Sylvanas fans: Would you approve of her methods IRL?

Lore Story Forum
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Do you think you got what it takes to survive the trials?

“When enraged, and in heat, a female troll can mate over 80 times in one night. BE YOU PREPARED?!?!” - Troll /flirt

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Dying because I tried to go the distance with my giant orc spouse and ended up lost in the sauce is not a bad way to go out, considering if this was medieval fantasy IRL I’d probably get killed by some elf in a metal thong or dragon or zombie clam invasion in a few months anyway.

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Wait. Are you implying that I’ve wasted the past six months of my life gathering Black Bear tongues in the hope that someone might give me five bucks and a new pair of boots?

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Her path is justifiable if it’s on the brink of war. See, Thrall was balancing it. Vol’jin as well, but Legion, her act of retreat was seen as a betrayal in Alliance’s eyes, leaving Varian their King dead.

She’s not exactly friendly with Anduin, so it’s either to act first or act late to regret. But having said that, I don’t like her methods (probably why Saurfang/Baine reacts). Her methods at Wrath gate was already extreme.

Let’s not forget, she was a hero changed a mindless undead by Arthas. Her crazy actions are not surprising. In RL, I wouldn’t approve if I’m on other side of the fence. In game, there’s 2 choices, 1 crazy boss against whole of Azeroth or 1 crazy faction leader. Someone has to be a bad guy & she has the best votes. Anduin will be too forceful.

See, Garrosh transform himself to be a war monger. Syl was transformed to be one.

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If you were doing that without a permit, you can probably get yourself a nice pair of cuffs at least.

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Anything but mindless. Arthas left her completely conscious of her actions but unable to defy his will. She was essentially an aware and awake prisoner in her own spirit.

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Nothing the Alliance has done* has warranted the War of Thorns or the torching of Teldrassil.

The gymnastics that her fans here go through to justify her actions, or contest arguments against her is just laughable.

*Blame Blizzard for writing the Alliance poorly/ambiguously since their aggression has been portrayed really weakly/poorly.

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Saurfang and Sylvanas were written as characters who disagree with that statement. Saurfang even tells Tyrande that it was necessary for the Horde.

Since you mention writers.

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What a strange thread. So many replies from so many people seem to be pretending what we think and feel about fiction isn’t informed by the same background that dictates what we think and feel about real life. Not all. I’m on board with the crowd saying they like characters that are good for a story even if they’re not morally good. But those posts, the ones that would look at the Path of Glory and condemn the orcs while also loving the orcs as a fantasy race, almost read as if they want to shelter the other kind of poster who wants to insist the draenei actually had it coming and genocide is okay because its fiction.

Is it really so hard to say “Genocide is bad and I love the faction that’s doing it.”? I get a lot of people are more or less saying this. This is not @ them. I just get exhausted being in this crowd but also being more or less lumped with the weirdos who want to drag moral equivalence, whataboutism, and other junk in to try and justify Team Red’s actions. Justification in those cases seems to really clearly be born from some pretty weird IRL line blurring. As baity as this thread is, I get where some of the OP is coming from.

These forums can be pretty gross at times.

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I care nothing for the genocide of pixels and would actually encourage it if it made a great story.

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Sylvannas sold the war to Saurfang her big skeptic on the basis of what the Alliance WOULD do if they got an advantage and used past behavior as evidence.

Mr. Honor Horde was all in the program right up to the point of securing the ENTIRE OBJECTIVE of the War of Thorns, the death of Malfurion Stormrage.

His refusal to do that one act assigned to him pretty much made the entire purpose of the War irrelevant, wasted every Horde life spent in the overrun of Ashenvale and Darkshore.

Now do you as the fricking Warchief of the Horde simply write off that investment, or do you go for a victory point as horriffic as it might be, but gets the objective done? The neutralisation of Teldrassil as a strategic Alliance supply point for a Kalimdor campaign?

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We as the fricking witnesses of the Warchief’s internal monologues, word of God, book narration, and general tone of the over arching narrative, know that this was not at all the entire purpose of the war. We know Sylvanas’ greed and blood lust was the purpose of the war and the death of Malfurion was a bread crumb. A tangential one at that. Why conflate her after the fact justifications given to someone not in the know of the information we are privy to, with the truth? To what end? What do you get from this sort of spread of misinformation?

Horde lives have been spent on Sylvanas’ dime. No one else’s.

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I’d occupy it and use it and Orgrimmar as hammer and anvil to crush Alliance control of northern Kalimdor and paint it Horde red. My opinion btw of Sylvanas as a warmonger has not shifted, either. Which is something I’ve noticed pro-Sylvanas arguments try to brush off.

FWIW, if the maghar-Lightforged story preceded BFA, the justification of the war would have been a thousand times better.

I will concede though that your post (if this is BtS stuff) really makes Saurfang look bad.

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We as the fricking witnesses of the Warchief’s internal monologues, word of God, book narration, and general tone of the over arching narrative, know that this was not at all the entire purpose of the war. We know Sylvanas’ greed and blood lust was the purpose of the war and the death of Malfurion was a bread crumb. A tangential one at that. Why conflate her after the fact justifications given to someone not in the know of the information we are privy to, with the truth? To what end? What do you get from this sort of spread of misinformation?

Horde lives have been spent on Sylvanas’ dime. No one else’s.

So I don’t know what to believe anymore. I thought it was all the outside texts, tweets, sources that justify the WoT, Baine’s alleged Alliance sympathy. But now I am hearing this is not the case and that what I am seeing is accurate?

:confused:

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If you’re hunting for “original sin” to answer the question “What cause are Zappy Bois fighting and dying for overseas?” the answer is, bluntly, because Sylvanas has aspirations for subjugating Stormwind in undeath. This is stated explicitly by word of God narration providing the reader with insight into what Sylvanas and Nathanos are thinking.

There is more to it. She no doubt believes that is the right path to take next because she thinks its a foregone conclusion that peace between certain races can never be possible. There’s lots of trappings to it all but that is the root.

If you want to dig deeper? Maybe find the parent that root was a cutting from? You’ll get arguments on these forums digging back to Genn attacking Sylvanas in Stormheim. And then you’ll get people pointing out he did that because Sylvanas attacked Genn in Gilneas. And then you’ll get the weirdos crawling out of the woodworks telling you the Forsaken conquest of the Eastern Kingdoms was okay because some ambassadors were killed back when nobody knew zombies could think and still had trust issues over the last time zombies got into a town and Lordaeron subsequently fell.

And then someone’s gonna come in and say this is all Humanity’s fault because Arthas did it. And then someone’s gonna say nah its the orcs because Arthas was the servant of Ner’zhul. AND THEN someone is gonna say its really the Legion and we should all get along now that they’re gone.

The real answer is Sargeras was right. Life needs a good scouring so we can starve the void and start over.

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Why do posts like these never quote all these boob-loving, laughable fanboys, if there’s so many of them? Surely an example for us all to chuckle at would highlight the point.

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I’m not in the hobby of tracking down every bit of information coming from odd sources. My main sources of information are the two Thorns War novellas, the ingame cinematics and the other novellas published on the Blizzard site which includes the private story of Sylvannas’ suiicide attempt and what came afterward. Now if contrary information is coming from sources that are only available commercially, than what we see are the inevitable results when you have two different writing teams that are obviously not in communication with each other and not being overseen by someone at Blizzard whose job should be to keep things consistent.

And I’ve got better things to do than to stress out of it.

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Kind of passive aggressive but okay.

Can’t speak for Aurael, and my position is fairly different from his; for myself, the arguments are overwhelming enough to provide. Heck, at this point, it has devolved to meme status since the war has been discussed ad nauseum since BFA was announced.

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Really? Maybe we’re seeing different threads. When I browse the forums, I see repeated questions of Sylvanas supporters that are all answered consistently and articulately - the base of players who want her to triumph generally acknowledge her crimes but have reasonable concerns and desires that align with her as a character and story entity.

Contrary to the idea that the irrationality of Sylvanas supporters being ‘meme’ status, I’m sure the forums are instead tired of the opposite. People coming here to demand an explanation for Sylvanas’ support only for us to drag out the same sourced, reasoned positions as always is the tired trope, not the other way around.

The other tired trope is people who assert that the support for Sylvanas is baseless while declining to engage with either the many discussions to the contrary or to provide examples of what they are trying to mock.

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Yeah, definitely. I don’t see that at all; I see overwhelming criticism of anyone who protests her actions, diminishment of the magnitude of her crimes, and identification with what the Forsaken were first sold as as a justification for whatever she has done and will do. Oh, and this weird thing I saw the other day where support for Sylvanas is now some sort of kneejerk tantrum against bad writing. That was odd, but whatever.

Throw in the usual forum wankery/posturing for good measure, though I cannot blame anyone for an excess of that; as I said, everyone is tired of talking about the same things at this point.

FWIW, Verisimae’s last post before this one sums my thoughts on the matter.

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