same time I was asking or seeing this article that there is link her.
Oh for fricks sake it’s the same bloody thing
Dude why are you talking about a physique? Not all mary sues are scultped Adonis figures
Your responses are all over the place
so that’s what I wanted it to be properly. 
but they blame more or focus on that, knowing that these characters had more problems than they had to solve, showing that they are also weak mortals, that is what the plot did.
But even so I do not understand why the community considers him Gary Stu only for his athletic body, knowing that it is not the point of his plot.
This person has been trolling hard lately, right down the most embarrassing display of grammar I’ve seen in a while. (They said they “don’t type well”, but I’m not sure that excuses lack of shift key use and basic punctuation - one of my guildies is dyslexic and one lives in Mexico with English as his second language, but both are more than capable of typing properly, save the occasional typo.)
On topic, she’s 800% a Mary Sue. Incredible power leaps with no explanation (even the OP is simply speculating), still has a group of followers who see no wrong in her, has her Jon Snow (hopefully it ends the same way, muh Queen), wins at all the things, effortlessly deletes a situation if she seems to not be winning which happened like… once. If I speculate, I too can explain it away. But with the evidence we are canonically given, there are a LOT of missing, crucial details. It’s bad story telling, and definitely makes her look very Mary Sue-ish.
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So I can break it down and explain to you exactly why she isn’t using your own accepted definition. And getting on with that.
A Mary Sue is a generic name for any fictional character who is so competent or perfect that this appears absurd, even in the context of the fictional setting.
She is a very skilled mage, which has been aknoledged and built up on, her powers have growen over the course of the game, and even still she is not the best or the most powerful mage. Her skills are reasonable for the setting, And she is FAR from perfect, even by your own words, “she refused to work with the horde in the middle of a great invasion, is what she did.” As one example. And there are many more, she has made a lot of bad choices, that is an undeniable fact.
Mary Sues are often an author’s self-insertion or wish fulfillment
I do not see any evidence of this, atall.
They may excel at tasks that should not be possible for them, or they may upstage the protagonist of a fictional setting, such as by saving them.
She only execells at tasks that are established to be her feild of experties, aka, magic. We don’t se her going toe to toe with the likes of Saurfang in melee combat, as that would be something that should not be possible for her. I guess she has had moments where she upstaged the protagonist, but that is the nature of the game, all big NPCs will have their moments to shine, she hasn’ had more than, lets say, Thrall, or Anduin. And there have been times when we have had to save her in return.
Basically, to sum it up, a Mary Sue is an overly perfect character with no flaws who comes across as a self insert from a fanfiction and not a genuine human character. This is NOT the case for Jaina, atall, she has weaknesses and strengths, highs and lows, good traits and bad traits, she is a multi faceted character.
and you have not realized that to hide a Marie sue, you put defects or disasters to avoid that she is not perfect?
you have to think twice about that, and with saying She is a very skilled mage better than Khadgar, better than Aegwin, better than Medivh, undermining everything to say her teacher, more than Antoninas, it is the same as happened with Batman and kill his parents.
It is now a way to hide a Marie sue.
She is NOT better than Khadgar, Aegwin or Medivh, and that has never been said or even implied. She’s not even better than Antoninas, she still looks up to him as a better mage than she is. She is a very powerful mage, but not the best.
And the thing about Jaina’s disasters are that most of the time, they are a result of her own actions. Because she is NOT perfect.
Yes, yes she it’s 
I think some of the issue with sylvanas is she gets away with just a scratch on her face. Sure she loses the support of the horde. But I think her defeat would have been better if she was more wounded. Because at least then she has an excuse for getting more power from her sugar daddy.
Having her peace away with barely anything different to her just feels like a giant “screw you” to the players. It’s not even a good narrative screw you.
Having her possibly terrified she’s about to die and begging the jailer for power would have at least shown us that she’s selling even more of herself to get what she wants just to further her own goals. There’s not even a little teaser of the jailer outside of “the hungering darkness” or whatever the heck she says. It would have been waaaaaaay better story wise if we had maybe the jailer talk off camera as sylvanas is pleading for more power. Something to connect to Rastakhan pleading to Bwonsamdi.
Imagine if the last time we see her she’s beaten but then she’s fine in the shadowlands trailer. Showing the viewer that she got the power she wanted and that we should actually be intimidated
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It’s all explained.
A mary sue would have abilities, power or status that wasn’t earned or explained. Her abilities and power and status are all explained, step… by step… by step.
You might not like that she’s as powerful as she is, but she isn’t a Mary Sue. By your likening, any female character that has any strength would be a Mary Sue, and this is pretty absurd.
Another characteristic of a Mary Sue is garnering respect, love and accolades without effort and generally when it’d be unrealistic to present these affections or gifts to said character. Everyone in the world hates Sylvanas, and even before her turn against the Horde was treated pretty poorly, or at least with some level of disdain.
I understand people have a hard time with the term “Mary Sue”, but, all you need to know is that I’m right about this. 
Now, can I get a bunch of angry teenagers to upvote this post? Oh, wait that’s not how the internet works.
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Since when?
since MoP… she still asks, she doesn’t even know who she’s praising …
It can be, as long as that is meaningless, but at the same time neither, because it does not need to be loved or hated to sweep everything that is faced or not.
Because I haven’t eaten the question, why did she become so powerful? How she’s does defeat the new lich king? To know that with Bolvar or Arthas it was not like that, in any case it is one of the reasons that it was because it is a Marie Sue, and I hope not to see this formula in the next expansion.
although in the opening … 
Thats funny, I don’t remember any part of MoP where they said “Jaina is stronger than Khadgar!” And yet, we’ve been showen he’s far more capable than she is, Khadgar beat Deathwing in the second war, she hasn’t done anything even close to that.
Seems like you’re just making it up with no factual evidence.
Multiple ways.
- She’s like 400 years old, at least.
- She, in life was a trained military leader.
- Arthas imbued her with undead abilities, she being revived as a Banshee.
- She’s entered into a sort of faustian pact with the Jailer.
So, it’s understandable that she would be pretty strong.
Edit: Oh, and the dagger and probably other sources I’m simply not thinking of.
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focus iris plz, she got stronger than Sargeras plz, she purged like her boyfriend.
while she was listening to this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5c-rd-SBNxYLol, he is not. What makes you say that?